Knife crime needs serious punishment?

[Rositaso]

AIBU to think this is an absolute epidemic now and something needs to be done?

Police need greater random stop and search powers and there should be dedicated juvenile facilities for those carrying a knife.

Found with a knife? Automatic 12 month sentence in a juvie facility.

I know people will say 'where will the money come from?' but so many people are dying.

We need to change the culture around it.

Maybe even try and change the narrative in a way that young men will take heed off, like you're a coward to carry a knife sort of thing?

We managed to ban and get rid of guns successfully. Obviously knives are already illegal to carry but I feel like in some places it's quite normal for kids to have knives on them for 'protection '

Obviously I'm just someone looking in from the outside, but I have teens and it's just scary how often a simple altercation can turn to murder.

Does anyone have any understanding what motivates a person to stab another person to death?

Especially as a teenager like why on earth would you want to take someone's life?

Honestly I have no idea
There was a 15 year old stabbed to death very local to me a couple of years ago
Over some stupid social media argument that escalated .

The government got rid off thousands of police and closed down local initiatives that dealt with gang violence. Gang violence is how the majority of knife crime happens. It's also been blamed on lack of youth clubs and community centres.

It is an issue. No debating that.

Automatic 12m in custody is not the answer though. These places are already too full and don't achieve what is needed.

What do you think happens when we put all these kids together in one place and lock them in? It may keep the streets safer for a short period but they do have to come out and often come out worse than they went in!

society needs to change for teenagers. Social media, constructive activities. All the youth services and things to do have gone. Unless parents are very pro active and not all are, teens are bored and one thing leads to another.

It's very complicated to tackle.

My sister works in a London A&E and has dealt with a lot of knife crime - she says police officers have told her that a lot of the perpetrators don’t really get that stabbing someone once can kill them, they’re not aiming to kill they’re aiming to scare/injure. It’s a bravado thing which escalates fast 😢😢. She’s seen some young perpetrators brought in absolutely beside themselves at what they’ve done.

It’s all desperately sad but the ease of access to knives (we all have a drawer full of them in our kitchens) makes it much harder to tackle than gun crime.

My DS has been in fights at school to and gave his bully a black eye. But I know (and he's told me) that he'd never want to take their life and kill them

The starting sentence for carrying a bladed article is 6 months in prison so we’re not a million miles away from this.

Totally agree - social media glamourises knife crime and then bored teens take it to the streets 😢

I remember people complaining of a lack of stuff for teens to do when I was a teen and I'm 50 and yeah whilst there might have been fights kids didn't go round stabbing each other.

@VickysKnickers

That's no better. One punch deaths are happening a lot too

I’m a similar age but our kids are growing up in a totally different world to the one we grew up in.

Bladed article in a public place already carries a custodial sentence

I work in a men's prison 18 years upwards. As someone upthread says, it's mainly gang related

Also...prisons are full!

@x2boys

It was not as bad then as it is now for nothing to do. And social media/internet has just added to this being a problem.

I have seen youth services shrink and then disappear completely over the past 4 or so years.

To tackle knife crime properly, some difficult conversations need to be had and there is a low appetite for that due to accusations of prejudice. However, and I quote "despite making up only 13% of London’s total population, black Londoners account for 45% of London’s knife murder victims, 61% of knife murder perpetrators and 53% of knife crime perpetrators".

I went to a talk recently by a prominent black campaigner who said we have to start talking about things like the lack of fathers being around in some communities, the attraction of gangs etc, but that nobody felt able to talk about this. In fact, I'm nervous even posting this here.

I work with these young men who have committed knife crime. I honestly do not think a single one of them would have attended a youth club.

What's their motive? Do they have remorse?

It's really not that simple - it needs to come from home, families, and community...not harsher punishment.

First guns were a lot more expensive than knives, and have far fewer legitimate uses (none in day to day life) we all use knives every day.
Even in prisons people make make shift knives/bladed articles.

Secondly gun's were banned before the advent of the Internet and amazon delivery.

I appreciate that it feels like every teen carries a knife. I just asked DD15....she doesn't know a single person who is known to carry one. Although she is sure a few at other schools do...not at her school.

Almost every teen I have heard of being involved in knife crime is also into far shadier/illegal stuff. They typically only need protection if they are involved in gang stuff....or possibly they live in a community plagued by gangs and are trying to stay out of it.
In those situations a harsher sentence isn't going to deter them.

It may work for the middle class boys who think carrying a knife makes them edgy and tough....but really their parents should be doing more to understand what they are spending their money on and where they are.

I think parents of the younger men who stab people should be prosecuted and until they are nothing will change. They keep the knives at home, hidden in bedrooms.

I don't think it's lack of fathers itself or anything about black people and their values.
I think it's about the community people live in

A black kid in a nice middle class area with no gangs isn't going to be involved in knife crime or drugs (although some people will assume they are and that can be self fulfilling)
But a white kid in an inner city London estate is just as likely to be involved in that sort of stuff.
Proportionally..for historic reasons perpetuated through generations. The black population of the UK is more likely to live in these inner city less affluent areas where drugs and gangs are rife.

Then due to some of the rap music and gang culture stuff that has come out of these areas, in America and the UK, it became aspirational. If the only role model you see with the same skin colour as you/from your home town is a rapper who was shot and killed, or killed someone it's difficult to see an alternative.

Its almost like nothing cam be done till someone is hurt /killed .. its like yeah e was carrying a knife but no one was hurt. We can't do much till someone is actually hurt

The 15 year old that was stabbed to death near me was stabbed with a kitchen knife
It was such a stupid senseless killing.

Parents did parenting then.

I mean simply carrying it is illegal in this country?

On another note. I've asked and in America it's perfectly normal to go out and carry a knife in some states.

I do agree OP, that it's an epidemic and urgent action needs to be taken. In fact after a blade incident outside dd's school, which she witnessed, I posted on the local police FB page that unless they started prevention campaigns I would not be able to support her attendance. Since then it appears they've stepped up and done something.

It's a societal problem though. Punishment of the kids isn't the answer, that just sets them up for a life of drugs, knives and crime. They need love and guidance and many aren't getting it.

Where I live about 50% of teens have no respect for themselves or anyone else. They routinely smoke pot on the (public) bus at 9 in the morning, swear, spit on the ground, can't look you in the face and dress like a horror show. It's scary.

Holding the parents responsible or fining them, educating families and setting higher expectations around parenting behaviours maybe?

The school-family-pupil triangle does not work in the UK. There is a disconnect. Covid made it 100 times worse.

More needs to be done to build bridges and form communities, instead of packing your teen off every day to spend 7 hours with a bunch of potentially dysfunctional strangers. It looks to me like kids are forming these dangerous personas either to "be someone" or defend themselves.