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It's time that woke and identity politics ends, but not before the disabled get their turn

71 replies

SensibleGuy · 23/07/2024 17:04

Hi,

I am the least likely person to agree with the woke agenda or identity politics. We all know that this insidious craze has resulted in some serious crazy shi* in recent years. Yes, various historical injustices clearly needed to be fought and corrected, but identity politics plays into the hands of the far right and divides us like never before. It is one of the many reasons why Brexit happened and that Trump will likely win later this year (probably on a landslide.)

I've never been a fan of diversity targets or quotas either (for many reasons.) But given that many groups have already benefitted from such things, why should other groups continue to be excluded?

It always amazed me that disabled people are excluded from the diversity and inclusion agenda. Even when they are included by the BBC or mainstream media, they are only included as an afterthought. This is despite the fact that they are arguably the most economically and socially disadvantaged group of all. People talk about female or black (or Asian) presidents/prime ministers or CEOs, but the chances of a US president/British prime minister - whether white/black or male/female and having a clear or obvious disability is basically zero.

You only have to look at the current make up of our parliament. The media takes great pride in telling us how diverse it is, but there are, at most, only a handful of mps (out of 650) with any kind of disability. And that's before you get to the more controversial subject of mild v severe and visible v invisible disabilities.

I realise it's a complex subject. Take autism. If the Labour party goes ahead and mandates disability reporting for all medium and large UK companies, the cynic in me says that only those who are 'high masking' individuals will benefit. Meanwhile, those who aren't able to mask very well/at all will still have trouble gaining employment. It think such a scenario will be true of all disabilities, where those with dyslexia/dyscalculia etc. will be employed over those who need more significant adjustments and adaptations. I hope I'm wrong, but I seriously doubt it.

The main problem is representation in the media. This is why the abuse of disabled people and the disability wage gap etc. are seldom discussed. We still have a situation where the likes of the BBC etc. still seem reluctant to move forward with disability with the sort of fervour and determination that is the case with gender or race. As with our parliament, disability rights are still seen as (largely) optional.

This was summed up by a recent article I read in the Independent. A woman who worked for a company who was holding a diversity and inclusion board meeting, said that one of the senior board members mentioned how important such things are to corporate and societal progression. But when the woman mentioned disability, he simply laughed dismissively.

I've noticed this phenomenon when talking about violence and hate speech. Whenever anyone is violent or openly ableist to disabled people, most people claim it derives from genuine ignorance. Of course, were this to be said of gendered or racist behaviour, the anti-racists/feminists would rightly be livid.

You only have to look at this forum. There is no doubt that the moderators do a very difficult job admirably, but whenever any discussions come up about PIPs or disability benefits the usual ableist posters come out of the woodwork, spouting their vitriol. Similarly, when the topics turn to autism, particularly non-verbal autistic males are often painted by some as sexual predators and rapists (numerous studies show that it is virtually unheard of for non-verbal autistic males to commit violent or sexual crimes.) The relationship section of this site is also a case in point, where there are numerous threads frequently insulting (and generalising about) autistic partners (mostly males), the vast majority of whom - surprise surprise - are undiagnosed or are simply diagnosed by the OP (or other posters on the thread.)

The frequent threads about autistic people making excuses about bad behaviour are a case in point. Yes, I have no doubt that some do (though, from experience, it's not normally they themselves, who do this, but usually their parent(s)) I also have a strong hunch that the few who do this themselves are mainly self-diagnosed.) But, anyway, in the age of self-entitlement and victim culture, why should they be singled out? Afterall, haven't many high profile politicians and celebrities used their protected group status (of various kinds) as a go-to-excuse for bad behaviour. You see this a lot even on Mumsnet. Like with disability, it's a minority of people, but still...

Which takes me back to my original point. Even though I am neither a fan of identity politics nor the woke agenda, it is clearly here to stay for the foreseeable. If it's good enough for other groups, surely it's only right that disabled are invited to the party. Starting from now.

OP posts:
SensibleGiy · 23/07/2024 19:27

@XChrome

Sadly, that's true.

Fullyflavoured · 23/07/2024 19:29

Why have you Name changed?

miniaturepixieonacid · 23/07/2024 19:30

It seems inevitable to me that disabled people will be underrepresented in most professions. Being a woman or an ethnic minority cannot make you less able to do a job than a white male (certain manual jobs requiring a huge amount of strength perhaps excepted). But a large proportion of disabled people will be physically or intellectually unable to do the majority of jobs. Not all disabled people and not all jobs, of course. There are large numbers of highly successful disabled people in a wide range of professions. But there are enough who cannot reach that level to mean that they will always be an underrepresented sector in most workforces.

I don't know how that could be changed. Anyone with a disability who is capable of a job on paper is automatically invited to interview already.

SensibleGiy · 23/07/2024 19:33

@miniaturepixieonacid I see your point, but for most disabilities (and disability levels) productivity levels are higher than for non-disabled people.

IDontHateRainbows · 23/07/2024 19:37

MereDintofPandiculation · 23/07/2024 17:27

People with disabilities are the only group entitled to a job interview if they meet the requirements in the advert.

Yes, people with disabilities do have a rough time of it, and we see some dreadful examples in the news, but I don't think it's quite accurate to say "disabled people are excluded from the diversity and inclusion agenda."

A lot of companies are beginning to introduce guaranteed interview for BAME applicants now, my former company did.

miniaturepixieonacid · 23/07/2024 19:54

SensibleGiy · 23/07/2024 19:33

@miniaturepixieonacid I see your point, but for most disabilities (and disability levels) productivity levels are higher than for non-disabled people.

Oh, really? I didn't know that and find it surprising. Ok, I take it back then!

SensibleGiy · 23/07/2024 19:57

@miniaturepixieonacid I think it's partly because they are more eager to prove themselves.

I tried self-employment (selling online) but it didn't really work for me because unless you have a pile of cash to invest it's so hard.

keffie12 · 23/07/2024 20:09

What is the meaning of woke, to you? The meaning of woke to me is this, below..... If that makes you think I'm extreme, so what. I'm happy to be woke!

It's time that woke and identity politics ends, but not before the disabled get their turn
SensibleGiy · 23/07/2024 20:09

crackofdoom · 23/07/2024 19:16

I think that would probably be more accurately covered by the term "pinkwashing".

By the way, it's VIRTUE signalling, not VIRTUAL signalling....🙄

I would consider pinkwashing as an extension of virtue signalling. For me it's all about large multinationals protecting their own interests (and profits) and not about genuine change.

Thanks for correcting my typo. I hate getting things wrong! BTW with an ellipsis you need three full stops instead of four. 😀

SensibleGiy · 23/07/2024 20:11

@keffie12 Good for you. Kindness is always good. I don't think that makes you extreme.😀

haveacat · 23/07/2024 20:13

’the chances of a US president/British prime minister - whether white/black or male/female and having a clear or obvious disability is basically zero.’

You are wrong. Gordon Brown is blind in one eye (Prime Minister) and President Roosevelt was in a wheelchair.

SensibleGiy · 23/07/2024 20:17

@haveacat Yep, I've already discussed both. Roosevelt (sadly) concealed his disability in public for political reasons. He didn't use his wheelchair in public (only in private). As for Gordon Brown, as I said I suppose some disabilities (and severities thereof) don't carry as much stigma or discrimination as others.

coupdetonnerre · 23/07/2024 21:44

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ at the poster's request.

OneFrenchEgg · 24/07/2024 06:43

SensibleGiy · 23/07/2024 19:33

@miniaturepixieonacid I see your point, but for most disabilities (and disability levels) productivity levels are higher than for non-disabled people.

Please could you share your source? It would be very useless for some stuff I'm doing.

paradisecircus · 24/07/2024 07:04

Why do you need all the lame stuff about 'woke' to make your points about disability? Your argument would be much sharper (and your post about a quarter of its length) if you just stated it clearly without all the unnecessary disclaimers.

KewBridgeSteamMuseum · 24/07/2024 07:18

haveacat · 23/07/2024 20:13

’the chances of a US president/British prime minister - whether white/black or male/female and having a clear or obvious disability is basically zero.’

You are wrong. Gordon Brown is blind in one eye (Prime Minister) and President Roosevelt was in a wheelchair.

Theresa May has type 1 diabetes and was quite matter of fact about it.
John Major has restricted mobility following a car crash in his youth but was very quiet about it.

Q2C4 · 24/07/2024 07:21

haveacat · 23/07/2024 20:13

’the chances of a US president/British prime minister - whether white/black or male/female and having a clear or obvious disability is basically zero.’

You are wrong. Gordon Brown is blind in one eye (Prime Minister) and President Roosevelt was in a wheelchair.

And Theresa May has type 1 diabetes (diagnosed in 2013).

sashh · 24/07/2024 07:24

David Blunkett?
Jack Straw?
Gordon Brown?

Dwight Eisenhower?
Abraham Lincoln ?
James Madison?
Franklin D. Roosevelt?

Catsmere · 24/07/2024 07:36

SockQueen · 23/07/2024 18:17

Franklin D. Roosevelt, one of the most well-known and well-respected Presidents of the USA, was in a wheelchair most of his life.

Edited

Longest-serving President, too - four terms. His disability was well known.

Anonymouseposter · 24/07/2024 07:45

There have been MPs with visual impairment (David Blunket was totally blind) and also with extreme hearing impairment. It seems on the surface that there are fewer MPs with disabilities at present but we don’t know whether there are MPs that have disabilities that aren’t immediately obvious.

IDontHateRainbows · 24/07/2024 09:01

Teresa May has T1 Diabetes, that's a disability. So there's a PM we've had with a disability right there.

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