If I was ever autistic…. I outgrew it

[Finlandia86]

So to start off, let me say that I am far from ignorant about Autism, I have studied it at length and I know it is a condition present from birth / very early childhood and is not something you can outgrow.

Having learned a lot about Autism, including its presentation in girls, I look back on my childhood and see that I had a whole load of traits, including:

• Difficulty distinguishing fantasy from reality, especially as a young child
• Long running obsessions as a tween and teen (characters in books and TV shows mainly, to the point where it would interfere with my life and I would secretly pretend I was them…see above)
• Fixations on certain people in real life (usually teachers).
• Social difficulties - being thought of as aloof and stand-offish when actually I was shy and didn’t know how to ‘be’.
• Avoided showering (couldn’t be bothered and didn’t see the point).
• Sensory seeking (chewing stuff all the time, humming all the time, tendency to jiggle/rock in my seat)
• Difficulty with eye contact (shyness and low self esteem)
• Difficulty organising myself and terrible procrastination, until hyperfocus kicked in (after days of tears)
• Black and white thinking about right and wrong / good and bad, and giving myself an extremely hard time because of this.
• Lots of examples of supremely cringy behaviour, because I didn’t understand how I would look to other people.

If I was a teen today, pretty sure I’d get a diagnosis.

But… at nearly 40 years of age … I have grown out of all of it.

Okay, not quite all. I am still a terrible pen chewer and procrastinator (although my hyperfocus superpower seems to have left me). But the rigid fixations and the social awkwardness… gone. Gradually, it has to be said. It took until I was about 26 to truly grow into myself and find my social confidence, and it was around then that I stopped fixating on both real and fictional people, which I think had a lot to do with finally developing some self-esteem. You’ll be pleased to know that I now shower daily.

I’m not sure where I’m going with this, as I imagine a lot of people will think I am trying to invalidate their diagnoses or those of their children… I’m not. But I guess I am wondering whether we can be a bit quick to diagnose ‘low support needs’ / Aspergers type autism, when actually it’s just a case of ‘quirky child’ / ‘immature teen’.

Or, I guess a different takeaway could be one of hope: that as a probably autistic person I have learned to navigate and overcome many of life’s difficulties by middle adulthood.

I suppose my question is whether anyone else can identify with my experience, and if anyone has any interesting thoughts about it.

OP for goodness sake you just sounded like a teenager. All teenagers go through an awkward phase and do stuff like live in a fantasy world, be cringey and handle shyness and lack of confidence in awkward ways. You sounded normal to me. What's with this trying to medicalise and diagnose everything?

Please don't trivialise autism either!

We've 100% had this. We have two DS (aged 4 and 7).

DS7 is 'textbook' autistic - monologuing conversations, very formal language, violent meltdowns where he becomes non-speaking, loads of sensory issues, doesn't see the point in friends, has an EHCP to be in school, blah blah...

DS4 has worse sensory issues than DS7 who he loves to bits (they have a perfectly standard sibling relationship). However, he doesn't have the violent meltdowns and is super-popular, with a massive friendship group. DS4's nursery referred him to Occupational Therapy (OT) for help with the sensory issues. I started wondering about this, and got a neurodevelopmental assessment done on DS4 through my DH's health insurance.

The consultant (also runs an NHS clinic) 'diagnosed' DS4 as neurodivergent within 5 minutes of him entering the room, and he later picked up diagnoses of ASD, moderate hypermobility, a speech disorder and possible ADHD (but he's too young to diagnose). The neurodevelopmental assessment found he was behind in some areas (up to 18 months), but at least a year ahead in others. CRITICALLY, however, DS4 was tired and cross and in a bad mood with the consultant that day. She did the parental chat first, and he got bored and rolled about under the table.

About four months later, DS4 got referred to NHS community paediatrics via OT. The community paediatrician ignored the private neurodevelopmental assessment, and repeated it over again. This time, DS4 was in a great mood, having been at nursery all day with friends, and was keen to interact with the paediatrician. She said she had no development concerns whatsoever, he was meeting all milestones on schedule. Although he had loads and loads of autistic traits, she didn't feel it would have been worth referring him for an NHS autism assessment (if we hadn't already paid for one) as he 'had no delays and she had no concerns about his development'.

In contrast, the NHS OT said he was going to write a lengthy report about DS4's sensory needs because, although he knew he was a smart kid, "Sheldon from Big Bang Theory doesn't have a diagnosis in the show, but he's obviously intended to be autistic. He is also smart, but - even as an adult - the show shows he has lots of unmet support needs. Being intelligent isn't a get-out clause for needing help in school".

There we are. Three different qualified professionals. One had my DS4 being MORE disabled on paper than his older brother (who has an EHCP and a full-time support worker). The OT thought DS4 was a bright kid who needed some adjustments to thrive in reception. Another paediatrician didn't know why he was in her office. It depended on... literally, how DS4 was feeling that day.

It's entirely possible to be 'Schrodinger's autistic'. As neurodivergent as heck, but it's not consistently causing a problem.

I agree and the accusations of ‘heretic!’ and claims that asking the question is offensive are not helpful. Scientific progress comes from asking questions and challenging orthodoxy.

I agree with the analogy to the trans debate. Only trans people can know what it is like to be trans and no one else is allowed to ask questions. There is a true soul that is immutable, resistant to outside forces and must be accepted unconditionally.

It’s so tricky though because of the spectrum and variation in presentation. I’ve for a friend whose daughter whose daughter has severe autism. She’s young but she can’t ever see her living independently and she was one of the few that managed to get a special school placement from reception as it was clear to see mainstream wouldn’t work. There will be a limit to how much she will be able to mask/adapt to manage independently.

On the other hand you have some very high functioning individuals who can manage and learn to adapt or mask. Where I think it becomes really tricky for them though is the level of adaptations that can be expected in the workplace. I worked with a guy who was very high functioning but couldn’t cope with the unexpected at all and was unable to prioritise multiple tasks. The challenge there was that as much as you make allowances, he fundamentally couldn’t do the job he was in but could do some types of role very well. While his diagnosis gave him some protection, there still had to be a degree of reality check re finding suitable roles that would allow him to thrive versus fail.

Or just being individuals, or reacting to the environment around them (I think the latter is a biggie - particularly with high screen use, UPFs, chaos at home, sleep deprivation and less communication as toddlers due to parents on phones).

It’s very hard to separate it all out to be honest, it’s not lost on me that diagnoses have gone up as poverty/deprivation has.

I saw a lady on Panorama last night who added her daughters name to the assessment waiting list because she got upset when her mum said she ‘felt like she was dying’ (due to a headache or something). The daughter was 5. 5 year olds have no concept of similes or non-literal speech. It was ridiculous.

I can see where you're coming from. However a lot of autistic kids are not able to just grit their teeth and get on with it.

For example, at secondary my DS's attendance is falling, and he spends a lot of time in the SEN unit rather than in lessons. He would rather be like all the other kids and hates standing out, but he gets so overwhelmed and dysregulated that he can't cope. He will get visibly distressed and cry, or shout at people. While that was just about ok in primary, for a teenager it is most definitely not. Before the SEN team got involved he was locking himself in the school toilets having panic attacks, or refusing to go in at all. They would support him without the diagnosis (which he got in y7), but my god has it made it easier to communicate his needs and advocate for him. It also really helps him to understand why he is different to others, and to connect with other autistic kids. He likes knowing that he is autistic.

The diagnosis ‘autism’ is too wide.

Very interesting and thoughtful post.

Has anyone considered PANS PANDAS? Symptoms leave as the immune system matured in last teens.

PANS (“Pediatric Acute-onset Neuropsychiatric Syndrome”) is a clinically defined disorder characterised by the sudden onset of obsessive-compulsive symptoms (OCD) or eating restrictions, deterioration in at least two:
anxiety, sensory amplification or motor abnormalities, behavioral regression, deterioration in school performance, mood disorder, urinary symptoms and/or sleep disturbances.

Well it isn’t, anybody with a diagnosis has to reach a high threshold for certain criteria which have a big impact on life.

You don’t just add your name to the list, you go through screening.

Absolutely. Now, I know WHY.

My diagnosis didn’t give me an excuse for my “lack” as I saw it, it gave me validation and the ability to be more allowing, more gentle with myself. And those who didn’t “believe” my diagnosis because I had a husband and a child and a career and a small number of friends, they are no longer in my life.

I think the narrative that autism is innate, cannot be ‘caused’ by anything and is essentially a human variation which has always existed in similar numbers to now needs investigation.

I think what used to be ‘Asperger’s’ is most definitely a personality type which has likely always existed - there’s huge evidence of this in history, and I can think of several kids I knew growing up where the signs were clear (including my best friend who was diagnosed at 30).

However I’m not so sure about teenagers who ‘never showed any symptoms at all until they were 14/15 and suddenly became very anxious’. Nor am I sure about what seems to be a rise in speech delayed toddlers who exhibit little understanding and often aggressive/repetitive behaviour.

I wouldn’t be surprised if there is a huge influence in environmental factors in these cases. It’s a shame research was halted due to accusations of ableism. I think one day we will look back and judge ourselves (like we have with transgender) for going straight for diagnosis rather than exploring other causes and ruling them out first. A lady posted on here the other day as her teen son had an onset of mental health issues - she took a cautious approach and found out he was extremely deficient in vitamin D. After supplementing she says his symptoms rapidly diminished and she has her old son back, which was lovely to hear. Others may have gone straight to CAMHS.

I agree that this post is ridiculous. In my experience/social circle, self diagnosis is seen as valid and opinions like yours are what’s seen as ‘excruciatingly embarrassing.’ Most people know that getting a diagnosis can be almost impossible for some due to years-long waiting lists, or exorbitant costs for private diagnosis. Again, the vast majority of self-diagnosed autistics have done so much research and self-searching that they would absolutely get a diagnosis if they sought one.

This.

And there's often only one type of "lived experience" accepted. My history of being diagnosed in childhood is nowhere near as positive as adult diagnosed (and self-diagnosed...) people's, but you'll only experience anger if you try talk about how being diagnosed wasn't great for you, and you don't claim to speak for anybody else.

I also agree, enormous parallels with transgender. And the same response to anybody who queries.

Yes. You need a referral to a qualified paediatrician for a screening (neurodevelopmental) assessment. This usually comes from the GP.

NHS waiting lists are months even for that screening assessment, which scores development against age-expected norms. In young kids, this usually picks up ASD as a delay in social and communication skills. Paediatricians are also used to seeing kids with ADHD/ASD, etc. and can tell you if there's a suspicion of these conditions.

Then, there is a separate multi-hour assessment for ASD including interviews with parents, reports from educational settings, and an assessment by both a qualified paediatrician and a speech-and-language therapist. Often, DC with ASD in childhood have other conditions, such as motor issues or speech delays, which requires referral to a SLT (speech-and-language therapist) or an Occupational Therapist (OT).

The complexity comes if you have smart kids who can be way ahead of age-related expectations, despite being severely disabled relative to their own abilities in other areas. My DS7 met age-related expectations for social and communication skills, despite needing an EHCP to be in school. This is especially common in neurodivergent kids from professional-class families (the parents usually called 'pushy' and 'trying to get a fashionable ASD/ADHD diagnosis') where kids can be so far ahead in age-related expectations in some areas that they can compensate for their weak spots in other areas.

As ASD can be inherited ('familial'), or occur as part of a general genetic disease, these threads inevitably attract parents who can't understand how their severely learning disabled epileptic kid, and a kid with an IQ above the Mensa threshold have the exact same condition. Answer: The clever kid can simply compensate better, and taking a 40-point hit to verbal IQ if you're a MENSA candidate doesn't cause a speech delay.

I 100% agree OP. obviously not talking about extreme examples e.g. non-verbal/not able to leave the house etc.

My nephew has just been diagnosed (age 5) but all I see in him are completely normal 5 year old behaviours that he will outgrow, just like I did. He has "stims" (for anxiety, just like I did/still do but have learnt to do in private to avoid public judgement), has "meltdowns" (essentially big tantrums, like I remember still having until around age 7/8) and likes his own space (introvert). There is nothing autistic about him but somehow he now has this label which makes him even more anxious as he thinks he's different.

I think it's just this generation of parents are more in tune with their kids and are happy to tailor parenting to the style each child wants/needs rather than forcing all children to conform to a polite/calm model - but to justify this they want their kid to have a label, so they aren't called "fussy" or "gentle" parents, as this is seen in a derogatory way by a lot of people.

If you mask so hard that you can't recognise those traits as being part of your personality at all anymore, haven't you just.. developed as a person into an adult who is now different to what they were as a child?

It’s so funny (and yet somehow also sad) seeing people comments on here stating that they were also like the OP ‘but aren’t autistic’… sorry to break it to you but…

It’s seems strange to me that this thread and its responses point massively to “learning adaptations, growing out of behaviours and being able to adjust and be more acceptably neurotypical. If I asked an NT person to adapt, change, learn how to fit, each and every day, just to be “acceptable”, I think that would go down like a lead balloon. Now, some may argue that all of us learn how to behave, that there are acceptable social norms and ways of fitting in to the predominant NT society. I’d agree. But, it’s exhausting, every moment of every day. That, is the difference.

If he'd been allowed to use it as an excuse and shielded from the world he wouldn't have developed the satisfying career and life that he has.

I am sorry but that is rubbish. No one uses any diagnosis as an excuse for doing or not doing something. We all make judgements about things based on what we feel able or not able for, autistic people are no different. What other disability would you claim people are using as an excuse for not doing something or is it just autism? I find that phrasing so offensive tbh. My dd16 struggles every day of her life to keep things on track, her diagnosis has provided her with much needed supports and resources to help her cope in a school environment which she finds extremely difficult, why should certain adaptations to help her cope day to day be viewed as an excuse? She is also dyslexic so also gets spelling and grammar waivers for exams, is that also an excuse?

OMG if you think you might have outgrown autism at almost 40 years old, you are in for a potential very rude awakening. (If you are actually Autistic)

As an (undiagnosed) Autistic kid, I struggled massively. In my teens, I masked. It was painful, but I coped. I was an expert by time I was in my 20s and 30s.

Approaching 50, the wheels came off massively. That's the problem with masking for decades. It fucks you up entirely. Burnout, shutdown.

I was diagnosed at 51.

There's a reason a lot of women are diagnosed around thus age.

Please don't be so smug.

Really interesting perspective!

OP, I do agree with you that many autistic people (those who would formerly have been diagnosed with Aspergers) may be able to adapt (or outgrow) most of their ASD traits. The esteemed psychologist Tony Atwood says something similar in one of his books. It's also something that I've often observed on MN, where ASD-diagnosed teens who have been unable to attend school for years, are eventually able to return to school during their Iate teens. And I say this as the mother of a DD who has been diagnosed with ASD...I can see that she's already left some of her ASD traits behind, such as tip-toe walking and obsessive chewing. She has gained other traits in their place and things are difficult at the moment as she battles the twin storms of ASD and puberty simultaneously, but I'm hopeful that in a few years she will sail on calmer seas and leave some of her current issues behind her.