German Football kit

[cs843432]

My son likes the German football kit due to the colours but I'm trying to encourage some patriotism by offering to buy him a kit for a different country. I've nothing against the country or people obviously but I don't think he understands the tremendous (friendly) football rivalry that exists (or doesn't it exist any more?)

This. Sounds like you're encouraging him to be prejudiced tbh. Ridiculous

DD will be sporting an Azorean kit this season. Both the vendor and one of the security staff at the airport (who admired her local to us team shirt) were aware of the recent success of our local team despite the 1000s of miles distance.

I find all this international cameraderie quite fun.

But I don't think it's a case of saying "we don't like Germans", just more of a case of supporting your team.

I live in the borders. My kids have got both Scottish and English tops but I wouldn't expect some Scots not to raise an eyebrow if their kids wanted an English top. Or vice versa really.

Patriotism is not just about a ootball kit, you can encourage it in many other ways, but seriously... Just get them the kit he likes.
It really sound slike "I dont hate Germany, but... (I do)". It's not 1939 anymore.

Also, how do you try encouraging patriotism by buying a kit rom a different country.

This, let's not teach kids microaggression and covert racism straight away, please.

I think that another national kit is not problematic in the same way that wearing certain local kits is. For example I’d imagine that Man City and Man U fans commenting on each other’s kits. I’ve lived in London and seen people comment on the wrong London football kit (Arsenal, Chelsea etc)

I’ve seen people wear Brazil football kits as fashion and where I live in England, I see plenty of Real Madrid kits being worn and I suspect that it’s because it’s distinct like a Brazil shirt.

I’m not a football fan so happy to be corrected but I’m guessing that England might see other countries like Spain as rivals because of the Euros rather than Germany? (I can’t be bothered to check if there’s been a big England-Germany game in recent years. )

@Willyoujustbequiet

But I don't think it's a case of saying "we don't like Germans", just more of a case of supporting your team.

But the parents actively discouraging the kid from supporting any team when the kid wants to wear that strip is sending a message that the team are not deserving of support which to me is xenophobic, never mind how you position it.

Admittedly I am not patriotic and don’t really follow football so I don’t have a dog in this fight. But surely even if you are a staunch supporter of Team A you allow your kid to have the agency to support Team B? It’s their choice surely? What has it to do with the parents?

Unless you live in a hugely sectarian area where it would be actively dangerous to support an unpopular team what’s the reason for this if not xenophobia? Let’s call a spade a spade.

It's not xenophobic to have a preference.

Just like it's not transphobic to have a sexual preference.

I think you are coming across as naive with regards to football. We will just have to agree to differ.

OPs son probably has more connection with Germany than 99% of Manchester United fans do with the north west of England, yet this would not be a question if the OPs son wanted to have a shirt of Mr Ten Hag's underperformers.

🎶 you only live round the corner 🎶 to the away united fans at London grounds 😂

@Willyoujustbequiet

It's not xenophobic to have a preference.

But it’s the parents preference not the kids!

"One of the most popular vintage kits is the German kit from the 1990 World Cup, by the way!"

Indeed. At the time I actually had the green away shirt that they beat England in the semis in. It was a beauty.

Not directing this at the OP but yes of course because we teach our children about football. That's how they develop team loyalty. It goes back countless generations where I am. It's cultural.

It doesn't mean you hate others but supporting a team is part of the basis of football.

I think you're way over thinking this. My DH has worn German kits for years and never, ever had so much as a funny look.

@Willyoujustbequiet

I don’t have team loyalty to anyone so this doesn’t matter to me at all. And therefore maybe this is lost on me…

But surely team loyalty has to be freely given and expressed rather than just foisted on you by parents because “that is what people round here do”.

To be honest this is one of the things that puts me off following a football team.

Bet he wouldn't walk around in Scotland in an England top!

This is so momentously a non issue I can't even.

It's not foisted on you. There's no law says you have to support football.

You grow up with it, it's just part of life - like learning to use a knife and fork or riding a bike. It's a natural affinity for most people in particular areas/community. An affinity that continues long after they move away.

Like I said it's cultural and tied to our history. I'm sure you wouldn't have an issue with people wearing kilts or others speaking Welsh for example.

Some uncle gave me an Argentina shirt in 1986, and I loved it and wore it all the time. In England.

1986 was the year of Maradona’s “hand of God” and only 2 years after the Falklands war.

That uncle must have hated me. I didn’t understand anything about football, just loved the top.

I long for a time in a (hopefully) not too distant future when "patriotism" dies forever. Everywhere.

It's beyond me why someone would choose to "encourage" it in a child.

@Willyoujustbequiet

You grow up with it, it's just part of life - like learning to use a knife and fork or riding a bike. It's a natural affinity for most people in particular areas/community. An affinity that continues long after they move away.

Yeah I get that and that is very benign. But this is different.

If you grow up supporting a local football team you watch your family and friends supporting the team and do it through osmosis. It’s harmless and linked to a sense of place, culture, local pride and traditions.

But if you want to support another team and someone takes it upon themselves to say: “You can’t do that because they are Germany/Everton/Tottenham”, they are actively “othering” the team you have chosen. They are telling you how to think and what to do to create an antagonistic relationship with what other people do. Which is essentially what the OP wants to do.

As a separate point: the OP also implies that everyone is obliged to be patriotic which I have always had a problem with anyway. I have never understood why I have to “support” my country due to the accident of my place of birth/citizenship. I have no control over this, I didn’t choose it and I don’t consider it to be a priority in defining who I am. There are things I love about England and things I dislike but its a long way from being the most important thing about me.

If someone decided I had to support the England football team just because I am English I would consider them a bit of an idiot.

DS has both Northern Ireland and Republic of Ireland 🤣. He's a City fan so has City, Argentina and Spain as he loved Aguero and Rodri. He has local football teams and some.really obscure teams world wide as.a friend bought him a mystery shirt subscription during COVID. He doesn't really wear them outside only under a hoodie but they're easy washed and dry quickly.

That is not altogether true. I know a German who would rather see England lose than Germany win. Deadly serious. He also loves England so there's no logic to it.

Having said that I think kids now love the players and the kits and don't think so much about the nationalism of it all.

*Sorry I meant would rather see Germany lose than England win.