To be beginning to think there is some sort of bot presence here starting threads doing down the UK?

[MrsBixbysMinkCoat]

I am so fed up with it. Nearly every day there is a thread about how awful the UK is. Today it's about how filthy we are compared to other places. A couple of days ago it was about how shyte it is here. Moaning about the NHS, weather, transport, about how Ukrainian refugees feel sorry for us, about bloody everything.

There are lots of things I dislike about Britain in 2024. However, this is still a beautiful country where the vast majority of people live peacefully. The very worst thing about this country is that we don't realise how bloody lucky we are. It's not too hot like Southern Europe (sunning yourself on a beach in 38 degrees might be lovely; working in a kitchen every day much less so), not too cold like Russia or part of Canada. We don't get hurricanes like the Southern US has just dealt with. We don't get floods on the scale of Bangladesh. We don't get earthquakes like Japan or Haiti. We don't have volcanoes like Iceland or Italy. We don't have poisonous snakes and spiders like Australia or India. We don't have wild animals stopping us roaming freely like Africa. We don't have drug cartels running things on a huge scale like parts of South America. Neither do we live under despotic rule like North Korea. We don't live in daily fear or famine like the horn of Africa or of war like the Middle East. Our women are reasonably free and not forced to live diminished lives like in Afghanistan.

We live in a generally benign Western democracy and yes times have been hard and yes some of that has been self inflicted - eg via Brexit - and yes we have struggled with leadership too removed from working class priorities. Yes there are knife crime issues and gangs in some of our cities and towns and I wish there weren't. But on balance in a global scale this is fucking paradise compared to many people's lives.

Please can we have a thread bigging up the UK instead of this constant, neverending, tone deaf whingeing, that really is one of the worst things about the British (and possibly, the English most specifically).

YANBU

How they know how bad the UK is from Moscow I’ve no idea OP

I guess the same way we might have an impression of moscow or any city for that matter

Maybe, but they'd probably fare better in a country with greater income equality, better welfare & access to services that work.

So quite a few other places.

Whoosh

I’m lucky to live in a nice village and to pay for private health treatment. I’ve got no mortgage or worries about money so I’m insulated from how things are to a great extent.

however. We went to the high street this morning. It’s a long city high street. About half the shops are boarded up, there are a couple of chain stores but mostly money laundering shops and cafes. Loads of fast food places with a big congregation of Uber drivers standing around outside next to their electric bikes. A very large amount of rough sleepers and each street bench at the top of the high street had rowdy drunks with cans of cider. The high street had the stench of weed. It was a total shit hole. So if that’s all you see, and you can’t get away from it then you could be excused thinking that the country has gone down the pan.

I think what many people are finding so upsetting isn't the UK's position relative to other countries (on which I agree with all the points you make about safety, democracy etc) but our direction of travel. There is a huge psychological difference between living a slightly tougher life where things are improving, and one where every passing year brings an errosion of living standards.

We travel in Europe a few times a year and the difference is becoming more stark with every return.

‘I specifically agree that the government has ignored working class priorities (in fact I said it in my OP) in order to virtue signal middle class values.’

This I 100% disagree with. Its governments obsession with pandering to large sections of the working class, and ignoring the middle class over the last decade which has seen the deterioration of living standards for all.

The fact you also used the term ‘virtue signal’ also tells me some things. There are many people who think waving flags and yelling about small boats will cover up the fact they can’t cope with the fact that living standards are dropping and it’s in large part because of themselves.

Have a think why it upsets you so much that many others don’t agree with you that all is good here, and also don’t see comparisons to famine hit countries and Afghanistan as valid. Many of us aim much higher, the bar shouldn’t be below Satan’s foot.

It's obvious you've never been either. One could take pictures of the worst (or best) place in any country and continent ("Africa") and display it to fit whatever narrative they have.

I was curious to read what you had to say about "Africa" ( I knew it was coming when I saw that you were listing every country and region) and I wasn't disappointed.

"We don't have wild animals stopping us roaming freely like Africa" I howled. Please where is this happening? Is that all you know about "Africa" - wild animals? Ignorant.

Anyway, I do agree with the majority of your sentiment. I love the UK. Like every country and "continent", there are good and bad bits, good and bad people, good and bad leaders. I just think people like you get twitchy when the UK isn't praised 24/7, yet I doubt you have that many good things to say about other places unless you're holidaying there...in other words, for selfish reasons. Let people complain if they want to and equally i think people can praise what they want. There's no need doing tit-for-tat.

Apologies, I got it from AI. However I did get my USA based friend to check her insurance when my family member started this medicine and this is what her insurance co-pay (a good one through her DH's work) would have been.

I don’t think I’ve seen any of the threads you’re talking about, I love Britain. I know we’ve got our problems but I can only think of a couple of places I’d want to live outside of the UK. We are so bloody lucky to live here.

Our nation is beautiful. And it’s so accessible. Within a few hours you could be in a city, or on the beach or up a mountain or in the countryside. The history we have is not always glorious but it’s definitely something to behold. I think, on the whole, we’re pretty welcoming and embrace multiculturalism. We have world class athletes, scientists, actors, singers/musicians, artists, writers. I’m starting to sound like Hugh Grant’s speech in Love Actually now, but we’re not half bad. And I think we’ve got the best sense of humour in the world, even if the English are trailing after the Scottish, Welsh and Northern Irish in that department.

Actually I grew up in East Africa and we were not allowed out of the garden walking, because of baboon troops living locally which were highly dangerous. Have you seen the teeth on them?

I know a great deal about corruption and living in genuine fear from my childhood in Africa. How about you?

And I could take any number of pictures of the UK with no rubbish and use it to say there is no rubbish problem, despite a whole thread on how filthy this country is.
My argument is that this country is no worse than any other. There are rubbish strewn places and clean places. It's not at all bad in my local area, aside from by the motorway.

OP, I'm inclined to agree. And it's just not about the UK, but many also attacking the US. On the other hand you can see the numbers of people who want to come and live here (rather than France as an example!).

Of course, there are MANY problems, but objectively it is one of the best places in the world to live.

I hadn't thought about this, it could be genuine disillusionment, but yes, could be bots or bad actors, especially with such a big site as MN. If you wanted to destabilise things by being relentlessly negative you'd have a big captive audience.

It wouldn't be the first time bad actors have been on here bullshitting.

Actually I grew up in East Africa and we were not allowed out of the garden walking, because of baboon troops living locally which were highly dangerous. Have you seen the teeth on them?

@NoButBut I’m guessing you were thinking she’d grown up in Surrey? 😂

I actually love living here. It's not perfect but I love that we have the NHS. I'm proud of it.

Most of live okay with each other day to day. Don't let the fuckers get us down.

Perhaps it not so much the comparison with other places, but the change over such a short time here in the UK. There really is a decline in every town and city in terms of shopping, health care, anger just bubbling under the surface. Shops like Debenhams just gone and boarded up in so many places leaving dead town centres. The country needs investement but there's a real people problem, too.

Yes this.

And also why compare to countries where things are worse? Why not compare to countries where, on average, things are better?

Eg. France has a better healthcare system than the UK. Actually so do quite a few other European countries.

And the UK has one of the lowest state pensions in the developed world, and much worse and lower amount of money working age welfare benefits than many other European countries.

Of course there's a lot of good things and areas in the UK. But it's very dependent on where someone lives and their individual circumstances. Speaking about the problems doesn't necessarily mean "hating on the UK". It's more likely people struggling and who justifiably want a better deal.

The false economy of austerity has badly damaged both individuals - and the UK in general. That's been confirmed by various studies conducted by experts (although it doesn't take an expert to realise this). Hopefully the government will address the issues and repair the damage done - starting with an end to the false economy approach.

I am not sure I have ever been to Surrey in my life.

Please list 🙂

This I can agree with. Things are hard. I just get sick of people making out that nowhere else on earth is also struggling with cost of living, post COVID.

Yes, some people have never travelled and it shows. Seeing other countries made me realize how lucky we are in the UK!
I think we’re also so used to having everything easy here that a bit of rubbish on the street = hysteria ‘the WHOLE place is filthy’. Classic mumsnet really.
I follow someone on Instagram who is living in the uk for the first time from the US, and going to all sorts of beautiful places, seeing the country through her eyes has really made me appreciate it more too!

Africa is a whole continent OP.

Yes. So is South America. And?

I think we’re also so used to having everything easy here that a bit of rubbish on the street = hysteria ‘the WHOLE place is filthy’

Yes, it's hilarious. I particularly liked ...everywhere is filthy ... except for my place which is lovely, because other people are generous with their time and caring of their environment - but they shouldn't to, which they do, but if they didn't - it really would be awful.

I mean talk about a glass half empty 😁