Page 2 | To refuse to send DS12 to detention

AlwaysTheGoodGirl · 2024-07-02T13:22:10+00:00

I know everyone thinks their kid is perfect, but mine is super-conscientious, and every day he comes in from school saying most of the kids just mess about and break things all day and all he wants to do is get on with his work. Anyway, his class have been given detention tomorrow after school, and the teacher (supply teacher as far as I can tell) has sent a really angry-sounding explanation for the detention. I know DS is going to be gutted about losing his 100% positive points record more than anything. He's been invited to an awards evening next week for achieving 100% positive points, so I know this is going to cloud it for him. And me! I'm gutted too! Is it any good ringing the school to complain, or is this just a suck it up situation?

VioletMountainHare · 02/07/2024 15:10

AlwaysTheGoodGirl · 02/07/2024 14:53

@VioletMountainHare From what my son tells me, the supply staff are pretty useless to be frank, no control of the class whatsoever. But I can sympathise with them having to deal with this year group.

So supply teachers have inherited what is already a challenging year group? Taking on a tricky class requires time to build up relationships in order to set clear expectations. Otherwise the chaos you’re describing becomes the norm. Why don’t they have a consistent teacher?

KreedKafer · 02/07/2024 15:42

AlwaysTheGoodGirl · 02/07/2024 14:29

Type: 40 Minute Date: 03/07/2024 Note: Virtually the whole class refused to follow any instructions Had to be brought back to classroom from ILC for messing about noise levels through the roof. Defiance from most. Back door opened without permission. fire fighting at all times then it would start somewhere else

This is a really unprofessional note. It reads like a rant for the teacher to let off steam, not a clear and reasoned explanation for the detention.

FawnFrenchieMum · 02/07/2024 15:49

This is a hill I would die on! I would quote the behavior policy and ask for a detailed reason that my child was included in the group detention.
My DD has 8 days left of year 7 with a clean detention sheet, if she was issued with this I would be fuming.

Isitovernow123 · 02/07/2024 15:51

Send an email to their head of year. Whole class detentions are not an acceptable practice, and sanctions should be directed at those involved. If they can’t be certain, you cannot sanction them all.

If a parent sent me this, then I would put all of the detentions on hold until I had had time to speak to the teacher.

Isitovernow123 · 02/07/2024 15:52

And I am a head of year with 300 students in.

ArseInTheCoOpWindow · 02/07/2024 15:53

delilabell · 02/07/2024 14:25

Our school banned class detentions. They said that it was just am easy option for teachers who couldn't control the class.
I would phone the school and ask if they have evidence of poor behaviour from your son in particular

Because it’s always the teachers fault if they have a difficult class🙄

TiredCatLady · 02/07/2024 15:56

Detention is against their own policy and aside from that, collective punishment is ineffective. Rule 103 from the UN bans it.

Riversideandrelax · 02/07/2024 15:57

AlwaysTheGoodGirl · 02/07/2024 14:30

This was the explanation given. It's exactly what I hear every day. The Y7 kids seem to be out of control and it's really putting DS off school 😕

So it wasn't all of them misbehaving then. I'd ask if your DS was actually misbehaving and if not I wouldn't be making him do the detention. Sounds like he has enough to put up with everyday let alone being punished himself for others behaviour.

The school sounds awful, though. Is there any chance of getting him in anywhere else?

HoppingPavlova · 02/07/2024 15:57

This was the explanation given. It's exactly what I hear every day. The Y7 kids seem to be out of control and it's really putting DS off school

Well then, your DS should be glad as it’s an opportunity to turn around the poor behaviour of his cohort. Maybe they won’t like after school detentions and will think twice next time making it a more pleasant environment for your DS.

My kids went to different schools, some private, some public, depending on the needs and wants of the child and the schools all had different methods for behaviour management. By far, the most effective was those that used group punishment. Not surprisingly, kids become resentful when punished due to others poor behaviour and then send clear messages to their peers that they don’t want it to happen again. I had one child ask to swap to a siblings school that did this due to the poor behaviour of kids at their school affecting their experience and teachers couldn’t/wouldn’t do anything about it (public). The other school was private and part of the contract you signed said you would support the schools behaviour management policies😊. That child would have been well chuffed having the entire class inconvenienced with detention after school in the hope it changed things rather than moving schools.

HappierTimesAhead · 02/07/2024 16:00

KreedKafer · 02/07/2024 15:42

This is a really unprofessional note. It reads like a rant for the teacher to let off steam, not a clear and reasoned explanation for the detention.

Show quote history

I agree, they just sound pissed off in general so decided to punish the whole class.

Riversideandrelax · 02/07/2024 16:01

AlwaysTheGoodGirl · 02/07/2024 14:38

@Pottedpalm I do have a good relationship with his form teacher, so would be happy to speak to him about it. I just wanted to check I wasn't being the neurotic parent! And yes, at time the learning environment sounds very poor, with a lot of supply staff and not much in the way of provision of proper lessons..... It's such a shame as my eldest had a great experience, but this generation seems so different.

I don't think it's a generation thing. It's a school thing. The DC don't misbehave like that in my DD's Y7 class.

Catwontwork · 02/07/2024 16:03

I would email his form tutor/head of year.
It’s against their own policy and the note says ‘virtually’ so your son probably did nothing wrong.
I’d definitely not want it on his behaviour record.
It also backs up what your son is saying about behaviour so you’ve that to bring up too.

Riversideandrelax · 02/07/2024 16:04

AlwaysTheGoodGirl · 02/07/2024 14:51

This is from the detention policy - am I right that it says whole class detentions should not be given?

When a student disrupts learning or behaves inappropriately within the Academy there are consequences for those actions. It is essential, that all staff are consistent and use our agreed behaviour system so that we are fair to all students within the Academy. When students have been part of a group who have not met Academy expectations, the group may face the same consequence with regards to completing detentions however whole classes should not face consequences as a result of the behaviour of an individual or group of students. In these instances staff will investigate and pinpoint those who have not met our expectations. In these cases, consequence points will be put on retrospectively about an incident.

It's definitely against policy then. I would insist he doesn't do the detention and it is not on his record.

SpongeBobSquarePantaloons · 02/07/2024 16:06

HoppingPavlova · 02/07/2024 15:57

This was the explanation given. It's exactly what I hear every day. The Y7 kids seem to be out of control and it's really putting DS off school

Well then, your DS should be glad as it’s an opportunity to turn around the poor behaviour of his cohort. Maybe they won’t like after school detentions and will think twice next time making it a more pleasant environment for your DS.

My kids went to different schools, some private, some public, depending on the needs and wants of the child and the schools all had different methods for behaviour management. By far, the most effective was those that used group punishment. Not surprisingly, kids become resentful when punished due to others poor behaviour and then send clear messages to their peers that they don’t want it to happen again. I had one child ask to swap to a siblings school that did this due to the poor behaviour of kids at their school affecting their experience and teachers couldn’t/wouldn’t do anything about it (public). The other school was private and part of the contract you signed said you would support the schools behaviour management policies😊. That child would have been well chuffed having the entire class inconvenienced with detention after school in the hope it changed things rather than moving schools.

That's funny because when this happened at my school and I tried to get others to start behaving, all it did was get me bullied.

SpongeBobSquarePantaloons · 02/07/2024 16:07

It's also not a 12 year old's job to manage the behaviour of his classmates. That's what the staff are for.

Riversideandrelax · 02/07/2024 16:08

altmember · 02/07/2024 15:01

Sounds very similar to my ds school. His class (also yr7) is just total anarchy, pretty much every day my ds comes home with stories of how they missed most of a lesson because one or other of the kids kicked off. He was begging to move classes for the first two terms, I raised it with the school who refused (too many other kids had already moved out of the class apparently). Now my lad has got used to the disruption and the chaotic behaviour has been normalised to him and he's now actually ok with staying in that class (for the entertainment value of watching the chaos).

But they haven't been given a whole class detention yet. I think I'd tell him to suck it up, that's life, take his annoyance out on the real culprits. But I'd also be having very firm words with the school about it.

Your DS's school sounds awful. So he misses most lessons and just watches DC misbehaving?

AtomHeartMotherOfGod · 02/07/2024 16:17

Mass punishments suck. They don't work and as others have said, can just turn good children bad.

I'm a teacher and I would be happy to fight my child's corner if this was imposed on them, especially if it was given by a supply, who is less likely to know the individual children's natures. I agree it's in contravention of the policy, plus (s)he's said 'virtually all', not 'all'.

I'm sorry for your DS; sounds a nightmare. They need to change the way they discipline as it's clearly not working.

greenpolarbear · 02/07/2024 16:28

Lalalacrosse · 02/07/2024 14:25

But if it’s mass punishment where he was not himself misbehaving - I’d complain and point out that the only reason that used to work was that the innocent ones would take the bad ones round the back of the bike sheds and ‘impress upon them’ why they behaviour was not ok.

One assumes that the school does not intend to endorse that approach.

What? There's no way the innocent swots/geeks were ever beating up anyone behind bike sheds.

greenpolarbear · 02/07/2024 16:30

KreedKafer · 02/07/2024 15:42

This is a really unprofessional note. It reads like a rant for the teacher to let off steam, not a clear and reasoned explanation for the detention.

Show quote history

I think the tone is okay, but the spelling and grammar is concerning for a teacher. Even if written quickly, attention to detail is important. And embarrassing if you've sent all the parents that.

HoppingPavlova · 02/07/2024 16:33

@SpongeBobSquarePantaloons That's funny because when this happened at my school and I tried to get others to start behaving, all it did was get me bullied

That’s because it wasn’t facilitated properly. It’s an art to get it right, and if schools/institutions don’t then it doesn’t work.

Bellaboo01 · 02/07/2024 16:33

The detention (which i would complain about btw) would be the least of my worries. It sounds like he is in a class of disruptive children and a teacher who cant manage their behaviour individually.

WeeOrcadian · 02/07/2024 16:34

Fuck that

I wouldn't be sending him and I'd be explaining that to the HOY, in an email, and explaining that I expect no 'marks' against DS' name

It sounds like someone got all uptight and decided that a class-wide detention was the only solution

SocoBateVira · 02/07/2024 16:35

I'd certainly be ringing for an explanation, and if one wasn't forthcoming to my satisfaction he wouldn't be doing the detention.

5475878237NC · 02/07/2024 16:41

AlwaysTheGoodGirl · 02/07/2024 14:29

Type: 40 Minute Date: 03/07/2024 Note: Virtually the whole class refused to follow any instructions Had to be brought back to classroom from ILC for messing about noise levels through the roof. Defiance from most. Back door opened without permission. fire fighting at all times then it would start somewhere else

This is really unprofessional and sounds like a teacher venting to friends in the staff room not a message for parents. This teacher needs a learning support plan! Complain.

Runsyd · 02/07/2024 16:41

Cerialkiller · 02/07/2024 14:35

If it was 'virtually' all the kids then they are admitting that some are innocent and are punishing them too. I would very much be 'that' parent over this. I would press your son's spotless record, threaten to take your complaint to the governors etc etc. the fact that they can't control the class is not a reason to punish everyone.

Yeah, I'm usually very anti parents wading in to defend their little darlings, but punishing the decent kids for the bad behaviour of the rest is appalling. They should target the ringleaders not the good kids.