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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to expect GP surgeries to implement the NHS pay uplift?

50 replies

SmallSoupcon · 16/11/2024 09:20

My husband is an HCP working for a GP surgery (not a Dr, but he treats patients).

He's been hearing from NHS colleagues in other services about their government-issued pay uplift, backdated to April. However, there's no sign of it being applied at his surgery, despite very strong government guidelines that it should be.

He and several colleagues have emailed the partners but are being stonewalled. We obviously know surgeries are run as businesses so face different financial pressures to large trusts, but it seems grossly unfair to not even discuss it.

Are we being unreasonable to expect GP practices to pass this money on to their employees?

OP posts:
MontagueLeo · 16/11/2024 09:40

If they could afford the pay rise, the partners would have offered it. Practice incomes are static or even falling at a time of rapidly rising costs.

Would your husband consider looking for a job in secondary care?

Faffertea · 16/11/2024 09:49

It’s not unreasonable for him to want to have it but it may not be as simple as you seem to think that the partners are just choosing not to or keeping the money to themselves. The pay uplifts recommended are not matched by an increase in funding into GP practices so the partners will be looking at whether/how they can implement it without potentially having to reduce services or staff in other areas. Add in the recent announcement about NI rises and the apparent insistence that GP practices are not NHS and therefore won’t be reimbursed has left many practices uncertain about their financial future and whether they will be able to run at all. I would suggest he speaks to the Practice Manager too.

(I’m a GP partner)

SmallSoupcon · 16/11/2024 09:57

@Faffertea I don't know what the partners are thinking as they won't respond, nor will the Practice Manager. You say there isn't funding for the pay uplift, but we've been advised by Unison it is funded?

"NHS England has confirmed that the GP contract will be amended to increase the pay elements by 6%, consisting of a further 4% in addition to the 2% already included in contract funding at the start of 2024/2025."

OP posts:
Wakeywake · 16/11/2024 09:57

Maybe if the government pulled their finger out and compensated GP surgeries for the NI increase, and increased their funding per patient, they'd be able to afford the salary increase.

SmallSoupcon · 16/11/2024 10:00

MontagueLeo · 16/11/2024 09:40

If they could afford the pay rise, the partners would have offered it. Practice incomes are static or even falling at a time of rapidly rising costs.

Would your husband consider looking for a job in secondary care?

Not necessarily. The partners at this practice aren't particularly supportive of their team, or business-minded. But he's a Primary Care practitioner, and leaving his job isn't an option.

OP posts:
SmallSoupcon · 16/11/2024 10:02

Wakeywake · 16/11/2024 09:57

Maybe if the government pulled their finger out and compensated GP surgeries for the NI increase, and increased their funding per patient, they'd be able to afford the salary increase.

Maybe, but this is directly funded by the government. It's the partners who are choosing not to pass it on, even though they've been strongly advised to.

OP posts:
LittleBearPad · 16/11/2024 10:03

Pay increases can’t always be implemented if other costs are increasing, which they are.

Girliefriendlikespuppies · 16/11/2024 10:04

This is part of the reason I wouldn't work for a GP surgery, you have none of the benefits of being an nhs employee.

Your husband isn't being unreasonable, but if I was him I'd look for an nhs job 🤷‍♀️

UncharteredWaters · 16/11/2024 10:07

This depends on 2 things:

1 - is it in his contract? If so he’s legally entitled, if not then he has no entitlement as he is not an nhs employee on their t&cs despite providing nhs services. Most people aren’t aware of this.

2 - it has not been funded properly. The % that unison are talking about only covers part of the pay rise and not the increase in employers pension etc that has to be paid by the practice. So there may not be money to pay it.

Unfortunately it also sets precedent for future years when the gov may not find it again. There is also the NI increase hitting practices who can’t charge patients so where does the money come from?

UncharteredWaters · 16/11/2024 10:08

Girliefriendlikespuppies · 16/11/2024 10:04

This is part of the reason I wouldn't work for a GP surgery, you have none of the benefits of being an nhs employee.

Your husband isn't being unreasonable, but if I was him I'd look for an nhs job 🤷‍♀️

This!!
Most people don’t realise this. And didn’t negotiate these nhs perks in their contract.

Tryingtokeepgoing · 16/11/2024 10:27

SmallSoupcon · 16/11/2024 10:02

Maybe, but this is directly funded by the government. It's the partners who are choosing not to pass it on, even though they've been strongly advised to.

Perhaps because the NI increase imposed by the government has not been funded, and so in order to afford that they are cutting / not paying on the funded increase?

The money for Reeves’ catastrophic budget for growth and employment (both revised down massively since it was announced) has to come from somewhere. A lot (most?) of the private sector will be seeing lower salaries than they would otherwise have had as a direct result, as well as higher costs and mortgage rates have increased, as will inflation.

SmallSoupcon · 16/11/2024 10:33

UncharteredWaters · 16/11/2024 10:07

This depends on 2 things:

1 - is it in his contract? If so he’s legally entitled, if not then he has no entitlement as he is not an nhs employee on their t&cs despite providing nhs services. Most people aren’t aware of this.

2 - it has not been funded properly. The % that unison are talking about only covers part of the pay rise and not the increase in employers pension etc that has to be paid by the practice. So there may not be money to pay it.

Unfortunately it also sets precedent for future years when the gov may not find it again. There is also the NI increase hitting practices who can’t charge patients so where does the money come from?

Yes, he's an NHS employee. This was all going on before the budget and NI became a factor.
I'm not saying NI isn't a concern for businesses, I'm a business owner myself, but the partners were already stonewalling the team before November. If there was some financial transparency and a conversation, it would help working relations massively. The silent approach is just creating problems, which isn't good for anyone.

OP posts:
SmallSoupcon · 16/11/2024 11:01

Tryingtokeepgoing · 16/11/2024 10:27

Perhaps because the NI increase imposed by the government has not been funded, and so in order to afford that they are cutting / not paying on the funded increase?

The money for Reeves’ catastrophic budget for growth and employment (both revised down massively since it was announced) has to come from somewhere. A lot (most?) of the private sector will be seeing lower salaries than they would otherwise have had as a direct result, as well as higher costs and mortgage rates have increased, as will inflation.

This was an issue before the November budget. Not sure what mortgages have to do with the surgery, other than life being tougher for employees!

OP posts:
SmallSoupcon · 16/11/2024 11:03

Girliefriendlikespuppies · 16/11/2024 10:04

This is part of the reason I wouldn't work for a GP surgery, you have none of the benefits of being an nhs employee.

Your husband isn't being unreasonable, but if I was him I'd look for an nhs job 🤷‍♀️

Sadly his job doesn't really exist outside GP-land.

OP posts:
Commoncold · 16/11/2024 11:05

SmallSoupcon · 16/11/2024 10:33

Yes, he's an NHS employee. This was all going on before the budget and NI became a factor.
I'm not saying NI isn't a concern for businesses, I'm a business owner myself, but the partners were already stonewalling the team before November. If there was some financial transparency and a conversation, it would help working relations massively. The silent approach is just creating problems, which isn't good for anyone.

Unless he's employed by a trust and the GP surgery pays them for his services then no, he isn't an NHS employee. GP surgeries are private businesses.

everywomansshoes · 16/11/2024 11:09

OP - he is either employed by the NHS or the Practice - he can't be both in one role.
He can be an NHS employee and work within the Practice.

Having said that it's crap the Partners and PM aren't responding, there's some very tough conversations to be had.

LittleBearPad · 16/11/2024 11:10

SmallSoupcon · 16/11/2024 10:33

Yes, he's an NHS employee. This was all going on before the budget and NI became a factor.
I'm not saying NI isn't a concern for businesses, I'm a business owner myself, but the partners were already stonewalling the team before November. If there was some financial transparency and a conversation, it would help working relations massively. The silent approach is just creating problems, which isn't good for anyone.

Is his employment contract with the NHS or the practice?

Orangebadger · 16/11/2024 11:16

One big downside to working for GPs and the reason I am in secondary care not primary. Sorry no advice but my sympathies for your DH. It sucks. Primary care needs a big overall for many reasons one of them being becoming an attractive option to work in, the financial benefits just don't compete with the NHS for reasons exactly like this.

Searchingforthelight · 16/11/2024 11:19

SmallSoupcon · 16/11/2024 09:20

My husband is an HCP working for a GP surgery (not a Dr, but he treats patients).

He's been hearing from NHS colleagues in other services about their government-issued pay uplift, backdated to April. However, there's no sign of it being applied at his surgery, despite very strong government guidelines that it should be.

He and several colleagues have emailed the partners but are being stonewalled. We obviously know surgeries are run as businesses so face different financial pressures to large trusts, but it seems grossly unfair to not even discuss it.

Are we being unreasonable to expect GP practices to pass this money on to their employees?

I'm not a GP but from what I hear there is no money to 'pass on' to fund this.
Nothing has been given to the GP practices to fund this.
The government is still funding rubbish like the Arse scheme (ARRS)

Searchingforthelight · 16/11/2024 11:21

SmallSoupcon · 16/11/2024 10:02

Maybe, but this is directly funded by the government. It's the partners who are choosing not to pass it on, even though they've been strongly advised to.

I don't believe this is the case

SmallSoupcon · 16/11/2024 11:29

Searchingforthelight · 16/11/2024 11:21

I don't believe this is the case

Based on what evidence? The government is giving the money to practices, which is on public record.

OP posts:
SmallSoupcon · 16/11/2024 11:30

Birdseyetrifle · 16/11/2024 11:26

https://managementinpractice.com/news/gps-are-expected-to-award-full-6-pay-rise-to-practice-staff-nhs-england-has-said/

This might answer some of these questions. They might be a private practice but it’s NHS funded with NHS pensions etc.

Thank you. Yes, they're a bit of an anomaly!

OP posts:
SmallSoupcon · 16/11/2024 11:38

LittleBearPad · 16/11/2024 11:10

Is his employment contract with the NHS or the practice?

The surgery, with some NHS terms and entitlements included.

OP posts: