Nick Robinson on the Today programme said that people affected by withdrawing the Winter Fuel Allowance were "the wartime generation". AIBU to think he's wrong?

[HauntedBungalow]

Also, I am genuinely bored of this British obsession with referencing World War II when talking about unrelated random subjects.

World War II ended 80 years ago. The "wartime generation" don't need a Winter Fuel Allowance because they're all already dead, barring the odd 97 year old who is still living at home and paying all bills themselves.

Nick Robinson is a self confessed Tory supporter, he used to run the Young Conservatives & at Oxford Uni was chair of the Conservative Association.

Everything that comes out of his mouth needs to be considered in that light.

So of course he will portray cuts in WFA as damaging the "War Time Generation" because thats the Tory narrative they wish to give us all.

Exactly.

When Nick Robinson was young, old people were indeed the Wartime Generation.

However now that he is only a few years off state pension age himself, old people are clearly not the Wartime Generation. In five years he will be "old people". I wonder if he'll realise then that he did not fight in the Second World War.

There seems to be a lot of emotional attachment to a benefit that didn't exist until 1997.

It’s the politics of resentment: divide and rule. We’re being played and most people don’t realise, and if they realise, they don’t care. Chiefly because a grievance is so energising.

The point is that while there are pensioners who you could describe as TECHNICALLY part of the wartime generation, in a political context the 'wartime generation' is used in a way to evoke a misty-eyed, sympathetic nostalgia for a generation who are - on average - the wealthiest cohort in our society.

There is no equivalent term that can be applied to other groups - e.g kids in care - that is so instantaneously emotive, even if that group is struggling from government cuts/policies.

It feels disingenuous because whether or not some pensioners belong to the 'wartime generation' is neither here nor there on the question on what benefits pensioners should receive and how much and why.

Yes it is. The Conservatives started this before the Election. Pitting young against old is particularly disgusting.

I have older children, one going to uni next year which is going to leave her with debts of circa £60,000. One who can't afford to move out on his NMW job. For myself my mortgage had gone up by 50% because of Trussonomics. Don't even start me on what's happened to people on UC.

Pensioners benefited from Trussonomics because of the triple lock. I'm sorry, but we all have to share the pain of this and from my perspective pensioners have been fairly well cushioned so far compared to other demographics.

The message of division on this as opposed to a message of "we are all in this together" is really unhelpful.

I can remember that benefit being announced on television. It was a big deal I can assure you which is why the Tories didn’t want to cut it. They knew the backlash for cutting it would run deep.

Hooefully the winters will stay mild due to climate change and we don’t go back to pensioners dying in their homes again. Those were very sad reporting days each winter before that benefit came in.

Your whole message was divisive though. Read it back if you’re not sure.

Absolutely agree
My parents born in the 50's losing their WFP actually had the cheek to say they'd have to book less cruises bevause they've got less money coming in. My dad has a final salary pension!!
Another couple I know massive public sector final salary pension, £30k caravan Sat on the drive and endless Facebook posts about the WFP.

Those who need it should get it those with other means shouldn't- Where's the bloody outrage about the millions of children living in poverty in this country? Where's the anger towards big energy companies and their endless profiteering?

I totally agree with you.

I have a real dislike of the endless obsession with ww2

I don't think the obsession has done anything for this country in recent years, just reinforced our ridiculous sense of superiority.

I'm not sure i understand the connection between WW2 and the entitlement of people to winter fuel allowance anyway.

The country can't afford to keep giving handouts to rich people.

The ones I've seen moaning about it the most are the children of the war generation. They keep using photos of veterans on Facebook as evidence that old people need it - one of them is currently selling her half a million pound mortgage free house to downsize, which will put 200k in her pocket ... Yet she still feels entitled to WFA and uses pictures of very old soldiers to argue it. She's never been near a battlefield in her life.

They could have put their intention in the manifesto. They could have warned people it was going to happen and introduced it next year. They could have taxed it or kept it for those with a disability. They could also have targeted the super rich first. It's a very politically inept decision.

Blimey. The first winter fuel allowance in 1997 was only £20.

My parents were born during the war and are furious. They used their fuel allowance to go out for a lunch at a Michelin-starred restaurant with their friends every year, thought it was hilarious. Much like the Child Benefit and free school lunches, the winter fuel allowance should definitely be means tested, but they've gone about it the wrong way.

My god the stuff I read on here never fails to amaze me.

You are sick of hearing about WW2 lol? I guess you are also a bit bored of listening to stories about mass genocide ……. Hang on….. no we’re not bored of mass genocide because there are marches every weekend with placards screaming about the genocide in Palestine. So it can’t be that 🤔

Maybe you are sick of hearing about masses of young people dying for their country in horrendous circumstances because at the time they thought it would save their families from being under the rule of a dictatorship and foolishly thought it was the right thing to do for future generations? Is it that one?

Or perhaps you just want old people to get on with dying and stop talking about the boring old crap that made up their lives. We know the ageism on here is RIFE and wow doesn’t this thread just prove it.

12.6 million in total, so about 25% of pensioners are millionaires. Similarly around 28% rely only on the state pension with no private pensions. Clearly one group here is in need of help and the other isn't. It's a poorly targeted benefit that's not doing what it should.

It's worth noting that the pension increased by £800 this year and will go up by another £500 in April. There is a good argument that it is better to focus on keeping the basic pension at a liveable level rather than trying to top it up with random one off allowances.

The problem is that there are a great many pensioners who are struggling financially, who receive the state pension, but are not eligible for pension credit, so are badly affected by the loss of this £300. The state pension is only just over £200 a week, to cover bills, house repairs if you own a home, and day to day living.

Most normal working people don't get much more than the state pension, so are left struggling with the cost of living crisis.

Of course there are wealthy pensioners who misused theirs, so it could be means tested and just given to the poorer pensioners, although this might be difficult logistically.

I am not sick of people who were alive during the war talking about the war because it is their personal history. I am sick of the fetishisation of it by our governments and companies. I don't wear a poppy.

There are plenty of actual, real wars going on right now which is where I prefer to place my attention .

This!

Rationing went on for a very long time after the war, times were hard, and children born during these years were most certainly affected by war. I think anyone over about 75 would probably have been affected by the aftermath of the war.

I meet lots of people who were affected by the war, even if they were too young to fight. People who lost fathers or uncles, people who were evacuated to stay with strangers as children. These people worked hard and payed into the system their whole lives and now they have to struggle to pay their heating bills.

For most pensioners, its a £200 benefit, for a pensioner needing their heating on a lot, its about 1 months worth of energy.

So what do they do for the rest of the winter.

What i don't get is why Labour were so stupid to cut this in the way they did, should have just taken it off higher rate tax paying pensioners.

its started a free for all on attacking Labour now.

Yes. Being forced into it by people frothing about WFA. That's my point.

When the media/anti-Labour politicians use emotive language about the "wartime generation" and daily mail sad face pensioners over a £200 annual payment it naturally makes people reflect on how they would manage on £200 less a year. And the reality is the majority of people have had to cut their cloth to manage much bigger financial surprises than that.

I think there is a balanced conversation to be had about the poorest pensioners who are just above the PC threshold and what can be done to support them. Maybe using income tax as a measure, or raising the PC threshold by £200. But blanket "Labour are betraying the wartime generation!" when pensioners as a group have lower levels of poverty than either children or working age adults, is disingenuous and divisive.

www.jrf.org.uk/uk-poverty-2024-the-essential-guide-to-understanding-poverty-in-the-uk#:~:text=Children%20have%20consistently%20had%20the,%2F95%20to%202021%2F22.

Good God.
This is awful.
43,000 men, women and children killed violently and here it's dismissed as 'fuck all'.

My mother was born during the war. She's now 85. Rationing didn't end until 1957. She well remembers her mother skinning rabbits that she had 'acquired'. Meat was scarce. She said once ,as an off the cuff comment, "I never asked what she had to do to get those". She is not worried about the loss of the winter fuel allowance. She's currently on a train heading to Florence . Many of her friends are very, very worried.

Always amuses me how so many pensioners known by mumsnetters are jetting all round the world and going on cruises and buying new cars.