Daughter refuses to poo in toilet?

[Risingsun93]

We are completely lost and at our whits end. My daughter, 3.5 has been toilet trained since 2.5. Never any issues telling us she needs a wee, hates to have wee accidents, yet for some reason (we've wondered them all!) she will not tell us she needs a poo. She will happily poo in her pants. We know her queues and know when she's trying to go, we interrupt her, have tried to encourage clenching and running to loo. There was no sense of urgency from her so we're trying to enforce that if she's pumping and it's following through then to quickly clench and run. She will go only if we ask multiple times or make her go, holding her hand. There's no indication she's afraid of the toilet as she'll go wee in it. We try to encourage staying on longer during wees "just incase" but she seldom goes poo same time. She's going up to 3x per day in her pants. We can't understand why. We've got a Dr's app booked for September. We feel like we're going mad trying to encourage pooing in the toilet, when we ask her why she does it she just says she doesn't know, or that she wants to. She extremely bright, and clever, she understands a lot, knows right from wrong etc. We've tried bribing, taking things away, sticker charts. Absolutely nothing works. She's starting school nursery this week and we are terrified of the impact this will have on friendships, relationships with teachers, her confidence. We just don't understand how or why and what to do about it. AIBU are we expecting too much? What do we do? We're throwing away pants constantly because they are so soiled. Her nursery even sent her home with the poo still in her pants in her bag this time. I'm mortified.

I went through similar with my daughter. She was afraid of pooing, and held it in until she went overnight in a nappy while she was asleep. She was totally fine weeing in the toilet, but terrified to poop in there.

What worked for us was:

1. Having a time of day where she sat on the toilet. No pressure to poop, but she had to sit on the loo. I can’t remember how long we made her sit for. I’ll have a think and come back later to this thread (we went through this from 2.5 - 3.5 with her, she’s 6 now). It was generally at 6pm before bed time. For a long time that became her pooping time and we kept it up even when she was comfortable pooping on the toilet.
2. We had to get her on laxatives that made it really easy for her to go. She had these prescribed by the doctors (Movicol). She had two sachets a day from memory.

Bribes and sticker charts also never worked for her. It was just all about consistency. There was a book which really helped us, I’ll see if I can remember. From about 4 years old she’s had no issues, I genuinely never thought we would crack it.

The website Eric Uk is very useful if your child is having trouble with this stuff. My daughter used to withhold and hated pooing in the toilet then she’d let loose in the bath every night 😫
Laxido and/or lactulose can make a huge difference too.

Have a look into interoception, she sounds like she is struggling to identify the internal signals that tell her it’s time to poop.

Does she have a pattern to her bowel movements time wise?
take her to toilet for trying, feet on a stool for better position and stability, encourage blowing bubbles or long deep breathing on toilet to relax bottom.

When you notice she is pumping/ needs to go then draw attention to how she’s feeling inside her body/bum. Encourage her to start recognising what those signals mean, because they might not be strong enough for her to register until it’s too late.

I had exactly the same thing with my son who is now a teenager. I used to sit him on the toilet and sit on a stool in front of him and read a book to him and ask him questions about the book so he got distracted. Eventually he would be relaxed enough for the poo to come. Sometimes it would be half hour of sitting there but eventually he wasn't scared any more.

He said he thought something was falling out of his body that's why he was scared.

My son, in his 30’s now was exactly the same. He would only poo in a nappy behind the sofa!!!!
I let him until one day I didn’t have any nappies. I showed him the empty bag and from that day he used the loo!
Bizarre.

Wr went through the exact same thing with my youngest. He qas also scared of the toilet and would poo his pants at nursery. We got his old potty out and he would go in there, at home, in a specific room in our house. So we just made sure he went every morning before nursery. He then held it all day. No more issues. Over time he's got used to the toilet and the potties have gone - he's no pooed his pants for almost a year now (he's just turned 4 and is entering Reception).

Honestly these stories make me feel so validated.

After some questioning around feelings and what it's like for her both ways this afternoon. She told me that she feels upset when she poos in toilet because she gets a weird feeling in her belly and doesn't like it falling into the toilet, so pooing in her pants makes her happier. I didn't direct the questioning so ses either super imaginative or she really feels this. I have no idea how to settle her, because I totally understand the feeling, Iv felt it before, it's like a pulling sensation when it comes out. She's very sensitive and tactile and I now get it. Does anyone else have a similar experience or have tips?

Search for Poo goes to Pooland. It's available online free as a pdf. I believe a clinical psychologist wrote it? That plus a sweetie bribe trained our resistant, ND youngest within 48 hours!

X-posted. Definitely get Poo goes to Pooland. It's all about reuniting Poo with his family so the toilet Poo is a happy ending!

I think it will naturally right itself once she is at nursery and sees all the other children going to the toilet to do poos.
i remember my son trying to get a pull up out of the cupboard ( we put them in him at night ) to do a poo. We quickly steered him in the direction of the toilet. They just get so used to the familiarity of going in a nappy.

Try this book...... it was a huge hit with my kids. Its hilariously funny (for adults too!)
Vesuvius Poovius: Amazon.co.uk: Gray, Kes, Mould, Chris: 9780340873359: Books

We are under the continence team as have two DS with learning disabilities and toileting has been a long struggle whichever are not yet finished with.

One of them is exactly the same with poos and the continence nurse said thus fear of 'falling' is very common. He did used to poo in a potty so it's definitely toilet related. One suggestion she made was somehow stretching a nappy or similar under the seat to take away the 'falling'

I could have written this!! My DD is 3.5 and was potty trained a year ago but having poo issues for the last 6 months. She really
Doesn't like going on the toilet and begs me not to make her (but is absolutely fine on the toilet for wees). So many ruined knickers it's soooo frustrating

I've been to GP and health visitor about it because otherwise she is so bright and on track for all milestones etc so I felt like something might be going on. It's also so hard not to get annoyed when I know she is mentally capable of doing it (but I am trying so hard to stay calm as understand she's not doing it to be naughty)

GP provided laxido so when we notice her poo is a little hard we will give her that. Health Visitor said it is super common at this age and not liking the drop into the toilet or splash back is a common reason. They actually recommended offering her a nappy when she shows signs of needing to go which obviously isn't ideal but has saved a lot of pants. I spoke to her preschool about it and they are also offering her a nappy (purely for the poo itself then back into knickers). That can help take the fear of pooing away and just provide a bit of a reset apparently.

This weekend she took herself off to the toilet and did a big poo, I could have cried with happiness!! I'm hoping we are starting to turn a corner. She told me she also did a poo on the toilet at preschool today which is amazing if she did (I have no proof ha!)

Reeeealllly hoping we are coming out the other side now

I had a thread recently on a similar issue. Like you, nursery were either throwing knickers away every day or sending home bags of pooey clothes every day. It went on for months. We basically did a full combo of everything that was recommended - Poo goes to pooland, reading a book on the potty, blowing bubbles on the potty, chocolate buttons for every success, a sticker and a toy when she got to 7 stickers. Asked nursery to back us up. Last week, we got a full week with no pooey accidents. Hoping we've cracked it? Not sure what has changed but I really sympathise because it's so hard.

I don’t have any solutions but my DD (just turned 6) was exactly like this. I was incredibly nervous about her starting school (2 weeks after her 4th birthday) as she had daily accidents. In 2 years though she’s only had one at school. We’ve never really got to the bottom of what the issue was and have tried loads of things. I don’t think she knows really when she needs to go and leaves it too late. She’s much better now and only has occasional accidents.

This feeling of not liking the drop into the loo is a common one.

Pooping feels like parting with or losing a part of yourself for some children. Pooping in the pants keeps it closer, iykwim. If you could move a potty into the bathroom, that might help. There wouldn't be the same drop/ plop. Or set out some puppy pads stretched under the loo seat so the poop would land in the pads and the plop or drop would be avoided. Anything to help get her used to sitting on the loo or potty for pooping really, or eliminating the association between poop and pants.

I used to make a big cheerful thing about waving poop off to the poop party and wishing each one a fun time as we flushed. One of the DCs produced a painting of the big poop party in nursery school, which took a little explaining.

This is the reason I haven't potty trained and am just leaving it until my 3 year old tells me they don't want to wear nappies anymore. For now, we take off and then put back on a nappy after sitting on the toilet to do a wee. As he can't tell when he needs a wee, but can a poo I figure it's a physiological thing and am (literally) going with the flow.

My son has SN and was like this for about 3 years . He eventually gave in with all my cajoling and negotiation and did a poo on the loo but it took so much .

One of the best ideas was to let him poo in the nappy but make him sit or at least stand next to the toilet rather than change them anywhere like a baby .
I literally tried everything but I think this helped the most

Have you tried poo goes to poo land. It worked for us.

Some good ideas on here around the potty and books etc.

You could try with a toilet seat that’s padded with a smaller hole so it doesn’t feel as big of a space around her, she might feel a bit unsteady when pushing a poo/ fear of falling in too (whereas it’s a bit of a different sensation with a wee?) so grab handles or support next to the toilet might also make her feel a bit more secure. Also putting toilet paper down first to “catch” the poo/ reduce splash back or feedback might be helpful.

Can you chain the experience with a sensory experience she does enjoy? Eg; play a certain song, provide a certain calming scent, allow her to watch a tablet or look at a book while on the toilet. It won’t mean she’ll need those supports forever, it’s just building positive associations when getting used to pooping on the loo.

Getting flashbacks of waving poo off to pooland. Can't remember if it was the thing that worked but it was definitely part of it.

Also if and when she poos in her pants then get her to go with you and flush it down the toilet so it's not just wisked away . I know you are trying to save her embarrassment and yours probably ( I get that ) but they need to connect the two .

This again is what eventually worked for us

This advice is from an incontinence nurse so it obviously does work... eventually

Consistency is key though . Keep reiterating the poo goes in the toilet

The poo sensation is completely different to wee and they like the feel of the material being there , it's a sensory thing ..

You can try putting a thin layer of toilet roll across the toilet too so she feels soemthing against her bum but the wee goes through it ..

That sometimes works too