To be a bit fed up of the anti child sentiment on here?

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To clarify - I’m absolutely not talking about the childfree board and think it’s fine and good for women to be able to talk openly about not wanting children. This also isn’t a TAAT but just a general observation of attitudes on mumsnet that seem unnecessarily hostile to pregnant women and new mums in particular and seem a bit surprising given the origins of mumsnet as a parenting site.

Examples range from complaints of any benefits that benefit children only to calling pregnant women who expect special adjustments entitled / precious, repeated calls of PFB for new mums who might need help or accommodations from those around them, complaints about children acting their developmental age in public spaces, constant hen / wedding dramas (where it is entitled to both want to bring your baby or to want to stay with them - the only acceptable option is to leave them it seems). It is often deemed wrong and selfish to leave your baby but also to bring them to public spaces (and expect people to show an interest in them) but also wrong to not socialise with friends as before! I genuinely don’t know what some posters want of mums.

I’ve genuinely really rarely encountered any of these beliefs in the real world across several countries and cities with a baby / toddler. In general, people are really helpful and most are quite keen to interact with my toddler (although I obviously never force them on anyone!).

I completely understand that some people have zero interest in spending time with children but surely extending courtesy and support to more vulnerable people is part of living in a society? Particularly a society which does actually rely on some people choosing to have children to keep on going …

I also accept I might just be reading the wrong threads!

I think that there is a balance of opinions on most threads but if your bias goes in one direction then you will notice and be irritated more by those who have the opposite opinion. If you ask for a group of randomers to give an opinion anonymously you will always get a huge spread with the extremes at both ends of the bell curve, these are not usually the majority though.

i interpret most of what you are observing as a certain style of parenting. It’s a more hands-off, less attached approach that I don’t see practiced IRL very often, but that does exist. I find it an extremely odd approach and sometimes wonder how it can even work. I suspect these parents have trouble seeing our perspective as well.

A lot of the posters expressing those opinions will be mothers themselves.

... a certain style of parenting. It’s a more hands-off, less attached approach...

What on earth do you mean?

Yes, often they are, especially on pregnancy / newborn threads where they either didn’t need or get a particular adjustment and so think no one else should get it.

I completely understand that some people have zero interest in spending time with children but surely extending courtesy and support to more vulnerable people is part of living in a society?

See this is where you lost me. Why are women or pregnant women now vulnerable?

Mostly, I see people frustrated with the parents of badly behaved kids more than being anti-child per se. But then I don't have a problem with child-free spaces and stuff like that so maybe I'm biased.

@Amyknows pregnancy comes with a huge number of possible complications. There are several mechanisms by which pregnant women are more likely to fall / faint and this can have very real consequences to the baby in utero. Public transport seats aren’t prioritised for the elderly, the disabled and pregnant women for no reason. And I hope it’s obvious why newborns are vulnerable…

YANBU. I think it's a weird polarisation of views, caused by the increasingly individualistic society we live in. Increasingly people seem to view children either as simultaneously a selfless sacrifice and a precious wonder deserving to be placed above all other things, or as an unpleasant blight on human existence, caused by adults stupid enough to have them.

I'm pretty sure this wasn't always the case. I guess as we live more in our own little bubbles and less in communities or extended families, more and more people aren't used to being around children they actually know or are related to. Parents shouldn't expect the world to revolve around their dc. But everyone else should accept that children are a part of the community and shouldn't expect them to be excluded or hidden away.

@AllProperTeaIsTheft I really agree with this response. I adore being a mum and would never claim my desire to have a child was a selfless act to contribute to society. I’m well aware not everyone wants to interact with my child and that not all spaces are appropriate for them. At the same time, I strongly believe everyone should treat them with courtesy and that they are entitled to be in public and act like a toddler with my support and correct as appropriate.

I think you’re right about some not being used to children also. Before getting to know my baby, a few of my friends had really unrealistic expectations of how children should behave. Repeated screaming without correction isn’t ok, but it’s very hard to prevent a baby or toddler ever suddenly having a joyful scream in public! Likewise, running around an art gallery isn’t ok, but running around a park (even if someone else wants to have a nice relaxed picnic there) is fine and normal so long as giving everyone space.

YANBU. I think we are shifting away from having children being a societal norm, and as the number of children in our everyday environment reduces, schools and other facilities close and people spend less time around kids and young people generally our society will become less and less child-centric. We've already seen the young being deprioritised to an extent in policy making/election pledges etc.

I do wonder what this all means for our younger generations in years to come, as many young people seem to have lost trust in the system and hope in the future as it is - they feel that no one is rooting for them.

As someone whose childfree it's not the children I have an issue with, it's the parents who can be the problem. I'm happy to offer my seat to a pregnant woman or to an elderly person, I'll chat to your small DC if they'd like that but my intolerance is reserved for the parents who never make their DC behave, the ones who think their DC can do whatever they like because their DC can do no wrong, or because they really can't be bothered. In my local pub I saw four parents dump their five DC on a table (away from theirs) and then get on with drinking and ignoring their children, when they bought their third drink the landlord said that's it, no more after this, you've got DC with you, oh, the indignation, how dare he tell them they couldn't have anymore! I have to say the children behaved pretty well, which is more than I can say for their parents

I think YANBU and sometimes it's infuriating, especially when you get a pile on but... one of the reasons I like MN is because you get such a diverse range of opinions and hearing "he's a baby not a tiny god you have to appease!" can actually snap you out of being a bit PFB.

But I really hate the posts where people ask "why did you even have children when you're not a zillionaire living on a private island in Central London? No one should have children if they can't cater to their every whim!" Or the other one I hate: "You chose to have children, nyer nyer nyer" if anyone says life with kids isn't like being a Disney princess complete with singing bluebirds doing your housework every morning.

I agree with you OP on the fact that mumsnet thinks you shouldn’t take your baby anywhere but you also mustn’t go out and leave them at home with a babysitter and you mustn’t rely on grandparents and you must also maintain a social life for sense of self.
how the ruck.