To wonder how anyone affords to move house?

[towonderwander]

We are a mid 20s married couple with our first baby due next month. Earlier this year we managed to buy our first home. It is an ex-council house which needed significant improvement in an okay area. Not the best, but good schools around and convenient motorway links. With kindness, practical and financial support from our families, we are slowly turning it into a beautiful place to live. It is now a really lovely home with just a couple of rooms left to upgrade. It is technically a 3 bedroom but the third bedroom is very small and houses our clothes as well as the boiler so would never be functional as a third room.

We are glad to be on the property ladder and feel lucky we had so much support, but the cost to maintain and upgrade this house has been more than I could ever imagine. We have a 4 figure mortgage as it is, thanks to interest rates. If we wanted a bigger house/slightly more desirable area, I can’t see how we would do it. Anything that wouldn’t need this level of work again would be most likely well out of budget plus the new stamp duty thresholds mean we’d have that to factor in as a large cost too. Plus you know, childcare fees and the general cost of living crisis.

How do people afford to move? AIBU to think nowadays it is increasingly harder and not as simple as just climbing the property ladder?

(To add before anyone asks why we didn’t start with a flat, most if not all have been bought by landlords round here, the ones that haven’t are leasehold and exceptionally difficult to sell on.)

I think people need to be realistic with their expectations and be flexible. We bought our first house on shared ownership, stayed there 10 years while we grew our careers and family. Then with the equity from the first house moved to a cheaper and nicer area (further away from a big city). We aren't living in a mansion by any means but it's better than we could have afforded in our original town. It's also well below the upper limit of what we could have gotten which means that the repayments have stayed manageable. It also helps we aren't anywhere near London. A colleague sold their London based home which still had a sizable mortgage and now lives mortgage free in the North, house paid for by the equity in the London house.

@Freshersfluforyou I'm not sure where you live but where I'm from, a lot of flats are similar (if not more sometimes) prices to 2-3 beds houses so it kind of makes sense as to why people would just look at houses instead, also avoiding extortionate service charges etc.

Your first question is surely why do you want to move house? Can you not make what you have got work for you, until you are earning more, have less outgoing?

You have done amazingly well to manage to get on the property ladder and you are ahead of the average person your age by doing so. I think you have to think in the long term. When my DH and I bought our house 8 years ago it needed major refurb and mortgage payments felt tight...fast forward to now and given promotions etc for both of us the mortgage payments now feel more manageable. We have just also finished having to pay for nursery fees for our children so we now have a bit more of surplus cash each month which will slowly go towards saving towards moving fees, stamp duty etc. for our next house.

We are also both in agreement that we don't want to move for the sake of moving and would rather wait to be able to make the jump up the ladder than buy something slightly bigger, which will last us 15 years+ than buy something we will outgrow in the next 5 years. Plus with the increasing house prices and paying off more of the mortgage in the meantime will mean that we will have a bigger deposit for the next house as well as take an increase on the mortgage

You stay where you are and hope when you want to sell we are in a housing boom and you make money on the house you have

The people talking about how the property ladder doesn’t exist like it did before and it being harder to move are being disingenuous though, as much as yes it is much harder to buy now in the past a 3 bedroom house wasn’t considered a “starter home”.

With all due respect, if you paid £2k on mortgage and £2k on childcare fees, with a combined income of £7500, you'd still have £3500 to play with which is a huge amount for many people!

Also where I live there aren’t actually many flats. Certainly not enough to cater to all first time buyers. Obviously people can move (I’ve moved around multiple cities/towns and even countries) but if people want to stay near their jobs/families/communities then they have to buy what’s available.

It's not immigrants fault housing is unaffordable, but they do limit the amount of available social housing. Many of my work colleagues, who are immigrants, have been housed in social housing (with the benefit, of security of tenure, and cheap rent), while my family and I (we all born here) remsin on the housing list, but have had to live in privately rented accommodation, with my 5 year old son moving home 4 times in his lifetime thanks to no fault evictions, while struggling with much higher rent costs, and the money involved in moving regularly and setting up a new home. This is why people get annoyed when others are prioritise, over those who have worked, and paid taxes longer!

I think for most people it's a combination of various life choices such as:

People choose to live at home or in house shares for longer to save a deposit
Parental help with deposit (or inheritance)
Not getting married and instead using the money for a house deposit
Two incomes is mouch more the norm for house buying than it used to be
Having DC later in life
Renovations done slowly (or even paused at the height of nursery fees)

Also don't forget interest rates were close to 1% only a couple of years ago some some people are still on amazing fixed rates.

As others have said, I think you are being a bit naive. You are mid 20s, at an expensive time in your life, with median incomes. What sort of home do you expect to have? Most people work their way up with houses and use the equity plus higher wages to get a bigger house. We live in the south east so everyone I know have huge mortgages, the only people I know who have small mortgages or own their homes outright are either in their late 40s/50s or have received inheritance / family help.

we bought a small 2 bedroom house as our first property - massively overpaid our mortgage, did the house up and we saved. We sold at a profit. We then bought our next house which was mid range 4 bedroom house for our budget but we did the same. We again sold at a profit. Bought our current house which needs significant work and is costing a fortune to pay for but we hope not to move ever again and that we will renovate slowly when we save money again. But we accept we cannot save much now as son is at school and mortgage is high etc.

The housing crisis is real and desperate. My children are in their 20s and I know they won't be able to afford anything until we pop our clogs or downside and give them the money. Britain needs a massive building programme, but it also needs to make owning more than one property unattractive. So much of our housing is tied up as 'investments' (AirBnB, rental or kept empty for capital gain).

With respect OP the maths aren’t matching to be honest, you’ve said you live in a ‘cheap area’ and ‘up North’ but your mortgage is in excess of £1k a month. You must have had very little deposit for it to be that much repayments OR have taken over a shortish term? I am also up north and live in a lovely little seaside town that’s really popular and property is expensive, tiny 2 bed terraced pavement cottages are circa £300k plus with no garden and difficult on street parking. HOWEVER the neighbouring big town 15 mins away has 2/3 bed houses starting from £85k in perfectly liveable condition. There are loads of towns in the North that are cheap enough to buy in though not the prettiest but close enough to big employment areas and nicer areas to socialise in!

Also, a PP said that homeowners shouldn't be forced to downsize, but it does seem unfair that older couples and single people are often living in 4/5 bedroom homes while families are squeezed into 2/3 bedroom homes with very little prospect of being able to upsize. I mean, that's capitalism for you - rich people have more than they need. And home owners will never agree to downsizing before they feel ready to.

2k is fine but not 2500. Also why would you want to do it to yourself. I just can't get used to the idea of 2500 mortgage!

3000 per month after mortgage and childcare fees would be like 2 people on minimum wage (many of whom live at home or in social housing, appreciate that equally many dont).

I agree - the point I was making in my original post is that sacrifices always have to be made whether it’s when you have kids, the type of house you have or the quality of life you have when you have kids. I agree with squeezing a little now - kids won’t notice when they’re little and will more than likely appreciate more space when they’re older. I have 3 siblings and we lived quite happily as a family of 6 in a 3 bed terraced house until I went to secondary school - the parameters of what is normal and expected has changed a lot over time.

I would say £2000/ month seems quite expensive for childcare costs unless you’re not eligible for using government tax free account or any free hours. Sounds like you may be in London where it might be slightly more expensive but check you may be able to get some help that makes things cheaper.

@SeenYourArse With respect OP the maths aren’t matching to be honest

I think you just don’t understand current costs.
Even if OP’s house was 200k which for a small 3 bed in many places is considered a cheaper house. Just because there are homes near you for £85k that isn’t representative of the entire ‘North’. The repayments on a mortgage of 180k with 20k down would still be £1,000 a month.

We have a tiny 2 bed flat but equally dh was born in a 1 bed flat where he lived until age 5 with two younger siblings (also in London).. his parents owned that flat but couldn't upsize without family help (on one income due to father losing his job in 92 recession).

Neither dh or I earn 100k individually so technically eligible for help.

No, they wouldn't - at least not over a 30 year period.

I haven't rtft but I'm pretty sure the average age for buying a property and for having children is well above mid 20s....so would potentially have 10+ years more to save* and 10 more years of wage increase, or promotion opportunities

*I realise it's virtually impossible to save with some rental prices

Because people have to live somewhere.

I find the comment about single earners patronising.

I'm a single earner, I need to live somewhere so I prioritise a house over a new car and lots of expensive clothes and jewellery. I live within my means. I don't need pity or faux surprise at the cost of living and questioned on how I cope.

Single earners and large families adjust their lifestyle.

all these threads. Aibu how do people afford car/holiday/house etc.
Different people have different earnings/outgoing/help or priorities in life. Seriously, it's getting tedious (and I am saying that as someone who cannot afford a lot). Bit isn't it bleeding obvious?

It used to be a social norm for siblings to share a bedroom and with the housing crisis as it is now, we're going to have to go back to those days

The UK in 2024. Going backwards. Even wanting a bedroom for each of your kids is an indulgent luxury only the rich can afford.

No wonder young people are disillusioned in this country.

Even at 25 years is £1,000 a month.

A 30 year mortgage is ridiculous given the average first time buyer is almost 34 in the UK, leaving almost no wiggle room before pension age.
But even in your scenario it would still be over £900 a month for a 30 year mortgage on an averagely accessible interest rate, and if they fixed any time during the last 2 years it’s likely to be over £1,000.

I do wonder though with high rents and high house prices we are reaching point when it massively impacts rest of economy - budgets focus on housing meaning discretionary spending rapidly declines impacting jobs and turn over.

Though seen people in USA say similar and others point out UK and other countries have even more out of wack average earnings and house prices than them so it can clearly get worse.