To confront a bully

[Namedrop000]

There's a bully at my work and I've had enough. She's in her mid 50s, thinks she's some sort of office matriarch. Feigns being helpful and sympathetic but actually goes out of her way to sabotage people and bitch behind people's backs. Sticks her nose in where its not wanted and makes snarky remarks, puts people down. It's really awful, I've just had a fantastic junior colleague in tears because the bully woman essentially publicly shamed her in front of a load of senior people. Not on.

Anyway she's been here forever, like 20 odd years and will probably be here until she retires now (public sector).

I'm considering speaking to her and asking her to consider the way she behaves towards others. She's upset me a few times too. It probably won't go down well but I think others are too afraid of her to say anything. I wonder if she even knows it's blatantly obvious what she's doing. What do you think? Any better way of handling this? Senior staff stick their heads in the sand.

Is there a HR department?

The fossils of the workplace. You won’t win. Best to change jobs. Life’s too short.

I mean you would be a very brave person to take this on and it would be something I’d want to do as well. I’m not sure if I would or wouldn’t though and would think through the consequences carefully first and if there were any other options for how to deal with it. It’d also depend on how much I wanted to stay in my job! Good luck!

She’s clearly been allowed to get away with this for too long and it’s embedded in the whole environment there. Senior Managers are probably too frightened to confront her and easier to as you say to bury their heads. Maybe speak with HR first as PP has said, make it more formal and let them know what you’re having to put up with.

Dont speak to the C - report her and if that does not work, go to HR

Often people like that are set in their ways so a word with your manger and theirs or get the manager to have a meeting the three of you - if it does not work - keep a diar of what the parasite is doing and report her

if you can get another person to stand up to her via managers/HR the better

Dont take BS like "oh shes set in her ways..like that with everyone... don't take it personally." because cunts like that will get you the sack given half the chance

Trust me, I've worked with a few and took me more than a year to get them out of my department

NB: Often a dept like this is a sign of a weak manager!!!

If you think she's an actual bully, you should take out a grievance.

That way, no-one can stick their head in the sand.

What ever you do do it properly
if you do raise a case for bullying you need examples

And witnesses.

Being civil service there should be a bullying and harassment policy which should specify the procedures to follow when reporting a bully, have you checked the intranet?

It's tempting to speak up for others but your colleagues won't have your back.
Do any reporting officially.
Your junior colleague should too.

And if the bully is rude to you then and it's not work related then clarify everything she says.
Eg. Why do you think that?
Why are you asking?
I'm sorry I don't understand.

Personally I wouldn't approach someone like that because it'll go one of two ways, either you do it 1-1 and she lies about what way it went. Or you do it with a witness and then you're ganging up on her.

I personally would wait until she challenges you and then bite back in equal measure very calmly, and directly. Make sure you're being fair and not aggressive or personally attacking. I think when people like that are called out in a very professional way they see they've no leg to stand on and back down

I'll check this out thanks. This is my first role in public sector/civil service, I've been here 18 months.

I used to be a union rep in my old job and my experience of HR involvement is very, very poor...

When I worked at the civil service there was a team leader like this. She would come over to our bank of desks and shout at us to "get back on the phones" and speak to us like dirt, whenever our team leader was away from her desk. We were all on calls when she did it for the last time. We all just put up with her attitude but one guy turned around to her and said "can I ask why you're speaking to me like that?" She got confrontational and he said "don't speak to me like that please, I'm your colleague, not dirt on your shoe". She said "shall we take this into a meeting room?" and he politely declined and said "no, you shouted at me in front of everyone while I was on a call, and you've tried to tell me I'm wrong for requesting that you change your tone - all in front of everyone. So we may as well discuss this here. Is there anything else I can help you with? No? OK so thanks for not taking that tone with me again. Or anyone else." She left to go and work in another office within a month. Not even a promotion. Think she didn't like that her authority had been challenged and she had lost her power over everyone despite being there for 25 years. It takes one person with the balls to stick up to these people.

I had this experience when I was 20 in my second job. She was AWFUL to me from day one. Snide, passive aggressive, vaguely unkind (excluding me from things, talking over my head etc). To this day I have no idea what her issue was. She had been there 20 plus years and was very much the "I don't sugar coat things" kind of person (I.e a fucking arsehole). Anyway, being only 20 I didn't give a shit if someone my nans age didn't like me. I just wanted to make money to go out with my mates and buy nice clothes. The lack of caring actually helped and she gave up being as bad to me as all she got back was nothing at all or laughter. When I eventually left years later on maternity leave she was sad and wanted me to stay as she had given up her nastiness towards me. I have always wondered what the psychology behind her attitude was. I was kind, good at my job and easy going, didn't go off sick or take the piss. I think she just liked to be the bully.
It sounds like your bosses wouldn't be interested in her behaviour and it's embedded in the culture there. I'd keep a note of her behaviour and encourage those she picks on to make a complaint. The one great day I had at work was when a contractor told our office arsehole to fuck off. Her face was a picture. More people needed to do that really.

BTW do you work for DWP? Because that's where I experienced this the most. Only the horrible people stay there for decades. They wouldn't get along with people anywhere else. I've worked in the private sector and these people would be ripped to shreds. Same at a local authority or NHS. My sister worked for the police and it's the same there. You have to be an arsehole or have vety thick skin to work with such people. Sadly that's not me.

Dealing with workplace bullies can be challenging, especially when senior staff seem unaware or unwilling to address the issue. Speaking to the bully directly could be a good first step, but it's essential to approach the conversation calmly and professionally. Express your concerns about her behavior and how it affects both you and your colleagues. However, if you fear confrontation or worry about potential backlash, consider discussing the matter with HR or a trusted supervisor who might be able to intervene effectively. Documenting specific incidents can also provide evidence if further action is needed.

I wish you full power to confront the bully - as others say it’s not comfortable sticking your neck out. maybe not like that though?

If it's civil service then the HR department is outsourced and basically uncontactable. Usually a grievance is through your EO "Executive Officer" (team leader) who will either seek advice from HR shared service or from their manager or "HEO". Not great if the bully in question is one of these people, or mates with them. There's social clubs and stuff and I found it a very cliquey workplace. I've been a union member in every workplace so Unison, GMB etc. PCS union for civil servants was the worst and least organised I've ever needed to use. I make a point of making friends with the union rep wherever I work so that if I need them they actually help If I were OP I would join the union before you say anything to anyone so that if you need help it's not a pre-existing matter. If you say something now, they can't help you later.

I'm gobsmacked that as an ex union rep you'd even consider approaching this woman, rather than using the proper channels and involving management.

No matter how rubbish you think they are.

@TwattyMcFuckFace Yes emphasis on the fact im an ex union rep. They're largely useless, as a PP mentioned above. I dont think the union was able to successfully resolve a single issue for an individual while I was a rep. The employees with concerns always ended up simply leaving. What's the point of that? They were better with terms and collective bargaining stuff, but no good at individual level.

WOW
What a hero
I hope you all bought him a cream cake or a pint after work.

Workplace dinosaurs 🦖 are a pita...I used to take the piss ..this is how I've done it for 30 years oh maybe it's time for a change and we do it properly...I had a lot more quips to piss off a Dino.😃

I've had this in my current school from the receptionist who is convinced she is the Head. I actually get on really well with the Head and most of the SLT, but I too am in my mid-50s and can't be arsed with her nonsense. I have complained about her to her line manager and the Head and my complaints have been taken seriously.

My advice is to be professional and arse-covering. Get as much in writing as you can. Email back with any interactions: "I asked you to do X; you told me Y. Is this really the best way to solve the issue?" Blind-copy in the Line Manager

In my case, receptionist is now icily civil to me, as I am to her. However, one more strop from her to me will result in me going nuclear with her, and she is probably aware of this.