Direct report makes more than me

[houwseevryweekend]

Me and my direct report both started in at the same time for the company - we were doing the same role, both the same grade, same skills, same job, same department.

Company then made our role redundant and split the job grade into 2 different roles - with one role managing the other. We both had to interview for the role we wanted, both went for the line manager role - I got it, he didn't so I became his manager.

We've now had our salary review and because I'm his boss, noticed that not only did he get a higher % salary increase than me, his total salary is 4k higher than mine! I've spoken to my boss who hadn't realised (we're a big team) but tried to explain it saying that because he started on a higher salary than me, and they gave him a higher pay rise (to make up not getting the promotion...) - his base is now more than mine. She was non committal about resolving it. Just said to leave it with her.

What's worse is I'm also responsible for hiring more people at my grade and because they're external, they're all at a higher pay. Which pisses me off too but I understand externals get more.

However, AIBU to expect to be paid more than the person I'm managing if we both interviewed for the role and I have more budget and responsibilities and a much bigger team?

Just wondering what my options are: can HR do something like this? Feels like a pretty big issue but I don't know enough whether it's also a legal issue?

I think I would speak to ACAS and get their thoughts on it. It sounds like lunacy to me - who awards a better payrise and bonus as a consolation prize for not getting a position?! Mental.

It is absolutely sex discrimination, and even if that easn't their intention, this is certainly something you can use to get things corrected.

"The Equality Act 2010 makes it unlawful for employers to discriminate between men and women in relation to their pay and other terms of remuneration in their contract of employment, where they are doing the same or similar work."

"Your employer could be liable for a direct discrimination claim even if there was no intention to discriminate against you."

He is a man and he is being paid more than you for work of equal (or less) value. Once this has been brought to their attention, if they don't rectify it, you have a case and I'd be seeking legal advice - and letting the commpany know this.

Loads of companies try to wheedle out of sex discrimination using justifications - but how often is it that women are paid more than men? Rare to never. Funny, that.

@LordEmsworth isn't the burden of proof fairly light for OP?

If the only differences between her and her colleague is that she is female and non white and her colleague is male and white then the ball goes to the employer to prove there wasnt discrimination.

Employers are shit but you do often find that the 'normal' way is based on a bedrock of discriminatory attitudes some of which can be waved away (don't like redheads, certain accents, people from a particular part of town) but others can't such as race, sex, disability.

Companies should be held to account.

To you and any other woman in this situation - please read "Lean In" by Cheryl Sandberg before you decide on your options. I can't bear Cheryl Sandberg or what she stands for either, but the book is essential reading for any woman in the corporate world. Very, very helpful.

I would demand a pay rise and leave if I didn't get one.

You sound really switched on @houwseevryweekend
All the points you've raised are valid. I think at the very least your employer needs to review its pay award system so this kind of anomaly is avoided in future. I do think you have an equal pay claim. Speak to Acas.

The patriarchy is alive and well.

Before you jump in, let your line manager try to rectify this before going to HR. She has said “leave it with me” so give her the chance to sort. It’s appalling BTW - women are paid less than men for the same work (and this isn’t even the same work!!)

Just raise a grievance!! Stop all this fannying about.

Oh this is very typical of the way the sex pay gap happens.

There is research that suggests that men are rewarded for asking for more salary - it’s expected that they will. Whereas women are not expected to negotiate salary upwards and when they do, they are punished for it - because they are contradicting sex-based stereotypes of femininity.

TL:DR - women get screwed either way.

I have seen legit cases where direct reports get paid more; usually because it’s a niche skillset or something.

In this case what you’re describing sounds a lot like unconscious (or otherwise) sex discrimination.

It gets difficult if he is on above market pay and was recruited in a better market - but when thats the case payrises are usually suspended until the pay falls in real terms in line with market and it doesnt sound like they are doing that.

I wouldn't put up with it. I'd calmly explain (preferably with references to market pay for my own role) that i wasn't happy with the pay and would be seeking opportunities elsewhere if it couldn't be resolved.

This is why pay secrecy is a problem. Men nearly always demand higher pay and are often given it (especially where they were higher paid in a previous role)

One easy way to frame it might be that you’ll apply for one of the vacancies then, to a more junior role to get more ££ because that’s what they seem to be saying can happen. Perhaps the absurdity of that could spark some action.

I work in HR and we absolutely decide what pay someone gets. We have pay bands and manager these as well as any retention payments. Managers can request but we have to approve it and part of that is looking at what the rest of the team are paid in order to prevent situations like this.

I would ask HR to review it on the grounds of equal pay. Your male direct report is earning more than you and his salary was increased to more than yours at the time you were made his manager. It might be a similar role with the same tasks and skills but it’s not the same job as you are his manager. It’s poor practice and asking for an equal pay claim.

There’s no need to go all guns blazing either way. I would definitely lodge a grievance if your request is rejected though as well as getting legal advice in that situation.

I would expect any increase to be backdated too.

Four options... you're not as good as you think, they're way better than you think (I.e. your position is in danger), you were crap at negotiating salary, they were excellent at negotiating salary.

I don't think it as simple as 'crap' or 'excellent' at salary negotiation.

For men negotiating, they will often find that the door they are pushing at is opened far more readily than it is for women.

Women negotiating will find they are considered 'pushy', 'difficult', 'antagonistic' etc. Anything other than meekly accepting terms offered will be perceived as negative.

Often the only recourse is to leave. This can have upsides as you are recalibrating to tge market each time. The downside is the loss of any job security.

I clicked on this thread to confirm my wild guess that you are a woman and your report is a man...

I hope you get this resolved op.

Yes. This.

No. It’s that often men ask for more as they have a higher opinion of themselves. Women are penalised for asking for more (perceived as greedy, pushy etc)

@houwseevryweekend I’m sure it’s been mentioned upthread. But contact ACAS. If this isn’t resolved within a few months with back pay: get your cv polished and get applying for new jobs

This is often spouted as a reason why the wage gap is a lie. If your comment is indeed true, then why would any business hire men if women are 'cheaper'? (I'm not agreeing, just a topic of debate)

It’s that often men ask for more as they have a higher opinion of themselves. Women are penalised for asking for more (perceived as greedy, pushy etc)

This. I've seen it over & over.

At recruitment I don't think there is as big a gap.

The problems come after recruitment, career progression within an organisation. As the OP has experienced.

Additional responsibilities, high performance are less well rewarded for women. As I posted before, for women the rewards are often soft: a bunch of flowers, a public thank you. For men the rewards are more likely to be tangible: money, promotion opportunities.

It isnt always obvious but look back and you will have seen it time and again.

It's hard to challenge because it is subtle. Often managers don't even realise they are doing it. If a woman does challenge it she will be perceived negatively as stroppy and ungrateful.

Did your boss reply?

When I was at work a middle manager, same grade as me, got a very large pay rise. I asked why his salary was increased and mine wasn't. It dragged on. I put in an official greivance. The day before I was retiring, they agreed to pay me the same, backdated. This affected my pension for the rest of my life.

I would have taken it to employment tribunal and I think you should too if necessary.