Limited access to DCs living with us, should I be worried when OH and I seperate?

[Wanstronian]

My OH and I are separating and said that we would keep it friendly for the two DCs. This meant they could choose who to spend time with rather than on a rota. They will primarily staying with him due to work arrangements.
However while we are still all in the same house, OH makes plans to take them out (without me) all day Saturday and Sunday every weekend, the only time I have to see them as I work long hours.
I don’t think this is reasonable behaviour, nor does it give me confidence that when I do live apart from them I will actually see them.
I’m thinking I may need to formalise a rota given I feel excluded even now, although I don’t want to force the DCs.
AIBU? Has anyone had a similar experience?

Just to be warned, 13 and 15 is an awkward age for parental contact anyway and kids want to be with their mates/boyfriend. SDD1 stopped coming to us completely at 16 as she was besotted with her boyfriend. SDD2 is now 14 and comes nearly EOW but occasionally we get a text saying she’s had a better offer! She probably misses about 1 in 6 of ‘our’ weekends. I’m fully expecting the number of missed weekends to go up in a couple of years before she stops coming.

Sadly, I think the times will have to be led by the kids.

If he becomes the resident parent wouldn’t you have to pay CM

What job does he have that makes him a parent that has the children

At the ages they are quite capable of getting themselves from school and looking after themselves a few evenings per week.

I would go for 50/50 and you share weekends. Alternative Saturdays and Sundays
I would also look into parental alienation

He is laying the groundwork so they choose him and he gets a bigger percentage of the marital pot, you pay him CM.
He could end up keeping the house and even as the higher earner you could end up living in a rented flat working to pay the mortgage on a home you no longer live in and rent and for all the nice trips he has planned for your dc.

Have you got a good divorce solicitor to advise you

Dont know what your finances are like but from exw’s on here who have had the children choose the father and rarely see the mother I would be getting a fancy house with a swimming pool or one with a a flatlet/den for dc to chill with their mates during the week and taking them out of a weekend

If weekends are your free time why can’t you take dc out on their own

I am assuming that you’re male because it is so unusual for a woman to be so disengaged from her children.

On the weekends when their dad takes them out have you tried suggesting in advance that you take them somewhere? eg what are you doing on Saturday? Shall we go climbing and to Pizza Hut in the afternoon?

Or offering to drive them to their mates house/sleepover/take them shopping etc? When their dad says they need to do x have you tried saying “I’ll take them to that if you like”

I wonder whether you’ve never done this before whilst you were in the relationship and have just gone along with whatever dad has organised? And that perhaps on some level you’re still waiting for him to organise things for you instead of stepping up?

If you genuinely want to maintain a good relationship with them after you split I think that you should:

• Start doing 50 percent of the shit jobs of parenting. C cooking, cleaning, washing clothes, supporting with homework, driving to friends house etc.
• Speak to your work and find a way to be around for them at least one day in the week where you’re home after school and spend some time with them or take them for dinner
• Speak to your ex and ask to put some protected time in place where you are responsible for them and he doesn’t take them out.
• Speak to the children and invite them to something that you know that they’ll like doing during that time.

Doing that means that after you split the night in the week can continue to be “your night” and you can take the kids for food or an activity that day. For teens this often remains more consistent than the weekend stuff because it’s not competing with their mates.

Once you split I think that you should aim for an every other weekend pattern but with flexibility for the kids to spend time with their friends.

Ive seen a few cases like this - it’s not unheard of for the mum to be the breadwinner and I’m guessing the OP is in fact the mum and I totally understand that she doesn’t want to rock the boat if the kids are already upset. Maybe the kids are closer to their dad. It’s really something that needs to be worked out with the kids too though because if she went to court, they’d ask the kids where they want to stay and if they say dad, that’s pretty much what would happen. So OP has very little to “threaten”‘with in the way she could if they were 3 and 5. They will vote with their feet.

OP could you ask them if they fancy a day out next weekend, maybe to the same activity their dad takes them to and then tell your ex that you’ve got plans with them that day.

Is there a lot of friction in the house? You mention that they are frequently annoyed with you.

I'd really recommend laying down some principles or rules that you formalise between you. It doesnt have to be as strict as a rota but you could have a couple of principles like "every other Sunday with mum" or something like that.
The risk with teens is that they are going to establish a preferred location, due to friends, housing arrangements etc and then the inclination to spend time going else where will be less and less as they focus on building their own social lives.
So you need to set in stone some routines that maintain contact for you without being draconian.

I think you need to take them out just by yourself and then talk to them about what they want.
I also would go through mediation- you can sometimes find charities that do this more cheaply than solicitors. Because I worry that actually you are being so controlled that you don't really see it, and maybe mediation would help you see this. (And my mediator chucked us back to our solicitors for just this reason during my divorce, he made it clear that one of us wasn't listening or prepared to compromise with the other).

I think you need to have something formalised. You do sound very detached though - is this something the dc are picking up on therefore less keen to spend time with you. What do you mean about dc being in a mood with you that they need taken out for the day. Is this your exp siding with them?

Nope they need their mum too. You agree something more equal and you don’t be passive about it. Don’t worry about wanting to force your children to spend time with you, he clearly isn’t worried. Your children are much more likely to remember that you wanted to spend time with them rather than you didn’t fight to spend time with them.

Sorry no, this is stupid.

You get a formal CAO in place by court.

Then you can also take the kids on holiday without his permission and the access arrangements are formalised.

Stop being naive.

At that age there is an element of voting with their feet. I would however be wary of parental alienation. Presumably though you’ll be agreeing alternate weekends when things progress.

It's mostly up to the kids at this age. A court wouldn't force them to see you.

OP, your post reads a bit oddly because surely if you've been a major part of their lives up until now (and even if you are the 'breadwinner', that wouldn't have stopped you), then you will know what your kids need and want from you and have some ideas about how you can spend time with them. Even if they are pissed off with you at the moment and giving you the cold shoulder. Like people have said, you do come across as a bit passive and disengaged. For instance, you say your husband 'makes plans' to take them out. Why don't you make some plans with the DC as well and then you can have a discussion about how to fit everything in?

What was the arrangement before the separation? Did you all spend time together at weekends or did your DH and the DC go and do separate activities?

Yeah that will mainly involve cafcass asking the kids what they want and going with that. No way will they force a 15 yo to have equal time with their mum if they don’t want to. The kids and ex probably won’t thank you for bringing it to court.
There’s a lot of sexist assumptions here refusing to believe that a dad can be the primary parent but yeah it does happen and maybe due to work commitments this is what has happened here and the OP doesn’t have as close a relationship with the kids as her ex does. Doesn’t mean he’s alienating them necessarily and dragging them to court isn’t going to help due to their ages. She will have to take steps to try to repair the relationship.

Absolutely. These formal arrangements might work when kids are young, but I can't imagine any 13 and 15 year old want their lives planned for them every weekend and never have time to see their friends.

Perhaps he is blinding them with great outings for the moment (as someone else said, he is certainly not keeping anything friendly), but I'm sure they'll soon get bored of it and just want some normal life.

My kids are 16 & 12 and expressed in very strong terms that they dod not want to have to choose between us when we separated. It is way too much emotional pressure to put on them.

They go to their dad's two nights a week and EOW, set in stone. If they're going out to see friends/sleepovers/parties etc that's all good but they know which house they are based at for those days.

Your kids need boundaries, consistency and love from you - don't let them drift away.

Can you even get a court ordered arrangement at their ages?

Why are they annoyed with you and why do you just sit at home while they’re all off having fun?

Why are you separating? It feels relevant.

At 13 and 15 it's really up to them how they spend their time.

But you seem incredibly passive and even a bit cold towards them - I'm wondering why you never think to arrange anything for weekends or evenings?

I think this is true. If the kids and dad have always hung out together during weekends, who would that change just because he and the OP are separating?