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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Not sure what to do new office attendance policy

207 replies

sunflower122 · 05/09/2024 22:28

I took on a new role around two years ago. The company wanted me to be based in a particular office further north (about a three hour each way commute away.)

I said that was fine but I could only do that commute once a week. This was agreed in writing. I genuinely would not have taken the job if they had not agreed to this - my old job was fine!

The company have now announced a mandatory three day a week in the office policy.

I genuinely cannot do this with a six hour commute and it wasn't the basis on which I accepted the role.

Do I need to leave pretty much immediately?

OP posts:
PlanningTowns · 06/09/2024 09:11

Union and HR

you have it in writing and took the job on given this offer. They can change terms but need to consult if it results in a change in contract. However if you have a hybrid contract then it still sits within that definition.

the point here is that you have agreement in writing from them about 1 day per week.

will you get very far with this? Possibly not, but it’s worth a try.

lazzapazza · 06/09/2024 09:24

Do not put in a flexible working request. That implies that your previous agreement is not applicable. I am a stubborn cow and I would bluntly refuse citing the email agreement. The ball is in their court as to how they then take things fowards.

Contact ACAS and ask them where you stand.

JohnCravensNewsround · 06/09/2024 09:25

There is a world of difference between someone who lives within a reasonable travel distance of the office (1 hr), who took a job hoping that they would only have to do one day a week and this scenario. No one in their right mind would have taken the job unless they were given assurances.
I assume the reason for the hardline is that if Bob can work remotely successfully then so can we all.
Best bet is the quiet approach initially but be very clear indeed that your circs were discussed, that no one would sensible change job to that location without an assurance.
Failing that, I'd be looking for another job and compensation from them.

Jobsharenightmare · 06/09/2024 09:25
  1. Do nothing
  2. If challenged by management say "you will need to speak to HR about it I have a permanent contractual exception".
  3. Do not engage unless there is formal HR meeting where you can continue to state your position.

One of three outcomes:
A) If they make your life so difficult you feel you have to leave you will potentially have a claim for constructive dismissal so negotiate a financial settlement and good reference.

B) As they cannot physically enforce this so would have to go down a path of trying to get you on board with a change to your terms and conditions which if you don't agree ultimately means you'll be sacked and a tribunal would need an extremely strong case as to how the business was suffering with you working remotely to win https://harperjames.co.uk/article/changing-employment-terms-and-conditions/#section-8
C) They drop it.

Changing Terms & Conditions Of Employment | Harper James

Changing the terms and conditions of an employment contract? Our employers guide ensures avoid common pitfalls that could lead to claims

https://harperjames.co.uk/article/changing-employment-terms-and-conditions#section-8

DelleLdn · 06/09/2024 09:31

sunseaandsoundingoff · 05/09/2024 23:29

Honestly if it was a general company policy announcement I would assume it wouldn't apply to me. Best to check, but since your contract says something different I would act surprised they think it should include you, personally.

As above - I would act from the beginning like you think this can't possibly apply to you!! The people who get away with stuff at work are generally the ones who just front it out...what are they going to do, drag you there? would take them ages to get through a disciplinary for non-office attendance but I'd bet they would never attempt it as they'll know contractually they're on very shaky ground!

Left · 06/09/2024 09:36

Speak to Acas for advice before going to HR - the HR dept is there to protect the business so you should be prepared before approaching them as they may not offer the best solution for you.

PlayDadiFreyr · 06/09/2024 09:37

sunflower122 · 05/09/2024 22:37

The guidance accompanying the policy specifically says these will be rejected unless you have a physical disability preventing travel (I don't)

They can't have blanket prejudice against reasonable adjustments. For one, not only physical disabilities can affect travel, for two, they're discriminating against people with e.g. caring responsibilities.

For what it's worth, I think blanket attendance policies are a blunt tool aimed at a specific problem. It's not so much hammer to crack a nut, it's hammer to hit a nail, some nuts, soft fruit and a puppy. It only solves a small part of the problem they're trying to fix, makes some things worse, and lots of employers leave it as "job done".

But no office business stands or falls on whether people are in the office a certain percent.

NotARealWookiie · 06/09/2024 09:38

People have been advising you to negotiate, put in a flexible working request, speak to HR and speak to the Union.

None of these are your first step.

You have already agreed specific working arrangements and took the job on this basis. Yes your contract is a bit vague but you have a written agreement of your working arrangements. Unless your company specifically advised you to use a separate formal process such as flexible working request to agree the specifics, then you should consider it as already agreed.

First step is to speak to your manager in a professional (not defensive, panicked or combative manner) and confirm that you have read the recent email and felt it was important to confirm that, as agreed, you will still be commuting once a week. They will probably say “oh yes, it doesn’t apply to you as you have a specific agreement”.

IF they say anything else, then you can seek support from the union and request a formal meeting with your manager- they will likely be advised by HR. You would be advised by your union rep.

If you start by going to HR, negotiating or putting in a flexible working request then it undermines your position that this is already agreed.

Jennyathemall · 06/09/2024 09:40

You talk to your line mgr about it in the first instance and if you can’t reach agreement you escape it either higher or to HR

EI12 · 06/09/2024 09:44

No, new official company policy trumps anything and everything you signed up for. There was a material change in the circumstances - this new decision. My friend took on a job in a digital company, the company agreed to a takeover and in came an US company with new rules, new everything. She had to leave.

alittlebitalexis1 · 06/09/2024 09:44

You have it in writing which forms part of your contract. For them to change this would require consultation and agreement. So you should not have to alter anything. Speak with HR and remind them.

if they push, go via ACAS. Don’t just resign. They’re in the wrong.

Thursdaygirl · 06/09/2024 10:00

Do not put in a flexible working request. That implies that your previous agreement is not applicable. I am a stubborn cow and I would bluntly refuse citing the email agreement. The ball is in their court as to how they then take things forwards.

@lazzapazza This is very good advice. You already have an arrangement, so you're sticking to it.

MarkWithaC · 06/09/2024 10:00

alittlebitalexis1 · 06/09/2024 09:44

You have it in writing which forms part of your contract. For them to change this would require consultation and agreement. So you should not have to alter anything. Speak with HR and remind them.

if they push, go via ACAS. Don’t just resign. They’re in the wrong.

Agree with this.
I got a pay-off from a job where they wouldn't make me redundant, but offered me a 'suitable' alternative, and one of the points my lawyer argued on that was that the job they offered was at a different site and less convenient/not what I'd signed up for. It was nothing as extreme as asking me to do a 6-hour round trip, just a longer and more complicated bus journey, but clearly it still had some sway.

user1471538283 · 06/09/2024 10:26

I think this is happening alot now.

I would assume they didn't mean me as I had it in writing so don't respond. But at my work they are involving legal to make people attend an office. This is because so many moved assuming they could work remotely forever.

It's madness really when it should be about delivery. Even prior to the pandemic I worked mainly at home. All this is to prove a point and encourage people to leave.

sunflower122 · 06/09/2024 10:34

It's causing people so much stress and panic. Most people were doing two days and organised their lives on that basis

OP posts:
taxguru · 06/09/2024 10:39

User3456 · 05/09/2024 22:35

Put in a formal flexible working request. If you have any health conditions you can also put in a request for reasonable adjustments under the equality act if the additional commute would impact your health.
And join a union if you are not already a member.
More info here, good luck 🍀
www.acas.org.uk/statutory-flexible-working-requests

Very bad advice.

No need to go down that route at all.

OP has the one day per week as part of their employment contract by virtue of it being an expressly agreed term, evidenced by the email confirmation.

All they need to do is "remind" HR of their contractual agreement.

Going down the flexible working request route is a distraction and unnecessary at this stage and could make things worse as the employer is under no obligation to grant it.

plantingandpotting · 06/09/2024 10:40

DH's work increased office time to 3 mandatory days and there was a mass exodus. Even those with prior agreement had no room to negotiate.

My employer (HE) has been transparent about the time-frame of hybrid working since implementation, so we all know that the office:home ratio is due for revision in the New Year.

SockSensation · 06/09/2024 10:41

I think you respond that you assume the new rule doesn't apply to you, as it was agreed in writing when you took the job.

theemmadilemma · 06/09/2024 10:46

If you have a specific email, in which they agree to 1 day a week in the office as your formal working pattern, then you (and only you with that document) have a very good case I would think.

I would take that as being an appendage to my contract.

I don't know the legal complexities around that, but I would start with that as your view point, and push it from there.

GladAllOver · 06/09/2024 11:28

You need to be clear what your contract actually says. Does it say "hybrid" or does it say "you will be in the office one day each week"?

MidnightPatrol · 06/09/2024 11:31

Many companies seem to have done this - made one rule and then changed their minds now we are back to normal.

I think you would probably have a constructive dismissal case - you can’t be expected to do a 3 hour commute each way three days a week suddenly, when contract to do otherwise.

I’d be asking them:
a) can you continue as usual given contact in writing
b) if not, what adaptations can they make (is there a closer office?)
c) pointing out constructive dismissal issue and asking what they suggest next

Thursdaygirl · 06/09/2024 11:38

MidnightPatrol · 06/09/2024 11:31

Many companies seem to have done this - made one rule and then changed their minds now we are back to normal.

I think you would probably have a constructive dismissal case - you can’t be expected to do a 3 hour commute each way three days a week suddenly, when contract to do otherwise.

I’d be asking them:
a) can you continue as usual given contact in writing
b) if not, what adaptations can they make (is there a closer office?)
c) pointing out constructive dismissal issue and asking what they suggest next

This

CantHoldMeDown · 06/09/2024 11:55

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ at the poster's request.

Didimum · 06/09/2024 12:00

They would be very unreasonable and dickish to expect this policy to apply to someone who a) lives that far away and b) agreed her in-office time prior to accepting for the job for that very reason. Anyone with a more typical commute of 30mins – 1.5hrs each way, then fine.

I should think they would accept you staying as they are, if they don't, it's very stressful and a big pain for you, but I wouldn't want to work for such an unreasonable company anyway.

AnywhereAnyoneAnyTime · 06/09/2024 12:05

I think you would probably have a constructive dismissal case - you can’t be expected to do a 3 hour commute each way three days a week suddenly, when contract to do otherwise. I think that if OP had been hired on a solely home working basis this would be the case, but the fact that she does travel to the office is clear evidence that it’s possible for her to do so.

My employer hired a load of staff all over the country as they had moved to home working and then did a backtrack to two days a week in the office.

They had to draw up up specific conditions to the highbrid change which took into account the fact that they had hired staff too big a distance from any of our sights and those staff are still WFH full-time.

But a lot of companies are going back to highbrid, I can totally see why this is difficult for the OP, but tbh I wouldn’t have taken a job with a six hour round trip once a week in the first place.