Did the benefits of lockdown outweigh the harm to children’s education?

[PoisedKhakiUser]

AIBU to ask whether the benefits of lockdown - saving lives and protecting health - outweighed the damage it did to children’s education and future life chances? I feel like kids lost out on so much during this time, and I wonder if the cost was too high.

I agree. It's impossible to weigh up. Partly because there are too many consequences and variables to consider, and partly because we will never know exactly what would have happened if we hadn't had lockdowns.

The Channel crossings were less of a concern than the delay in placing restrictions on flights from high risk countries, queried by one early inquiry https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/explainers-55659926

It is the problem with these threads. It’s largely a discussion who don’t have anything like a full picture or understanding of Covid, epidemiology or exactly the state the front line was in and why we had to lock down even though the government were trying to do anything but.

Ironically, the people who complain loudest about the government’s nudge campaign also seem to be the people who talk more about locking down to protect the vulnerable. Slightly ignoring the fact that was a nudge campaign and we locked down to protect everyone because the knock on effects of letting a novel virus that spreads extremely rapidly run riot affects everything. Which we already knew from China, Italy and Spain by the time it got to us.

The only reason the public were so easily persuaded to lockdown was that most workers got paid to stay home and get drunk.

I was derided and shunned by some for my opinion on it at the time. After the first month, possibly two, it did become apparent that for most it was an unpleasant but not life threatening illness. It was also apparent that like every other virus it would mutate, but having garnered immunity to the initial virus each time we caught it, the symptoms would be lowered. I believe that a staged return to work should have taken place by eg 20-30 age then month later 30-40 and so on. Those with health issues shoud have stayed isolated. This would have created herd immunity far better than chasing it with ever new vaccines.

We have been left with a health service that has failed many people with illness other than covid, created a mental health disaster especially in children, created a far bigger alcohol problem. Destroyed many businesses. Ruined our economy. And left our generation and more so our childrens generation a debt they will be paying all their working days.

it was always nonsense, the threads on here were incorrect

It was confirmed at the enquiry anyway. It wasn’t possible

Nobody has a full picture of covid, epidemiology and the risks caused specifically by restrictions. It would be impossible. People who only think in terms of one part of that full picture, as you're doing here, are the problem with these threads.

Also, your claim that the nudge campaign was intended to protect the vulnerable ignores all those vulnerable to the nudge campaign specifically. Those with existing mental health conditions like health anxiety and OCD were vulnerable, but clearly they didn't matter enough for the government to refrain from deliberately trying to increase fear levels.

I think this is a very fair point, yes. Lockdown I feel should hhave been implemented far sooner, but perhaps been shorter.

We were all watching Italy implode, yet waited so long to lockdown here. I feel lockdown was at the time necessary with the minimal information we had.
What followed with nonsense tiers, eat out to help out and everyone & their dog being a keyworker was though, truly ridiculous.

I think also that the MH of our children is not just a product of lockdown, the fact that schools unwittingly assumed the roles of teacher/social worker/ to a huge extent, alongside horrific financial cuts is also a contributing factor.
Schools are under such pressure to deliver performance targets, without the funding to do it, so are now negative environments for many children.
The picture is bigger than lockdown. I feel there were challenges yes to lockdown, but also so many benefits-the world most certainly changed.

But it's what followed lockdowns in terms of policy & practices I feel we are not considering properly on this thread. There are so many causes of MH decline in our young people, covid lockdowns is just one of them.

Where? Why? Or just do you not like my point because it resonates with you?

There was a huge cultural difference between the UK and Sweden regarding health before the pandemic. The UK has a culture of soldiering on and a system that ensures that. Sweden doesnt. If you're ill you stay home and the system supports that.

Parents don't have to send kids to school dosed up on paracetamol out of desperation. They get paid time off to look after poorly children. Likewise if you're sick yourself. Statutory sick pay is 80% of salary and many employers pay the rest.

Absolutely, without a shadow of a doubt, 100% - NO.

The long-term impact is going to be catastrophic. Far more so than covid would have been without the measures we had.

But we cannot possibly know this to be true though can we? We had such limited solid information when covid first hit, if we hadn't locked down and millions more died we would be having a different discussion here surely?
I am by no means a fan of lockdown - particularly the later stages, but in early 2020 I think it genuinely was the most sensible decision.
I also think this thread has acknowledged the shortcomings, but failed to recognise the fact that it also brought many benefits. (This is not in any way dismissing the bad impacts but this was inevitable eith or without lockdowns).

I'm confused by those medical professionals who claim people were dying and it was chaos during lockdown. I'm sure it's always hard work in A and E. However the excess death rate is higher now than it was in lockdown. Are things not worse now? Why weren't the Nightingale hospitals used? Were more staff off sick makibg things harder? Surely things are worse now?

Likewise. Stories of people dying left, right and centre of covid in hospitals just don't bear scrutiny of our local hospitals at least. Numbers of deaths locally were reported in the local media and it was never more than a handful per week of people dying in hospitals of covid. On average one a day. That sounds pretty "normal" to me for a couple of largish hospitals with an A&E and ICU.

Perhaps some areas were affected more badly than others???

I agree that the public baying for more and more of our rights to be taken away, reporting on neighbours etc was the most disturbing aspect.
I was heavily pregnant and walking my two under 5s by a tow-path and got bellowed at by a man in his 50s/60s walking his dogs, apparently I walked too close to him (I really didn't - I just wasnt prepared to drag my children into the nettles so he and his pack could abreast). He was hysterical, his wife with him didn't say a word in my defense. Really frightened me and the children. I thought I'd just been unlucky to meet a random nutter but I've since heard so many similar stories. People went crazy.

I think there were people who wanted to stay locked down indefinitely and I have met people in person who say they found it hard to stop wearing masks and felt naked without them.

I also think many just want to forget the whole thing because they feel embarrassed and ashamed of how they behaved. I think many feel angry with themselves for buying into the whole nonsense to such a degree.

"I think there were people who wanted to stay locked down indefinitely and I have met people in person who say they found it hard to stop wearing masks and felt naked without them."

I have friends who were part of the lockdown to infinity brigade. They're now moaning about government debt!

No. Socially for the teenagers but our primary school was fantastic in providing structured activities and a well balanced amount of home learning provided as complete packs once a week. My children thrived but we life a rural life and had no restrictions on where we could go and what we could do. Wish it would happen again

Remember this wasn’t just about deaths. It was about waiting areas and beds being full. Doctors, nurses etc working extra to help with the massive increase of people coming in either poorly or just scared that they were really ill.

Also Covid may have resulted in another type of death. Low immune system which Covid weakened and other causes were the final cause. Plus remember those who missed out on cancer saving treatment who died. It’s not as straight forward as you think.

Sounds like a fair few on mn tbf

Very few children lost parents to the pandemic whereas large numbers of children were adversely affected by lockdowns.

@GrannyRose15
Very few children lost parents to the pandemic whereas large numbers of children were adversely affected by lockdowns.

Can you not connect the dots here?
If we had not locked down far more would have died, also adversely affecting them.
The impacts of covid would have been far greater felt if we had just let it run riot.

Can you actually prove that?

A few of dds friends went to school. The mums don't work, there is no SEN, not disadvantaged etc.

I still can't work out why. They just said they phoned school and asked if they could go.

The government forgot about special school, s
They made a big deal about children with EHCPS attending school during lockdown
And whilst I'm sure that happened if you had a child with an EHCP in mainstream school
From experience it wasent the same in special schools, my son has always been in a special school he was off school between March 2020 and September 2020 and again from December 2020 -February ( I think) 2021 ,all of the kids in his school have EHCP,s and they are all vulnerable but most couldn't attend school

This was our experience to. My sons special school did a risk assessment and closed down as some of the children couldn't understand personal space and they were more vulnerable than average. They didn't get any learning online or otherwise. We got a safeguarding call once.

Wheras my mainstream was open and all the ehcp children were in save the ones whose parents didn't want to bring them in.

It was nearly 5 years ago. It's like the phone lines you ring blaming the pandemic for being "busier than usual" still. It's been too long for this to be an acceptable excuse anymore. What are you NOW doing to address the situation? Surely the 16 year olds now aren't going to blame crap GCSE results on missing a bit of in person schooling when they were 11? Come on, now. It's called working hard and revising.

There are a lot of emotive posts on here based on anecdata alone. Any credible sources got anything to add?