…to think self defence laws in this country are a bit shit?

[CreativeOriginalUsername]

Prompted by a couple of shitty events over the weekend, but here it is.

I walk my dog, on my own, as a young ish looking woman. I am petite and have very little strength.

Yesterday I encountered an aggressive (off lead) dog who tried to attack my (on lead) puppy. I kicked it in the end to get it off my dog. Male owner became aggressive towards me. Fortunately there were other people around so he walked away in the end.

Today, I was driven at on a country road by a group of (possibly drunk) idiots who thought it would be funny to try and veer me into the bushes. They then threw a bottle of something at a couple further down the lane.

Anyway, it made me realise that there’s fuck all I could do if I was actually attacked. Dark nights are coming which means I’ll be walking my dog in the dark, alone. So I had a look at what you can legally do in the UK in self defence and in short, the answer seems to be fuck all.

Tasers, stun guns and mace type self defence items are completely banned, you can’t even carry them. The police’s helpful advice is to carry a rape alarm - But how much help is that when you’re walking alone down a country lane with nobody about? You cant exactly noise an attacker into submission.

AIBU to think we should have more options available to us than just “make a noise and hope for the best”?

But what options do you want? To be allowed to carry a knife to stab someone who attacked you?

You're allowed to use reasonable force and, although I accept you may be overpowered if you’re petite, save for walking your dog armed what do you wish to be allowed to do?

How would you suggest we do it instead?

All options are lethal in the wrong hands. Its good the UK has a no nonsense approach or people would be getting tazered for fun left right and centre. A rape alarm is pretty effective.

What self defence options do you want OP?

You say yourself you have very little strength so you'll essentially be arming someone else to cause you harm.

Yeah, women under 5 foot 4 should be allowed to carry stun guns, tasers and mace. Great plan.

You do realise that an attacker can still overpower you, then use them against you, right?

Or if you're saying that everyone should be allowed to walk around carrying, they won't need to - because they will also have weapons.

Not to mention, probably not a great idea to try to taser someone while they're driving. For all sorts of reasons...

Loud noise will deter a lot of attackers - many rely on you being so unprepared to defend yourself in any way that any kind of defiance at all will put them off. Previous posters are quite right about weapons as well - if you don't have any self defence skills and aren't particularly strong, or fit enough to outrun an attacker, the most likely outcome is that the attacker takes the weapon away from you and hurts you with it.

If you want to feel more confident when walking alone, find a local martial arts school and enrol in some classes that will teach you hand to hand self defence (and get your fitness levels up to be able to outrun someone) but most crucially will train your brain to respond to a physical attack with a good defensive stance and a loud shout to deter your attacker.

Carry a small sharp stick so, if attacked, who would know you didn’t just grab the nearest thing off the floor.

The law states you can defend yourself with reasonable force so if someone attacks you at night when walking your dog it wouldn’t be a little push would it, so a stick in the leg, arm, eye of your attacker could be reasonable force to allow you to get away.

At 4pm in the winter it’s dark so I walk my dog around the streets, near houses.

Keys in each hand and do some windmilling.

You can actually use self defence as a defence if you were accused of assault. People do get let off assault charges by claiming self defence.

There is a huge difference though between punching someone back If they punch you first and stabbing someone with a knife cos they shouted at you first. One is reasonable force, the other is not.

You are not permitted to have a weapon for the preemptive purpose of self defence - but you can act in self defence, and also use what is to hand.

In your second example you were in a car, what would you have used to ‘protect’ yourself from a dangerous driver and/or bottles being thrown ?

A rape alarm just makes a noise, and if remote won’t have anyone close by to come - but makes an ear screeching noise being uncomfortable to remain close by - plus both you and an attacker were near, so there may or may not be someone else in earshot

As you’re concerned look into some form
of self defence class - and ideally they are about getting away from the dangerous situation

Rather than think about possible self defence weapons think more about what you reasonably have with you - and what if it gets taken from you ?
If you’re close to your home or car and feel vunerable then get your keys out - don’t plan some great stabby battle, just scratch, if you would think to use mace/pepperspray then would an aerosol be more practical in your bag such as sun screen spray, antiperspirant, hairspray etc and are not fun to get in the face

When my relative was worried about this, she got a special canister of horrible smelly, dye covered sticky spray.

I can't remember what it was called but I will see if I can find it.

I'm not sure I can find it but if you Google "self defense spray" there are various options.

Airhorn? Make a lot of noise. I have a large 'intimidating' dog, and local dealers avoid me at night when walking her. Even if they see her during the daylight hours and know she's friendly. She stood in front of me one night when she wasn't happy until a bloke was well past me.

Carry a brick? No one could prove you didn't just pick it up off the floor in a self defence situation.

I've taken to dressing like a man on my late night dog walks. I wear trackies and a big hoodie and just skulk like a teenager, I've been left be. I've actually had women cross the road to avoid me and felt really bad!

A travel can of hairspray and a lighter. I am not being serious though, but I can understand the concern.

Trouble is, if you allow some weapons (and all the items you mentioned are), then others will carry them as self-defence too. Isn't that why more people are carrying knives? Because they are worried about other people carrying knives.

Plus, the police get trained in how to appropriately use such items.

Airhorns and flamethrowers!! Keep them coming!

I’m sorry you had those experiences, it sounds very scary.

You’re supposed to raise the alarm to the attacker’s ears, drop it at their feet and run. It’s to disorientate them to buy you valuable seconds rather than alert people to come and help you.

I’ve been attacked by a group of strangers. Thinking goes out the window, especially if it’s very sudden. Even if you did have a weapon you might not have time to reach for it. Unfortunately I think your best bet is to walk somewhere with houses around so you can bang on doors and shout for help if you need to, that’s what happened to me. I somehow pushed one of the attackers over, got tackled down by another, somehow got back up and ran as fast as I could to the nearest house. There are self-defence courses that can help you to feel safer. Not karate chop kung fu kick type stuff, but lessons in how to temporarily disable an attacker and buy yourself time.

It shouldn’t have to be like this of course. We should be able to go wherever we want, whenever we want without being in fear for our lives. But we just have to do what we can to try to keep ourselves safe.

Suggestions:

Self defence classes. If you know what to do and practice it regularly it helps.

Keys in hand are sharp.

If walking at night maglite torches are pretty hefty.

I was going to suggest a torch, but the heavy lantern type so you can hold the handle and swing.

Alternatively what about walking with a thumb stick? Should be pretty handy to get yourself some space.

Carry a metal choke chain when out with your dog.
Great weapon and no-one can prove it's not for your dog.
😊

At what?! Being the soundtrack to your assault?

Is your puppy going to end up fairly big? That should help. I've got a large for his breed male dog who just happens to be very protective (I didn't even buy a protective breed). It means I can go for a walk wherever I want and whenever I want. The only problem is he also wants to protect other people too if he thinks they are being attacked! He once stopped a very strangley acting man from coming anywhere near me by angrily barking at him, he's normally very friendly.

The illegality of tasers, stun guns and mace (and bladed items) means other people can't carry them to use against you. And your use of them in the situations you described probably wouldn't be reasonable and proportionate anyway.

Your best 'weapon' may be a smart phone camera or dashcam, and learning to be assertive.

You could also combine it with the american rape whistle.

I'd rather get done by the police than raped or murdered.
Go for the eyes and the balls, the shins. Keys, steel toe boots (I have steel toe trainers that aren't heavy but you could kick someone hard with them and it would hurt them but not harm your foot.)
I also have a small non locking, less than 2 inch knife in my car with a solid end tip that is for that common emergency where you need to cut your seat belt and break your window. It's a legal knife with a valid legal reason. They're commonly sold for vehicle safety etc.
You could take a baseball bat to send your dogs ball further when you're walking them.