No holidays - carbon footprint

[Teacherbee85]

I've noticed recently whenever anyone posts about flying to go on holiday they tend to get jumped on by people saying it's bad for the environment.

I don't think I know any of these people in real life - everyone I know goes on holiday at least twice a year.

But on mumsnet a lot of people seem to have stopped due to environmental reasons.

If this is you, when did you make the decision? How do you deal with family and friends who so still choose to fly regularly?

I am also a regular flyer, but the argument about the planes flying or not doesn't make sense.
If less people fly, fewer flights will be put on due to less demand.

It's about recognising what can make an impact and what can't.
It's about being informed and making informed choices.
People who care about the environment should be aware of the tiny/minimal impact a person's holiday will have (if they aren't flying to the US or China). Instead of getting hung up on something that doesn't matter, divert your energy to something which does. I'm in no way saying that it's best to do nothing. I said several things in my post above about how to make a positive meaningful impact. People seem intent on parroting that "we must stop flying to save the environment", without actually looking at what the figures are for carbon emissions. I don't see how that's remotely helpful.
And to be honest, it's sad. The world is beautiful. There are many cultures that benefit/need tourism. Also too many people work themselves into the ground. I just don't think the rhetoric being parroted in this thread is useful to the green initiative or helpful to many people's mental health.

I assume you don’t have children either?

I have given up flying. I've not given up holidays or.travelling abroad.

It's not an 'either or' - give up flying or take other carbon reduction measures. It's 'both and'.

I don't fly. I do have solar panels, an electric car, a share in a wind farm, a meadow instead of a lawn, good double glazing, and a substantial vegetable patch. I eat mainly locally and seasonally -. not entirely, becauae some things just dont grow locally, but I'm conscious of and limit more distant optioms. For example rice I'll buy imported but berries I won't - i grow those myself, eat them in season and preserve the surplus for.the rest of the year. I'd have difficulty cutting my beef consumption, given that I've been vegetarian for almost half a century (and have a dairy allergy, so am completely cow free).

I have only flown once in 20 years. We need to get a grip on the climate crisis because things are looking very difficult for our children. Even climate scientists who have been optimistic are expressing they are scared about what they are seeing with temperatures in the last year.

Don't fly or fly less. Cut down on meat and buying stuff especially clothes.
If everyone tries to make a difference 80% of the time we will make an impact.

Saying China builds power stations so I don't have to do anything is no longer an option.

I forgot the well you had children brigade. They'll be along soon to say their usual crud.

Just do something because things are going to get very difficult.

Yes, as a family we've cut down on flights for this reason - not flown since 2018, although we are doing a short haul trip this year. We've been abroad but done drive/ ferry or train on purpose.

I will fly again, as there's places I want to see, we're time limited by work and school holidays. But definitely cut down for environmental reasons. Also we are mainly plant based, have solar panels, 1 electric car.

Does annoy me when friends and family take multiple flights per year without a thought, but I don't ever mention it. Feels like you can't criticise unless you're greta levels of perfect!

But that flight is still going to go ahead whether you're on it or not lol

If enough people stop flying there will be less flights lol

@ForGreyKoala there's about 8000 planes in the sky right now.

If you choose not to fly to Costa Del Sol next week, someone else sure will be sat in that seat.

There are more flights in the sky than ever, with more and more people flying every year. It's documented that there are about 200 million more flying passengers since the pandemic.

So no, what you're doing by not flying to Benidorm and the other select few who are also not flying, it's not making the blinders bit of difference, lol

Blindest*

I have a friend who is in the Green Party and doesn't fly. But she also doesn't work so can take three weeks out of her life to drive to Europe in a van. If you've only got a week off at a time that's just nit possible.

I was looking at holidays a few days ago and was surprised at the number of places that listed all the "environmentally-friendly" measures that various hotels were claiming.
Talk about greenwashing! I was almost expecting some pop-up condemning me for wanting to fly to visit these places. It was all very off-putting and "worthy".
Personally I do not think enough attention is focused on the damage to the environment caused by the internet, e-mail generation and storage and cloud computing. Almost nobody mentions this.

I met a guy about fifteen years ago that traveled for two days by coach rather than take a three hour flight, because of the environmental impact - so they do exist. It was for study rather than a holiday, but I'm pretty sure he wouldn't fly for a holiday.

And very few people I know take two holidays per year. Many don't get one every year.

I'm going on 4 holidays this year. One is by plane, the others are by train. Last year I had 2 holidays, one by plane and one by train. The year before that I had 3 holidays, all by train. The year before that, one by car and 2 by train.

So, not perfect but better than 12 trips by plane.

We don't fly, mainly because it's too much bother, we are getting a motorhome instead...

Not all employers are the same. Mine actively encourages employees to travel by train to work meetings in Europe even if that means extra time spent out of the office.

I am making an effort to reduce flying but won't eliminate it completely. My family lives abroad, 1.5 hours by plane and over 7 hours by train. I visit them about 3 times a year, so I am trying to reduce flying to once a year or less and take the train the other times. I'll fly to other holiday destinations but am eager to take the train to any destinations where it's possible and doable.

I'd be genuinely interested to know on what basis you consider yourself to be environmentally aware?

We haven't stopped going on holiday but have tried to cut down flying. So instead of flying for all our holidays we might do one week in the UK, our main holiday tends to be a ferry then cycle touring/public transport. I also sometimes have to fly for work so try to have a few days holiday at the same time to double dip the flights. So this year it looks like a week in andalucia (work flights from a trip to seville), a week in the lake district, two weeks in europe (ferry/bike/train), a long weekend in Paris (work flights) and a week in Spain (proper holiday with flights).

We also try to reduce our footprint in other ways to make up for the flying!

I know someone who refuses to go on holiday at all for environmental reasons. However, he also drives a big gas guzzling car and lives in a massive house with a pool. His carbon footprint is probably through the roof on heating his house and pool and pottering round in his car.

if more people make individual changes it’s adds up. Most of the carbon expended is down to our individual choices added up together. You can make changes individually as well as strategically. But having looked at our individual carbon footprint, flying was by far the biggest impact. Having informed ourselves of the facts, we made the decision that we couldn’t justify it. We do a lot of other strategic stuff too.

Can I ask why you feel the need to argue against the position people have taken to reduce flying? What difference does it make to you? I am curious because this dynamic happens a lot.

I don’t eat meat and people used to tell me all the reasons my choice not to eat meat wouldn’t make any difference. Why? It makes no difference to anyone else if I dont eat meat, don’t fly, drive an electric car, don’t drink much alcohol, yet people will often feel the need to comment on my choices (without me starting a conversation about it) and try and dissuade me. My only theory so far is that it highlights cognitive dissonance/guilt and/or shame, which is uncomfortable to sit with.

I don’t fly because I just can’t bring myself to now i know the facts and have made the link. I know those flights continue but that doesn’t matter. I know I can look my DC in the eye when they are older and say ‘I did what I could’.

But, if enough people did stop or cut down on flying then the aviation industry would adjust the number of flights accordingly. They are not going to run half empty planes. They will not run at a loss. So eventually there would be higher prices and less flights. Eventually it would make a difference.

But that’s not my goal, what will be will be, like with meat, I couldn’t knowingly contribute to suffering of animals so I don’t. It’s about my own personal moral code.

I don’t fly because I hate flying. I have solar panels and 2 electric cars but not for environmental reasons. It’s to save money.

Climate scientists are indeed scared. They know more than the average Joe and know what’s to come. 😞 In the news today there are more dangerous heatwaves being reported. China are building renewables at a faster rate than anyone too. The UK could have been global leaders in green tech 😞

I try not to loose sleep and just do my bit. But you are right.