How can "vegan leather" be plastic (based on oil) which is dead shellfish?

[missedmyappointment]

I don't understand how something made of dead shellfish can be called vegan. So how can vegan leather be plastic? ( question arising from other thread I don't want to derail)

Because the creatures weren't killed to make the product.

Cows arnt killed for milk it still doesn't make milk vegan

Definition of vegan is to avoid animal exploitation as far as possible and practicable. I don’t think we are exploiting the zooplankton of millions of years ago by using oil.

It's often made from plants. Think about who is paying to wrote and print articles saying that most is from plastic- the implication being that it is cheap or inferior to lovely natural buttery, high quality leather.

It's the same reason the fur industry are positioning themselves as a lovely natural, biodegradable, sustainable product. Because Marketing.

Because the shellfish died of natural causes after a long and happy life? Same with the dinosaurs, they weren't killed/exploited for their oil it's just a natural byproduct of their lives.

Because they died a million years ago of natural causes and became oil by nature.
It’s still not ideal, eco-wise, many vegans prefer other more sustainable fabrics such as bamboo, hemp or pineapple leather.

No but that is because they are tortured for it. Vegans aren’t too keen on that.

To be honest you can ask this for every single thing used by vegans or vegetarians. All they/we can do is our best in an imperfect world.

I’m vegetarian. What is the plastic and all other bits on my lawnmower made of? No idea. Landlord says I have to cut my grass though.

There is nothing in this world that is a pure product that has not harmed anyone. So I do my best.

Why or how is plastic made of shellfish? They certainly aren't caught or farmed for that are they?!
You can get leather alternatives make of wood bark, fruit and veg skins etc. I guess if it was made of dead shells and stuff from the bottom of the sea it's still not vegan.
Maybe I'm missing something but either something is having animal derivatives or not. If it does have it then it shouldn't be called vegan.

It’s not about animal derivatives per se @BobbyBiscuits. It’s about exploitation of animals.

If you include things which derive from the natural life and death of animals that never had any human contact whatsoever, vegans also wouldn't be able to walk on quite a bit of the soil/rock...

Yes they are. What do you think happens to the male calves? They don't make milk so are therefore not profitable. Many of them become veal....

Plastic is made from oil. Oil is made from millions of years old dead things

I don't think anyone is seriously worried about plankton that died of natural causes millions of years ago.😂

I don't suppose vegans worry about living in a limestone house either.

Brilliant !

Tortured?
For christ-'s sake that's the daftest thing I've read since Noah was a lad!

Surely you're exploiting the environment as well as the animals that eat that plankton?

The plankton is millions of years old and now oil, it can’t be eaten.

Vegan leather isn't actually one material. It's a group of materials that are designed/processed to have similar aesthetic and behaviours as leather. A bit like how saying "metal" describes the type, but you have multiple materials within that category

<dusts off A-level Geology notes>

Oil is not made from shellfish. It’s made from plant matter in the Carboniferous period that’s been squashed and heated underground for millions of years.
Limestone is made from shellfish/plankton.

I think you need to consider your use of the word torture.

I say this as someone whose relatives were tortured during WWII.

I'm not a vegan, but some of the treatment of farm animals is certainly what we would consider inhumane treatment of prisoners if it was applied to humans. What about the life of a battery hen or pig who live in a tiny cage and are never let out?

It's very variable in farming, some animals live a good life in nice surroundings and the farmers genuinely care about looking after them well. I'm not against eating meat myself as long as the animals are well treated, but in some cases I think the vegans have a point.

Don't come up with ridiculous reasons why vegans are hypocritical, instead question whether you genuinely feel using animal products is ethical. If you can say yes to that then you don't need to prove vegans are wrong with some spurious argument about fossilised plankton.

Agree @Haveanaiceday

I have no intention of becoming vegan, but I hate these ridiculous strawman arguments that are always levelled. This particular one is absurd.

@missmollygreen ah, I get you. Sorry, I wasn't very good at science at school! 🙃