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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think dressage is cruel and also ludicrous?

107 replies

itstheendoftheworldasweknowitnow · 23/07/2024 20:14

Prompted by Charlotte DuJardin’s suspension today. What a ridiculous sport dressage is - and how cruel to the poor horse who doesn’t want to mince around anyway. They always look so uncomfortable doing it. At least jumping and racing seem like something a horse would enjoy or do naturally.

OP posts:
Maddy70 · 23/07/2024 21:06

Gulbekian · 23/07/2024 20:36

A question for those in the know: Is jumping actually something that horses do "naturally"? I have somehow always thought that they avoid it if possible because of the risk of injury.

Yes. My horse is never in the same field two mornings running. She jumps wherever she wants to go

EddieSweety · 23/07/2024 21:10

AllProperTeaIsTheft · 23/07/2024 20:32

Dressage is supposed to be an extension of natural movements - you can see horses doing many of them alone in the field. It should be developed slowly over many years and was conceived as a training foundation that would give you a strong, sensitive, supple horse for anything else you wanted to do. Think of it like yoga or callisthenics for horses.

But humans choose to do yoga or calisthenics for themselves. Horses don't choose to get someone to train them to do dressage.

I’ve never managed to make my horses do something they don’t want to. They are a lot stronger and short tempered than me 😂

Dr13Hadley · 23/07/2024 21:10

YourOpinionIsWrong · 23/07/2024 20:45

Horses are prey animals and they are on their feet within minutes of being born. They have to run fast and jump obstacles to survive in case a megalodon or a butterfly or an umbrella is after them.

Or a plastic bag, puddle, box, rabbit, bird, their own shadow..........

HipHopanonymous · 23/07/2024 21:12

Dr13Hadley · 23/07/2024 21:10

Or a plastic bag, puddle, box, rabbit, bird, their own shadow..........

You missed out the true predator of horses...the leaf blowing gently in the breeze but EXPOSING THE WRONG COLOUR UNDERSIDE

LammasEve · 23/07/2024 21:12

Jumping and racing are way more cruel than dressage done well, but there are some really horrific "training " practises in dressage at all levels. I don't recommend anyone looks any of them up, but dressage done well and with no force or gadgets is a joy to watch.

As for horses having to flee from umbrellas - umbrellas are ok, it's sparrows they have to be wary of. Nasty little feathery horse-eating monsters, sparrows 🤣

ExitPursuedByABare · 23/07/2024 21:15

Things that aren’t there anymore are also very very scary.

Prawncow · 23/07/2024 21:21

I think that if you put a camera on those at the highest level of this sport, 24/7, you’d be able to charge all of them with animal cruelty within a month max. The methods they use to achieve the performances they get from horses don’t stand up to scrutiny.

Serencwtch · 23/07/2024 21:21

At the lower levels 'dressage' is flatwork training so the very basic movements are what kids do in riding school.
Flatwork training is important for all ridden horses. You need 'dressage' in showjumping eg to adjust stride, lead etc.

Dressage at the highest levels or Grand Prix is horrific & I'm glad the spotlight is on the sport. Horses strapped down by nosebands, forced behind the vertical the list goes on. I think it's the worst ahead of racing & eventing.

I have horses & compete at very low levels. Horse ownership is a wonderful experience & riding & low level competing can be a part of that, however I think the time has come to see the back of horses in the Olympics.

Wrapunzel · 23/07/2024 21:28

My horse has been happier since I started dressage training (with a very talented, empathic coach). The chap that trims his feet (he's not shod) asked what was different in his routine because he was so much better behaved than normal and we worked out it was probably the training 🤷‍♀️

Serencwtch · 23/07/2024 21:30

Prawncow · 23/07/2024 21:21

I think that if you put a camera on those at the highest level of this sport, 24/7, you’d be able to charge all of them with animal cruelty within a month max. The methods they use to achieve the performances they get from horses don’t stand up to scrutiny.

Definitely and the recent trials of using cameras in the warm up arenas of big events highlights this.

itstheendoftheworldasweknowitnow · 23/07/2024 21:33

Making animals do anything for money is pretty repellent, I guess. It’s just that dressage especially seems so mean. They don’t even get the thrill of galloping. Bit of a shit life, being a horse.

OP posts:
spikeandbuffy · 23/07/2024 21:37

itstheendoftheworldasweknowitnow · 23/07/2024 21:33

Making animals do anything for money is pretty repellent, I guess. It’s just that dressage especially seems so mean. They don’t even get the thrill of galloping. Bit of a shit life, being a horse.

Some do. I didn't compete at very high levels but did hack, jump etc
Some dressage horses are regularly turned out to do as they please. Best vet, physio, dental care etc
My friend has a couple of drrsssge horses and regularly gallops both of them on a track

YourOpinionIsWrong · 23/07/2024 21:43

There’s just not enough room to gallop safely in a standard dressage arena and you lose so many marks 😞

cardibach · 23/07/2024 21:51

GrouchyKiwi · 23/07/2024 20:57

Grin

Umbrellas are a menace.

Ditto plastic bags. Evil.

EdithStourton · 23/07/2024 22:04

AgnesX · 23/07/2024 20:41

I hate anything where animals have to perform. All that guff about the relationship between the human and the animals 🙄

You might want to try it.

Having a good working bond with an animal is incredibly rewarding, and the animal loves it too. Riding a happy horse, training with a happy dog, bloody brilliant.

spikeandbuffy · 23/07/2024 22:10

YourOpinionIsWrong · 23/07/2024 21:43

There’s just not enough room to gallop safely in a standard dressage arena and you lose so many marks 😞

They do tend to also frown when you jump the white boards Grin

YourOpinionIsWrong · 23/07/2024 22:17

spikeandbuffy · 23/07/2024 22:10

They do tend to also frown when you jump the white boards Grin

That’s the real cruelty of dressage. That and an unnecessarily literal interpretation of walking. And geometry!

Serencwtch · 23/07/2024 22:31

YourOpinionIsWrong · 23/07/2024 22:17

That’s the real cruelty of dressage. That and an unnecessarily literal interpretation of walking. And geometry!

Wait hold on?! If all the things wrong in dressage blue tongue, hyper flexion etc you think the white boards are the work of the devil. Are you my old pony? He hated white boards

Maverickess · 23/07/2024 22:42

Serencwtch · 23/07/2024 21:21

At the lower levels 'dressage' is flatwork training so the very basic movements are what kids do in riding school.
Flatwork training is important for all ridden horses. You need 'dressage' in showjumping eg to adjust stride, lead etc.

Dressage at the highest levels or Grand Prix is horrific & I'm glad the spotlight is on the sport. Horses strapped down by nosebands, forced behind the vertical the list goes on. I think it's the worst ahead of racing & eventing.

I have horses & compete at very low levels. Horse ownership is a wonderful experience & riding & low level competing can be a part of that, however I think the time has come to see the back of horses in the Olympics.

I agree with the comments on high level dressage unfortunately. Dressage is basically training, and competing should be showing the level of training and communication between horse and rider, sadly I think the art of this, of truly training a horse well, communication with the horse and riding sympathetically has been overtaken by wanting results and quick 'fixes' have become more common.

I used to compete at lower levels and it was more about doing your best bit of schooling in front of someone you've paid to criticise you so you can work on that criticism and create a better partnership.

Racing and anything to do with jumping are more immediately dangerous, but I'm not sure these horses at top levels in dressage are always trained using the best methods unfortunately.

Although pp do have a point when they say that forcing a horse to do anything it doesn't want to is nigh on impossible, they weigh half a ton or more, have metal feet and can move sideways at speeds in excess of 40mph if they desire. It's not an argument you're going to win. It's done through cooperation.

Also that horses do perform these movements naturally, they are enhanced and taught on cue, but I've seen all types and breeds pull these moves in the field, under saddle when excited or spooking, playing etc, or just bimbling about.

Being honest though, when my horse started to get older and he retired, I did start to question a lot of things and felt conflicted. On the one hand is it fair to use animals in this way, but the other that we as humans, have developed and cultivated the relationship with these animals and I think as we have encouraged their dependency on us with breeding etc, we owe it to them to meet the different needs we've created in them that can't be met in the wild.

YOYOK · 23/07/2024 22:42

Prawncow · 23/07/2024 21:21

I think that if you put a camera on those at the highest level of this sport, 24/7, you’d be able to charge all of them with animal cruelty within a month max. The methods they use to achieve the performances they get from horses don’t stand up to scrutiny.

Absolutely but people don’t want to acknowledge that.

Clueless2000 · 23/07/2024 22:45

I’m asking for it posting this comment on here but ahhh, fuck it…I don’t think humans have any business sitting on a horse full stop.

TizerorFizz · 23/07/2024 23:00

So what happens to them then? Let the breeds die out? I love racing and I’m not apologizing for it. I especially love seeing athletic horses jumping at speed. There are accidents, as there are with sporting human beings, but I don’t see horses or dogs as the same as us. They need us so in return they give something back. Most people with pets or competition horses get this. If others don’t like it, too bad in my view. Competition horses are well cared for and racehorses are not fearful! Of what? They enjoy what they do or they would refuse to do it. As indeed some do.

Smidgers · 23/07/2024 23:02

I’ve had horses for many years and been on a few yards before eventually having my own stables and land. I’ve seen things that have given me nightmares the way some people treat horses especially in riding schools. Some “trainers” (and I mean big names in the equestrian world) shouldn’t be near animals imo. Charlotte Dujardin being one of them. This isn’t the first time her training methods have been questioned, it’s just the first time someone has had the balls to speak out about it. “An error of judgement” no, it wasn’t an error of judgement, she battered a horse around the legs and this isn’t unusual with some “trainers”. She isn’t the only one, there’s lots out there like her unfortunately.

Some dog trainers are the same. They batter an animal into submission or use “aids” to get the result they want. It’s disgusting.

Smidgers · 23/07/2024 23:05

Competition horses are well cared for and racehorses are not fearful!

I have rescued ex racers. I can assure you they ARE fearful of a lot of things depending on the yard they came from. It has sometimes taken me over a year to gain the trust of a horse who has been abused. You are deluded if you think otherwise.

Eyesopenwideawake · 23/07/2024 23:07

cardibach · 23/07/2024 21:51

Ditto plastic bags. Evil.

My horse spotted a snake on the ground cunningly disguised as an old lead rope and tried to jump into my arms, screaming “Mummmmeeeee, heeelllp”.

Twat.