To wonder how anyone affords to move house?

[towonderwander]

We are a mid 20s married couple with our first baby due next month. Earlier this year we managed to buy our first home. It is an ex-council house which needed significant improvement in an okay area. Not the best, but good schools around and convenient motorway links. With kindness, practical and financial support from our families, we are slowly turning it into a beautiful place to live. It is now a really lovely home with just a couple of rooms left to upgrade. It is technically a 3 bedroom but the third bedroom is very small and houses our clothes as well as the boiler so would never be functional as a third room.

We are glad to be on the property ladder and feel lucky we had so much support, but the cost to maintain and upgrade this house has been more than I could ever imagine. We have a 4 figure mortgage as it is, thanks to interest rates. If we wanted a bigger house/slightly more desirable area, I can’t see how we would do it. Anything that wouldn’t need this level of work again would be most likely well out of budget plus the new stamp duty thresholds mean we’d have that to factor in as a large cost too. Plus you know, childcare fees and the general cost of living crisis.

How do people afford to move? AIBU to think nowadays it is increasingly harder and not as simple as just climbing the property ladder?

(To add before anyone asks why we didn’t start with a flat, most if not all have been bought by landlords round here, the ones that haven’t are leasehold and exceptionally difficult to sell on.)

Gently OP this does seem naive. You mention that most people you know (I presume similar age) own a house - perhaps they have been lucky like you to have had financial support from family and have been lucky to perhaps sell older properties at the right time in order to get good deposits for bigger houses- this is a luxury and not the norm. I appreciate it’s your norm if that’s all you’re surrounded by but you’re not entitled to the same life everyone else around you has.

I’m mid 30’s, in the north and most of my friends are similar - Unless you’ve bought an incredibly cheap house or have had a massive deposit I don’t know how anyone who has a mortgage less than £1000 a month - plus there’s two of you - like you’ve said in your PP there are some people who have to manage that as singletons. As many people have already pointed out renting is usually just as expensive if not more with all the added costs plus you’re paying someone else’s mortgage.

The truth is that most people have to make sacrifices to get in order to have luxuries. Unless you have a very rich bank of mum and dad / inheritance people save for much longer / have to work harder and get paid much higher salaries or put off holidays / babies until they’re financially more secure in order to buy a property at all or in order to get the bigger house they want.

Perhaps all this has come as a shock to you as you know people who bought 5-10 years ago when house prices weren’t as inflated and when interest rates were (ridiculously and unsustainably low) and have been able to take advantage of the “ladder”. Unfortunately for all of us - this is getting harder to do. Do you think your expectations when buying this house potentially were a bit unrealistic as all of these issues are not new problems?

I’m sorry if some of the messages seem rude but respectfully you’re in a very very lucky and privileged position - which doesn’t mean to say you can’t wish or aspire for more - just put in the hard work / make the sacrifices that we all have to to better your life - however complaining that things aren’t easier for you can come across as tone deaf. Congratulations on baby and house and enjoy newborn cuddles - they’re the best

If you own your property and you’re in your mid twenties you’re doing very well. The average FTB in the UK is 34, so think of yourself as ten years ahead. In ten years you will probably be able to upgrade. You will have pay rises, interest rates may come down, your property will go up in value if you’ve renovated it as much as you say. There may be some inheritance coming your way. You will be able to move, you’re just at the very start of the journey. At 24 it all seems mammoth, but your fortunes will grow providing you’re sensible and hard working.

Hmm. I'm on my third property and it's a 3 bedroom house.

I think your expectations are unrealistic!

You're right though moving house is expensive. It will cost you at least £20k for stamp duty, solicitors fees, removals fees. That's before you factor in that although your house is now worth more, the house that is bigger/in a more desirable area has also gone up in price. So your mortgage is likely to get bigger too.

That's why I'm currently driving 400 miles a month just taking the kids to school.

A big thing here is that you're having your first child significantly earlier than average - the average age for women to have their first child is almost 31.

Not criticising that choice - but it will obviously have a huge impact on your ability to save. Most couples don't have nursery fees to pay until they are in their 30s and have more of a financial cushion

People get pay rises so can borrow more

People have a windfall like redundancy or inheritance that they invest in a new property

People get extensions because it’s often cheaper than buying a house with extra bedrooms. I see this one the most where I live - there’s always house extending going on near my house because it’s a great location for schools so families don’t want to move away.

Similar situation to you OP (no children though), I am 25 and DP is 30, we are currently in a two bed terraced flat, DP bought it five years ago (before we met) but its looking like another 12-18 months until we can afford to move in to a bigger place as much of the desposit will come from my savings (his income covers current morgage repayments). I earn a medium income but only been in a professional job for two years, and my ability to save is hindered by student loan repayments.

We are in the minority, most of my friends (in their mid 20s) are still flat sharing in expensive areas, and in that sense we need to have gratitude for owning a house at all but I do know the feeling, I desperately want something bigger.

Christ yes. I'm on about 3x the average salary and couldn't afford my house were I to buy it now.

People don't start at the average house OP, they get to that after maybe 10 years paying down a mortgage and accruing more capital.
You might earm the median wage but you probably do not hold the median amount of capital as you are only in your twenties.
Homeowners span from people in their 20's to people who are elderly - dont forget that a couple in their forties with the same wage income as you will likely have accrued a lot more capital than you as they have been paying down mortgages for 10+ years and seen house price rises in that time.

prices in london have actually stagnated. They are still unaffordable though because so much is funded by family money rather than salaries so salaries are irrelevant. Couples who earn above median income can still buy a 2 bed flat (which tbh has always been a starter home for most Londoners since the 1980s; a very high earning mumsnetter here who is known to have been able to afford private school for 5 children once shared that in her 20s in the 80s, she was only able to afford a flat in ealing or a terraced house in zone 5). However as the FTB are getting older, they are just moving out of London altogether.

Many Londoners who didn't have family money (or place to stay while they saved up) had to move to the north and i guess this drives up prices.

I thought this thread was going to be about moving costs. Stamp Duty is a huge one unless it's a "cheaper" property.

You use your 3rd bedroom as a walk in wardrobe and feel hard done to. Right then.

You're in your mid 20's with a 3 bed house which is way ahead of "average". All the mid 20's professionals I work with are either living at home or in flat shares. The ones who've bought property have bought tiny 1 bed flats and are closer to 30. I suspect they've also had parental help because I don't know how you'd ever pay rent and save a deposit in this city!

I have also seen really expensive flats in London where 2 children are cramped in the single second bedroom in bunk beds. They were owner occupiers here.

I think many people upgrade when the second child is about to start school so no childcare fees. If you bought mid 20s and had first child at 26 and second child at 30 (avoid 2 lots of childcare fees at once), you would be 34 by the time second child reached primary school age. that is 9 years of paying down the mortgage and i guess people can borrow more once childcare years are over

And of course this is having kids young, what is more realistic is woman having child at 31 and 35 and possibly in that case they would have 5 years of aggressively overpaying mortgage without child expenses and they could have child 1 in the flat for 2 years and would probably be able to upgrade within timeframe of 7 years (5 years which were child free).

Thank you to everyone who’s been so nice! Appreciate this post might seem naive. I’m not complaining for a second about my situation and see perhaps I wrote the post badly. We are very privileged but I’m angry on the behalf of others who should be able to afford the same standard of living as they would’ve been able to ten years ago, on the very same jobs.

Most people are renting for life op. Especially single people who the government just ignores.

because landlords have monopolised the housing market!

I also didn’t say we want to move now. I just don’t know how we (or anybody else like us) will ever afford it now things have become so unreachable. Again, thanks to everyone who’s shared their own experiences as it’s interesting to read. Appreciate those of you who nicely said that the post reads quite naive too. What a shame this post brought so many unpleasant people out!

Try not to take it personally, it’s a pretty emotive topic due to how hard it is to get on the ladder and also now cost of living.

The answer to any of these pointless "How do people afford to..." threads is always the same.

Because they have more money than you.

Also very true.

I want to say this as nice as possible towonderwander.
Please please be thankful for what you have . I can only dream of being in your position and I’m 40.
Im about to become homeless after 15 year relationship and the likelihood is I’m probably going to be put in a grotty bedsit or hotel until the council can find me a home which could take 6+ months . Whilst I’m in this bedsit I probably won’t be able to have my children stay with me because ex wouldn’t allow it until I’ve got a house .
Im currently not working as I’ve got cancer Aswell as other health issues .
Also when I do get a home I won’t have any furniture.
I would love to be in your position.
Never let the things you want affect the things you have .

Various ways to move 'up' in the property ladder:

• higher salary over time with job moves/promotions
• once children start school, no nursery fees - makes it a bit easier!
• moving into cheaper areas e.g. London to Wales
• Buying do-uppers, making profit from sale
• Family inheritance when members die
• Winning the lottery/premium bonds (I wish)

If your mortgage is only in 4 figure @towonderwander you’re doing pretty well, for most people it is in the hundreds if thousands. You’re also in a 3 bed house, which is quite normal. If you’re seeing normal as baby boomer big 4+ bed detached houses with garages, big gardens and off road parking I think you are sadly out of touch with the housing conditions of most people in this country.

You start off small, buying a house or flat with fewer rooms that you need, then when salaries increase and your home very likely increases in value, then that's the time to move. And I struggle to sympathise with someone complaining about serving the high costs for a three bedroom house they didn't need to buy.

We are very privileged but I’m angry on the behalf of others who should be able to afford the same standard of living as they would’ve been able to ten years ago, on the very same jobs.

Use that anger to advocate for others locally and nationally

Get involved with politics. Anger is a wonderful tool to start change happening

And we REALLY need change within housing in the UK