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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Work shifts

16 replies

onfused · 07/07/2024 07:12

I am a single mother of 2 primary school age children (6 and 9yo). Live in the UK. Have worked for the same company for 11 years. Since having DCs, have worked 9-2:45 Mon-Fr- which was ideal for me. There are few of us working this shift- all mothers of young children. Company just informed us that they are getting rid of this shift and now we have a choice of working 4x 12h shifts on, 4 off (FT) or 2 fixed days per week 12h shifts (PT). We are past GMB consultations already, this is the final stage.
What are my, as a single parent of 2 young children, rights to refuse this? As you can imagine, I do not have any disposable amount of money to go to a 'proper' lawyer, but have a meeting on Monday to 'discuss' this and I have no idea how I am going to cope even on those 2 days- as have to be at work at 8am, finishing 8pm and have about 35-45mins commute. I have no one to help with the childcare. Ex lives abroad and is not in my DCs lives.
Is there a law in the UK protecting me?

OP posts:
autienotnaughty · 07/07/2024 09:26

What does your contract say? Are you in a union?

onfused · 08/07/2024 11:56

Contract says my current hours and shifts, but also that irt might be changed according to company's needs.

OP posts:
Brainded · 08/07/2024 12:03

If that’s what you’re contract states then I’m unsure you can do anything.

what are your current paid hours? 25hours?

would they be paying you the same or more on the “4 on 4 off” shift as it will no doubt fall over weekends? I would expect an increase for that?

2 days on may be an option if you could get a pay increase and/or childcare?

do they do a 9-5 role at all and you could use before/afterschool?

rainbowunicorn · 08/07/2024 12:09

If it is in your contract that it is subject to change then probably very little you can do. You will either have to try and negotiate an alternative pattern, which is unlikely if they are doing away with all shifts other shifts, or you may have to just look for another job that suits your schedule. It's unfortunate but the employer will do what is needed for the business.

Brainded · 08/07/2024 12:19

And I say this as a fellow single parent…you have no more rights than anyone else to stay on your shift. There’s so no harm in asking etc…but they can’t treat you differently because you are a single parent I’m afraid.

Arewealljustloosingtheplot · 08/07/2024 12:25

If you refuse I would assume you are making yourself redundant?

Jeezitneverends · 08/07/2024 12:26

Unfortunately if the company gives you appropriate notice as per your contract they can do pretty much what they like…I’ve had it done to me in the public sector…being a parent isn’t a protected characteristic

Mrsttcno1 · 08/07/2024 12:28

Jeezitneverends · 08/07/2024 12:26

Unfortunately if the company gives you appropriate notice as per your contract they can do pretty much what they like…I’ve had it done to me in the public sector…being a parent isn’t a protected characteristic

Edited

Yeah this is correct unfortunately, if it states in your contract that it can be changed for business need then you’re limited really

Notamum12345577 · 08/07/2024 12:31

onfused · 08/07/2024 11:56

Contract says my current hours and shifts, but also that irt might be changed according to company's needs.

If they have consulted with a union already, I would guess everything is all dotted and crossed legally. So I don’t think you have any rights to refuse. You can ask, but if they say no your choices I imagine will be to do it, or leave

Chatbotsarerubbish · 08/07/2024 12:34

They can make these changes following the process they have been, but do have to be careful of discrimination - being a parent isn't a protected characteristic, but caring tends to fall disprotionately to women:

Discrimination
As women are generally the main childcarers in a family, any decision to refuse a flexible working request from a woman with childcare responsibilities may be indirect discrimination. This occurs when an employer implements a working practice, such as a change to shift patterns, which has a detrimental impact on a particular woman and women in general as the main carers.
In these circumstances, the employer has to be able to objectively justify its practice by showing that it has a legitimate business aim and that it couldn’t achieve its aim in a less discriminatory way.

So have you challenged them?
Also - speak to ACAS, they give free legal advice.

ByCupidStunt · 08/07/2024 12:40

Acas won't tell you anything you can't google. It was very useful before the internet existed though.

Could you argue your case on "business needs". I mean does the business REALLY NEED to change the hours? Bearing in mind that it didn't NEED to have you work those shifts before. What is their actual need? I think I'd be querying that to start with.

toomanytonotice · 08/07/2024 12:41

Arewealljustloosingtheplot · 08/07/2024 12:25

If you refuse I would assume you are making yourself redundant?

You can’t make yourself (or any person) redundant.

only the role can be made redundant.

so if o/p’s job no longer exists, she can take redundancy.

if the role is still there, it’s just the hours that have changed, then the role is not redundant.

Arewealljustloosingtheplot · 08/07/2024 12:44

toomanytonotice · 08/07/2024 12:41

You can’t make yourself (or any person) redundant.

only the role can be made redundant.

so if o/p’s job no longer exists, she can take redundancy.

if the role is still there, it’s just the hours that have changed, then the role is not redundant.

It’s my understanding that when they wish to change something like this that if you do not accept the new terms then you’re redundant ?

either way. I don’t think the Op has much choice, accept or have no job.

HcbSS · 08/07/2024 12:58

The company will need to give you suitable notice to sort childcare out (as in not implement the change from next week). And you will need to start looking for childminders/wraparound care. Probably in the long term, look for a new job.

Bjorkdidit · 08/07/2024 13:08

4 on 4 off is going to be incredibly hard to manage with childcare, because your shifts will fall on different days each week, and often be at the weekend. Also 12 hour shifts are outside the hours where childcare is generally available.

I would have thought that you may have an argument in relation to constructive dismissal or indirect discrimination because disproportionately more women will be negatively affected, but I'm really not sure.

Only thing I can think of as there are a few of you in this position is can you partner up as job shares to take the part time 2 shift a week option and also do reciprocal childcare and look after each other's DCs on your non working days and do the school runs? Might be technically illegal without being registered childcare but might work and needs must and all that.

Otherwise you probably need to look for another job with fixed hours similar to what you're working now.

underradar · 13/08/2024 15:54

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