To wonder if a lot of the Just Stop Oil protesters are not very nice people on a personal level

[HazelSchmazel]

There are a few Just Stop Oil threads around and I've noticed that a couple of posters have stated that the protesters are not very nice people.

Which got me thinking .....

A few years ago, I was in a horrible relationship with a rather unpleasant guy - a selfish, alcoholic, abusive cheater, who treated me like dirt and ended up stealing a considerable amount of money from me. Despite being a daily meat eater, regularly flying, driving a gas guzzler, having children etc. he would regularly pontificate on saving the environment (and would castigate me on environmental grounds for having a cat - even though I'm a childless vegetarian, who never flies!). Needless to say, the whole experience made me very unhappy.

Fast forward to the present, and I gather that he is now a very active Just Stop Oil protester.

Now, I'm bracing myself to be shot down in flames, as I appreciate that of course, it's unreasonable to judge an entire movement based on one bad apple.

But could it be the case, that there is something about JSO that attracts these nasty characters? Just wondering ......

Nobody is saying you can. But you absolutely should be able to make your case before a jury, as other groups have.

It's very difficult to argue case vs case as the latest JSO arrests have largely been under legislation introduced recently to target protests with an eye on JSO specifically.

I can't think of many recent peaceful protests where journalists have been arrested while simply covering events. https://www.ft.com/content/3d634d0e-3692-4997-9bc8-a83f51d74012

It gives haters a reason to hate

Poverty kills more ' brown people' than climate change. But taking people out of poverty just leads them to want more stuff- stuff we take for granted, like fridges, cars and meat. That will then increase consumption globally. JSO need to be clear in what they are expecting of people, especially the young in terms of lifestyle, and whether theyvare prepared to take the hit. None of this ' the plane was flying anyway/ I need a new iPhone for my activism. The way to stop oil is to massively reduce overconsumption in the Developed world. So no new phones every year, no gap years tramping about Asia, massive reduction in food prices, fast fashion including clothes, makeup, polluting hair dyes, holidays abroad, driving. We can't sustain the levels of consumption we have without fossil fuels. In an ideal world, we should have enough resources for everyone to live a comfortable life. But that means taking people in the developing world out of absolute poverty but also a massive reduction in consumption in the West.

Me pointing out that sometimes other forms of transport are available for some journeys, makes me an 'urban elite'? Righto

I have no idea where you live but trotting out the 'get the train' line as if that is an immediate option to most people is very short sighted and is something city dwellers who are spoiled for public transport options often say.

Nah, because you cannot possibly be so innocent as to genuinely think other people are only not travelling by train as they did not realise they exist.

I also doubt that you are so innocent that you don't realise that crematorians and hospitals tend not to be handily located next to train stations ( the specific examples you suggested people travel to by train).

You clearly don’t if you think it’s that easy.

For repeatedly stopping people getting to work, stopping emergency services getting through, for creating chaos, for putting themselves and encouraging others to out themselves in a dangerous position? Yes they should go to prison.

They haven’t gone to prison for peacefully protesting. The fact that you have to lie about why they are in prison, means you know you don’t have a point.

Hilarious that they didn’t give a shit about stopping people going to work, losing money, getting to funerals or to the hospital to say goodbye to loved ones. But then their families expect sympathy because they will kiss out on some weddings now they are facing the consequences.

If you can’t see hypocrisy, then you are blind.

What you are talking about is mass co-operative behaviour across populations.

Given that, JSO might want to reflect on the truth that, ' People don't co-operate with those who are against them.'

The surest way to not get people to behave as you wish is to piss them off, and position yourself as against them ( evil car drivers!). That's pretty much as effective as Hilary Clinton calling Trump supporters ' deplorables'. Way to win over those you need to vote for you!

They haven’t gone to prison for peacefully protesting. The fact that you have to lie about why they are in prison, means you know you don’t have a point.

Well said.

To make your case, you would still have to show sufficient comparability, in terms of the legal process, of JSO to the statue removers in terms of the specific aspect you are talking about. Can you do that? Without that your case lacks credibility.

Its a good thing legislation was brought in with a view of JSO. That's how the legal system should work. Its like bringing legislation to ban XL bullies. If there is a new cause of harm to the public, its good law makers take action to address that.

If you can't find a comparable example in terms of protests ( which you still haven't) you could even look at criminals beyond activists. Do you know of any criminals, who are repeat offenders, escalating in their crimes, committing new crimes whilst on bail and showing no remorse but stating a clear intent to keep on committing crimes, who did NOT get an increased sentence on those they have had previously?

I see the hypocrisy, yes. I don't agree with the length of the sentence. We are just not going to agree so I'm not sure why we're still trying to have a discussion. I'll leave it here, and I wish you a really lovely day.

So you agree they should have seen prison? How long do you think?

If you agree they should have seen prison, I don’t understand your point?

You claimed one has never done anything except plan and encourage people to risk themselves and others at these protests. But didn’t bother saying which one and couldnt answer why you thought someone planning an illegal shouldn’t go to prison.

You won’t answer who was going to take responsibility for encouraging them up the gantry if one of them died.

You then lied and said they were jailed for peaceful protest, now saying it’s actually the length of the sentence that’s the problem.

You think these people are doing the right thing but can see the hypocrisy. That would suggest they are also, probably, hypocrites in other areas of their life and are so arrogant they don’t realise it. Like RH and his vehicles. But that’s ok.

But also think the issue is the length of sentence, not that they went to prison. But they are doing the right thing?

Exactly. They are not doing anything to help the environment because of this. They are enabling people to turn up for a bit of a ruck, cause a huge fuss, use public money to clean up after them and say they are doing it for the environment.

What about damage to paintings? Statues? All permissible?

I recycle like mad and don’t buy much stuff. I would wager that a quick look at these protesters’ lifestyles would reveal them to be arch hypocrites. When I saw the mess left at Glastonbury I was speechless. Ok, so the rubbish would have been generated anyway, even if they had taken it all home, but the single-use tents? How can people be waving save the planet flags (probably bought from China) and ignoring this?

Oh my gosh please just leave it, it's getting weird now!

Whats getting weird?

You keeping saying that’s are untrue and then contradicting yourself as an attempt to make JSO sound like heroes that are just being targeted.

Yes, that is weird.

posting a reply to someone then insulting them for responding back is also weird

see also 'paedophile hunters'

Poor Cressida?

She is an anti social domestic terrorist!

Put her in a different body, particularly that of a male and there wouldnt be this sympathy for her.

Unbelievable.

Exactly this

And while the focus is on ambulances and the whataboutery, there will have been countless delays in carers getting to their clients, those clients sitting in shit and piss because they're waiting for their carer to come

What about blood and organ transports

What about basic hospital transport

What about Social Workers visiting children in danger in a timely fashion

What about children, the disabled and the elderly getting services delivered to them?

Selfish selfish selfish.

Its far far cheaper than train

My OH is paying 1k a month at the moment for train fare to work, plus bus to get to the station, plus oyster while he is at work

Same expense in petrol is around 400 a month, add on tax and insurance and you're looking at 600 max even when the basic replacements like tyres are added in

People just dont know what they're talking about

In May this year the High Court ruled that anti-protest measures introduced by the government earlier this year are unlawful. It was secondary legislation forced through. The Government appealed the decision but that appeal is currently paused as the new attorney general has said "Looking inwards, we will seek to promote the highest standards in how we legislate – seeking to increase accessibility and certainty in how we make law, including not abusing the use of secondary legislation."

The onus is on you to provide an example of protesters being jailed for "conspiracy to cause a public nuisance" or actually "causing a public nuisance" which are in any way comparable. You can't because they are the longest sentences given out under this or previous legislation with the sentences given out in 2023 for causing a public nuisance to JSO activists being the previous longest sentences.

We have a comedian in the house

Most ‘progressives’ usually are nasty. They look down upon people, scorn at them for being thick despite possessing no ability of their own to think for themselves, are utterly deluded about reality, and threatening and abusive towards anyone who has a different point of view.

The just stop oil people are an accurate representation of ‘progressives’. These are the kind of people who protest to virtue signal. You would never see their kind protesting in an environment where protesting really is bravery, like in autocratic countries.

The arrogance of Cressida’s mother is something to behold. No self-awareness at all. What a waste of a posh education.

Anyone here thinking about having kids should take a good look at Cressida and her mum. Right there is the opposite of what you should aspire to.