Olympic gymnastics humiliates and infantilises grown adult women

[Thebellofstclements]

The ridiculous leotards, the twee hairstyles. Having to do the ridiculous flicky "dance" moves (artistic expression, ha!) and grinning inanely (insanely) in between moves and when presenting...
Arguably the best athletes in the world but these grown adult women have to present themselves in a ridiculous, almost grotesquely infantile manner, looking fairy cheap and tacky.
The men do not.
My family argues that the gymnasts choose to do this.
We know that historically female gymnasts have been abused with no voice, so I'm not convinced this is all what they would necessarily choose given the option. AIBU?

No different from footballers or pop singers? Getting out of a bad background.

Twisting again. No, I doubt you think there’s no such thing as sexism. Just that you refuse to acknowledge it here. I didn’t include the ‘here’ but had assumed it was obvious…

Women are more vulnerable to abuse in all walks of life, sadly. That is especially the case when anyone can get away with undermining their bodily autonomy. The trend toward older, more muscles gymnasts helps, and artistry in no way undermines this. The codification of artistry has helped to prevent rewarding a particular body type for subjective reasons.

I feel strongly that we need to let athletes take the lead in anything relating to their own bodies, and that includes their clothing. If they like sequins, let them choose sequins.

So? Women being the ‘default’ doesn’t mean that they don’t, still, get the harsher judgement, does it?

Women are the default parents. But when men get in on the act, suddenly they’re praised for a watered down version of what women do.

That’s how sexism works. In this case, women are scrutinised more than men, just like every other situation 🤷‍♀️

So does this mean they should choose different clothes? Not wear makeup?

There is sexism in gymnastics. But I don't get your point here. If women can't do anything that might gratify men's lusts, they'll need to lock themselves up and wear sackcloth.

And men will still be predators. Some men. I am an unattractive, modestly dressed non sparkler. It doesn't stop them.

Not sure what any of this actually means.

This is a sport where women, not men, are the default. You have continually framed the difference in the two as evidence that women are getting the shit end of the stick. That is literally the sort of scrutiny you're complaining about here: when men are the default in a sport, it passes without comment, but when women get a separate one catering exclusively to us and our bodies it must be worse.

It says a lot that you have failed, over multiple posts, to explain why the women's version of the sport must be worse. It has unfortunate connotations of women thing must be shit and unserious, men is better because it's men. That's sexism.

Precisely
Its utterly sexualised.
By contrast
https://duckduckgo.com/?t=ffab&q=male+gymnasts&iax=images&ia=images

Male gymnasts outfits.
duckduckgo.com/?t=ffab&q=male+gymnasts&iax=images&ia=images

None of that is relevant here except for the part where people are on here denigrating female gymnasts for their appearance in elite competition while no one does that to the men.

This thread is full of posters describing female gymnasts as simpering, drag queens, silly, twee, ridiculous, and unable to know their own minds. That’s not empowering or feminism, it’s just more of the same - women will always be told they’re doing it wrong, even while achieving their lifelong goals.

I feel strongly that we need to let athletes take the lead in anything relating to their own bodies, and that includes their clothing. If they like sequins, let them choose sequins.

You're boiling everything down to simply whether they're wearing sequins or not. I honestly couldn't care less, in fact maybe the Olympics would be more fun if they were all in sequins.

Various things have been raised in this thread including the increasingly high leg, bum-revealing cut of the leotards and the heavy make up sometimes worn by very young girls.

Given the history of the sport it's absolutely fair to ask whether there is an element of sexism in the way female gymnasts are expected to behave and perform. The idea that a sport that has been this problematic is now magically free from sexism is frankly ludicrous.

How is it utterly sexualised, though?

Vault is scored on the same criteria for men and women. Bars are comparable. Beam and floor have artistic deductions unlikely to hit a tenth of your score which are only sexualised if you consider choreography sexualised. Controlled movement is the criterion across the board.

Yes, the attire for these two separate sports is different.

Women shouldn’t need to dress or act like men to be taken seriously or treated with respect. Women are not responsible for men sexualizing them. Women do not need to accept that wearing culturally feminine things or acting in feminine ways is silly or childish or inviting abuse. Stop asking women to change themselves in an utterly useless attempt at solving sexism without having to demand that men and society at large actually address the underlying conception that women and women’s things are less than.

I've addressed those points in other posts. If women want the high leg cut, I support that. If they don't I want them to have other options. The Brazilian and American teams, who wear high cut sparkles, are well known to have significant input into leotard design. Dismissing them as tacky is disrespectful.

As to make-up, few of the younger girls wore much that I could see. Some wore none. But teenagers wearing makeup for a televised performance under strong lights is hardly remarkable. There was huge variation here, which seems healthy and normal.

Women shouldn’t need to dress or act like men to be taken seriously or treated with respect. .
Bizarre!
Wearing girly outfits and not trousers leggings does not make you more woman.
Just as wearing trousers does not make act like a man.

These stereotypes are ancient, i find it so disturbing you would use them in 2024. but then this is precisely the twisted logic of gender ideologists.
A woman, or man, is now purely performative in their minds
in all my life Ive never seen such obvious sexism.

Can someone post an example of the 'very heavy makeup' worn by 'very young girls' in gymnastics, because I'm not sure what anyone considers heavy makeup to be on this thread.

Plenty of gymnasts don't wear any makeup

The Brazilian and American teams, who wear high cut sparkles, are well known to have significant input into leotard design. Dismissing them as tacky is disrespectful.

These teams are also older than the average with many gymnasts in their mid to late 20s

No, you didn't include the 'here' did you?

Umm what?

I’m not the one who started rattling on about who was the ‘default’.

The fact is, when there’s a men’s thing and a women’s thing (regardless which was ‘default’) the women’s version will, 9 times out of ten, be harder on women than the men’s version is on men.

In this particular case, the women’s gymnastics involves more revealing costumes and puts more pressure on aesthetics (yes, we know looks aren’t marked specifically but we also know they’re part of the deal and female gymnasts have literally been on this thread explaining about the historic pressure on girls and their bodies) etc.

It’s not about how we discuss it here. We’re not ‘denigrating women’s choices’ as some pp would have it. We’re just saying ‘look at these differences; they’re not necessarily to women’s advantage.’ But some are wilfully blind to it.

You've misunderstood. The point is that women can (and do) choose to wear what they like. It can be stereotypically feminine or not. Hence Sarah Voss - unitard. An Chang Ok - no obvious makeup. Rebeca Andrade - elaborate hairdo. Simone Biles - likes her messy ponytail. Ana Bărbosu - rarely smiles. Flavia Saraiva - constant beam. Julia Soares - brilliant dance. Shallon Olsen - powerful vault. I could go on and on ...

Gymnastics accommodates all sorts of women who can move and balance in extraordinary ways. Lots dress like the young fashion-conscious celebrities they are, and why not? But they don't get points for that.

I agree OP.
A woman won't get anywhere in gymnastics if she wears a non- revealing or loose fitting costume. They've got to look sexy and girlish. & preferably wear their hair in pigtails too.

There's a big group of men on You Tube calling themselves 'Men Of Culture'. They salivate over close-up crotch and backside shots of female gymnasts

Some pp's here are being deliberately obtuse and missing the point

They've got to look sexy and girlish. & preferably wear their hair in pigtails too.

I haven't seen an olympics level gymnast in pigtails since Olga Korbut (1972).

Male divers are hardly wearing board shorts. They are in the tiniest of tiny budgie smugglers.

I was embarrassed 😳 the day my 6yo asked 'what are they wearing' my first though was 'not a lot' before I could come up with an suitable answer he shouted 'PANTS they're wearing pants'

Women are not responsible for men sexualising them.

No, but they shouldn't ever feel pressured to wear outfits that pander to men's sexualisation of them - some past athletes have (according to previous posters) subsequently indicated they were not entirely comfortable wearing outfits which were perhaps too revealing. If the athletes are genuinely able to choose, without the weight of societal pressures and expectations influencing their choices, then that's OK. 🤷‍♂️

And? It was obvious. I certainly didn’t say you’d claimed there was ‘no such thing as sexism’, did I? Yet you still posted this:

When have I ever suggested there is no such thing as sexism? 🫠

Of course there’s sexism in gymnastics. The fact that we’re going round and round arguing about it is entirely bonkers, but goes some way to explaining why progress in women’s rights is going backwards; so many women just can’t see issues.

Good luck.

Not accurate.

No woman has won an Olympic medal in gymnastics in pigtails since about 1976 (Tourischeva). They tend to wear their hair in the fashion of their generations like everyone else, tied up if long for practical reasons.

If an athletic young female body is sexy, gymnasts are sexy. They are mostly under thirty and tend to be quite fit.

But they should be able to get on with their sporting endeavours without sexists and perverts reducing them to sex objects.

They are not judged on their appearances. I would hesitate to rank them by appearance but I would not many of the most outstanding gymnasts of the last few decades as outstandingly attractive compared with their peers. Not that I care.