To think my mum has a form of agoraphobia?

[inigomontoyahwillcox]

My parents live about 250 miles away from me, I live close to where I grew up (moved here with DH and DD 13 years ago), they live up north where we moved when I was in my teens. Their journey to ours is a 3 train journey. They are in their early 80s (81/82) but in good health for their age.

We moved here 11 years ago and they have visited once, which was when I almost died due to a serious medical event back in 2018 - even then it took them 10 days or so to come down, and I'm not joking when I say I nearly died (it was a resus/ICU job).

Over the years since then I cannot remember the amount of times my dad has queried whether we would like a visit from them at some point in X month, of course I say yes, but every single time I either never hear anything more of it or when I enquire when the month in question is coming up I'm told of a variety of reasons why they won't be coming by mum, such as having a dentist/doctor appointment or she is feeling under the weather.

I, of course, go to see them when I can, but this hasn't been for a good while now as every time I suggest we or I come up, my dad says "oh, we were thinking of coming down to you then actually", that doesn't happen of course and I can't make last minute arrangements to go up when I was originally intending (job, kids, other obligations) so we just don't see each other!

The driver in all of this is VERY much my mother. They had intended on coming down in September, then decided that, as they were also intending on coming to us at Christmas, they wouldn't. Last night on the phone when I mentioned Christmas to my mum she gave me a variety of non-committal responses such as "I can't think of that at the moment as my tummy is playing up" and "it's very complicated getting down to you" (it isn't - it's a train journey and me collecting them from the station). So I know, with 99% certainty that they won't come down. I've explained that it's been 6 years now, she said there's always a reason why they can't, I said they aren't going to get any younger or less infirm (I use the word loosely, they aren't infirm at this stage), no real response to that. It's becoming quite hurtful and also sad for them as their whole life revolves around their small town - which has dwindling friends in it as they pass away or move away (to be closer to family ironically).

About 15 years ago mum was mugged on her own street, they didn't manage to get her handbag but they did fracture her shoulder. It must have been a terrifying experience for her. I'm wondering if she hasn't psychologically recovered from that and that she is suffering from some form of agoraphobia? I doubt she would ever acknowledge she had a problem or seek help for it - but her's and dad's lives are being severely limited and they are becoming isolated due to her apparent inability to leave their home town.

Do you think I am way off the mark here? Any words of wisdom?

I, of course, go to see them when I can, but this hasn't been for a good while now as every time I suggest we or I come up, my dad says "oh, we were thinking of coming down to you then actually" I unfortunately have quite a bit of experience with agoraphobia. It’s not always solely a fear of being away from home. Very often, it’s accompanied by a general anxiety around seeing people as well. And I know that you’re their daughter, not just some random person, but that can sometimes make it harder. Your conversations with your dad immediately made me think that they’re trying to keep you away from the house. Now that might be just because your mum struggles with dealing with people face to face, or having people in ‘her’ space. Or it might be that they’re struggling to cope with their home now that they’re older and they don’t want you to know. But I strongly suspect that if you made plans to go up there, they might find an excuse to cancel. Especially if you were planning on bringing your DH and/or any children with you.

I think you have the option of talking to your dad and asking him if your mum is struggling with the journey, or being so far away from home, or being surrounded by other people, because you’re starting to think they don’t want to see you anymore. He might open up to you and explain what the issue is.

Or you go up by yourself one weekend, book yourself into a hotel and turn up at the door with a big bunch of flowers, so they haven’t got a chance to panic, or cancel. This is an utterly shit thing to do to someone with agoraphobia and may well result in a panic attack of epic proportions, and if they were younger, I’d very much advise against it, but if you’re worried there’s an underlying reason why you’re not seeing them, this might be the only way of finding out. But then you need to be prepared for what you’re going to do with that information. If they aren’t coping, are you willing/able to sort out help for them? If it’s agoraphobia, will you accept that it’s likely to always be there, in the background, and that she might not want to change?

It might also be they struggle to host.

@dandelionandbirdcock

It’s hurtful for my DH because it’s like she doesn’t want to see him, although they talk regularly on the phone. and she sees lots of other people and has friends locally. We’re a bit baffled I think it might be because it’s a big thing. A big event. Seeing other people and friends locally is part of her routine. If she’s feeling calm, she can meet with someone for a cup of tea and put a mask on for however long she’s with them, and if she’s not, she can plaster a smile on and just wave, telling them she’s dashing off to do something or see someone. It’s harder to do that with someone who isn’t part of that routine, no matter how much you love them and want to see them. It requires more than just a 30 second chit chat. And also, she might have friends who are happy to take the lead and chat away, and all she needs to do is add the occasional ‘really?’ It doesn’t take much from her. And I expect she had a wonderful time when you saw her, but I’d be willing to bet that she was utterly exhausted by the time you left.

It’s not an easy thing to see in a loved one.

I think its very difficult to understand what it's like to be 30 years older than yourself. An 80 something is not a 50 something, regardless of whether they have diagnosed health conditions or are 'infirm' for their age, so what may not seem a big deal to you may be very daunting to your mum. Obviously some 80 somethings are full of vitality and confidence, but for others the thought of negotiating stations and trains and staying away from their own home is not appealing. Add a few even minor health problems to the mix, aches and pains, a dodgy stomach, and some people are simply more comfortable not doing it. A bit like many middle aged people, even fit and healthy ones might baulk at the thought of backpacking or festival camping, and their DC might not be able to understand that! I think all you can do is accept and try not to project on to your mum your idea of what constitutes a 'good life'. She may be perfectly happy never leaving her small town again.

Is it something about staying away from home, rather than the travelling? My DPs are a bit younger than yours but not by much, and I’ve started to encounter resistance to coming to visit us, especially from my DF. They still holiday regularly and extensively, including abroad, so it definitely isn’t just about being away from home.

Reading between the lines, some of it is because we don’t have a dedicated spare room (we had the nerve to have a second child 😬). I have offered to give up our room for them if he’s finding the sofa bed difficult (we have a king-size sofa bed with an actual mattress) but that hasn’t changed anything.

I think on some level they just prefer feeling in control and knowing things will be the way they like them, and my dad can’t easily slope off to potter and avoid the DCs here in the way that he can in his own home.

Sorry, I’m rambling, but I suppose what I’m trying to say is, I wouldn’t waste too much time trying to identify the blockers as the acknowledged blocker may not be the actual problem, if you see what I mean. I would just acknowledge you need to go to them and be quite firm about setting a date for that, and allow them to prevaricate about whether/when they’ll next come to you.

I think this is it.

I am 44 and I have health issues so I imagine I’m pretty much similar to someone older with no health issues and I can’t imagine being okay with all that faffing about. It’s a lot to cope with. My own dd is 22 and currently lives in her university town 3 hours away and I’ve made it very clear that if she settles there long term I won’t be travelling to hers. That’s harsh but it’s the reality for me, it’s just too much.

You’re the one who moved, I think it’s unfair to expect your parents to make the journey.

My great aunt stopped going very far due to incontinence issues and anxiety associated with that.

This 😊 I turned 50 this year, and I'm not keen on travelling! There's nothing wrong with me 😂 no anxiety or illness, I just like doing what makes me happy. I've did a bunch of sunshine holidays and city breaks over the years, now though I just like being at home. I stay in a beautiful coastal town, lots of lovely restaurants nearby (we frequent at least once a week 😂) and little coffee shops. I only go into the city for shopping trips and to the theatre, gigs and such like.

So no, it's not necessarily an age thing! I think its more an expectation thing - ie if someone isn't meeting your expectations, then adjust your expectations! We all do things under duress/obligation sometimes (visits, nights out etc), more often than we admit, and I just got to a stage where I decided I was going to say no more!

I’m only 60 and hate long train journeys not helped by IBD and unpredictable mobility issues - lugging even a small case between taxi and platform - worse if I have to change trains
I drive everywhere as I can stop whenever I need to
I live 300 miles away from some of my friends and family in a city I used to live in. It would be impossible for me to manage!
I often drive 1/2 way and stop off for a night somewhere on way there and back
As you’ve said I would just have the conversation with them and kindly say you’ve noticed that whilst the intention to visit is there - there’s far too many reasons it never happens and in future due to this and their age you will always visit them - sounds like your DM might be relieved at this

I'm not pressuring them! I say nothing about them visiting us until my father suggests they come in, for example, September, or Christmas and can I keep my diary free.

Yes, we've offered multiple times when they've started pulling back from their arrangements, DH and I would happily do the round trip, but they keep on saying "we can't expect you to do that", I insist it's not a problem, but they're adamant.

Not really, not any more. They're very active in the local (rural) area - long hikes etc. but rarely travel any further.

My father lived a similar distance and only visited my home six times in 30 years (when my mum died). All his children lived near here (including six grandchildren) but he chose to stay in the place where he retired to. We visited him but I always felt sad that I couldn’t share my house and garden with him and that he had no idea about our everyday lives. He died in 2020 and I often wonder if he had regrets but he seemed to enjoy being on his own in his own space so probably not.

I think maybe I need to have a conversation with them about drawing a line under the idea of them visiting and saying that I acknowledge that you may not want to travel to us, for whatever reason, but let's stop pretending that you're coming down (that sounds harsh - I would word it much nicer!).

The thing is that my father really does want to come down, and makes plans with me on the phone about what he wants to do. They don't really go anywhere without the other so I doubt he'd come on his own.

Apologies, pressure was the wrong word, gentle persuasion perhaps (you said in your OP you told your Mum it had been 6 years, and that she wasn't getting any younger in terms of being 'able' to visit).

I think you need to just broach it, tell your parents you understand if they (your Mum) don't want to travel, but please just be straight with you. Tell them you just want the offering/inevitable cancelling to stop.

Thanks @SassK - I get it, I did put some pressure on in that conversation I guess, but that was the first time I'd ever said anything to mum. I had recently commented to dad that I thought mum was struggling and he was surprised I thought that - I think because he lives in his own world and heavily relies on her, so the thought of anything being wrong with her sends him into a spiral so he sticks his head in the sand.