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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think there needs to be a public inquiry into child development

592 replies

MaryMaryVeryContrary · 19/05/2024 11:53

It really seems like we have a looming societal crisis in terms of child development and therefore the quality of the public in 10-20 years time. Experienced teachers across the board seem to be reporting an overwhelming increase in delayed, aggressive and disruptive children. I’m extremely worried about how this will impact society when they become adults - it seems (as a guess) at least a tenth of children will be incapable of work of any kind, and many more will need copious amounts of support to live any kind of responsible life.

AIBU to think we need an urgent public inquiry into this and what is going on? It seems to be the elephant in the room and anybody who tries to discuss it is shouted down.

I’m sure some of it is due to cuts in services but surely that can’t account for it all - it’s very sudden and extremely alarming.

OP posts:
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EC22 · 19/05/2024 13:57

Having both parents working full time due to financial necessity has in my opinion been detrimental to children.
Parents and families are quality time poor and this affects the interactions that optimise development.
The issue is I have no idea how we fix this.

maybein2022 · 19/05/2024 13:57

So many reasons for this and most are interlinked- it’s a huge mess and one that needs fixing, but how?

Covid/lockdown and its impact on families

Underfunding of state schools, underfunding of SEND provision and lack of good teachers/lots of teachers leaving the profession

Cost of living

Parents being busy, stressed and burnt out- I know it’s controversial on here but having two parents work full time, full on, high stress jobs gives very little ‘give’ in the family dynamic and it’s hard on everyone

UPF foods- again controversial I know but I truly believe there is a negative effect in consuming high levels of these and again it goes back to parents being busy/stressed and them being cheap and affordable (in general) and there are SO many around now

Screens- yes again controversial and my own kids have too many- but the addictive nature of YouTube, TikTok etc, not to mention how fast paced and ‘flashy’ lots of kids’ stuff is now

Parental addiction to phones (I am guilty) often because they’re pulled in too many directions and are quickly checking a work email or whatever whilst trying to also play with their toddler

Probably more things but this post is long enough 😔

MaryMaryVeryContrary · 19/05/2024 13:57

ToWhitToWhoo · 19/05/2024 13:37

Maybe not institutions (though there were some) but certainly more special schools than now.

I can’t find any facts on the number of special school places in (for example) 2005 compared to now. Are there any?

OP posts:
Pinkpolkadothat · 19/05/2024 14:00

The Mildred creak unit at GOSH is a toxic institution like set up-with many parents accused of FII

nearlylovemyusername · 19/05/2024 14:06

mitogoshi · 19/05/2024 12:18

I agree op that there is an issue, I have my own completely unproven theory as to why but people won't like it - however my friend who a child development specialist working for camhs completely agrees with me - it's screens, not just for the youngsters but their caregivers ignoring them for too much of the time. She also thinks young children do too many organised activities and not enough free play in the 1-4 age group. Her dc are teens, one neurodiverse, so she does understand that side but she isn't convinced that congenital neurodivergence is the who story, she thinks we are requiring toddlers brains, I'm not necessarily convinced but something is afoot

I couldn't agree more! it's pretty much a norm now to see a parent with a baby in pram trying to reach to her but mum is too busy with her phone. When they become toddlers they're already on phones. The damage it does is horrendous!

It's nothing to do with funding or services, just lazy parenting. Buy the time they go to school it's too late already.

Anddddwhyshouldicare · 19/05/2024 14:10

MaryMaryVeryContrary · 19/05/2024 13:57

I can’t find any facts on the number of special school places in (for example) 2005 compared to now. Are there any?

https://www.scotsman.com/education/parents-flood-scottish-council-with-bids-for-places-in-special-schools-4605140?fbclid=IwY2xjawC217ZleHRuA2FlbQIxMQABHUxS2XQnfLx7dd5Gjd1cKuFFUwkNNjvPFezYbrLvBsErTyfe3OUtSQg1sA_aem_AeOKehspgPu8saf2_Pnl0_aL_Wf00DHF8wYpSweJsRSzDwMIdKIvyBr0WjyBHOTSe8GJioxImria2f5Y364G8Kj-

This is about Scotland but it's a very interesting read for figures. The number of ASN pupils has gone from 36,544 to 259,036 since 2007. Yet the number of special schools has gone from 190 to just 107.

WalkingonWheels · 19/05/2024 14:15

Seashor · 19/05/2024 12:24

I’ve got my own theories too. Nothing proven but having been in the education sector for a very long time I’ve seen a shift in parenting, families, housing, work ethic, blame culture, diet, exercise, SEN provision, play and language and none of it is a healthy mix.

This. Plus when people of very low intelligence have children, and they go on to have children, things happen. It's unfortunate to say, but some of the parents have such low levels of...well, anything. They simply exist in a cloud of smoke and drugs and their children suffer for it. It's very concerning.

Ineedhelp1999 · 19/05/2024 14:15

I agree and this is coming from a person with a child who is ND and is aggressive and hating school.
My childs paediatrician said that she would love the funding for a child psychologist to work along side her to help children like mine but unfortunately there is no money for that.
And then these children grow into adults and a lot end up in prison.
The problem is we are always trying to help with the symptoms but not actually dealing with the cause or at least trying to work out how to help children deal with there SEN and not work against it.

Harvestfestivalknickers · 19/05/2024 14:20

I think years ago before 'screens', society was a lot more community focused. We were left to play unsupervised outside as children, but the parents and neighbours kept an eye on everyone playing together. We walked to school with the neighbours children. My parents never set foot inside my primary school. I didn't do any 'organised' activities other than Brownies. By being left with other children to play, we sorted out our disagreements, explored the neighbourhood, developed indepence and resilience.
My parents never intervened in childish squabbles but wouldn't think twice about telling off another child if they were behaving badly. The 'community' was both supporting but had clear behaviour expectations.
Now, that sense of community has gone. Children spend much more time at home on screens. They no longer spend hours playing and exploring with other children, developing resilience. They get anxious when faced with adversity as they have never had to work things out for themselves. Activities are 'organised' now, parents ferry children from activity to activity. Children no longer cycle to their friends house to go to the park to play unsupervised. I think we do a disservice to our children by trying to 'fix' things for them, we shouldn't be approaching teachers to sort friendship issues. We've got to let children navigate their own paths as they grow up.
Sadly children who spend weekends with 'Disney Dads' are being let down by parents accommodating their every whim.
I think we just aren't preparing our children for the real world. They need to face adversary in childhood in order to develop the skills needed as an adult. By giving children extra time in exams, providing 'safe spaces' andclearing every obstacle out of their way isn't doing them any favours.

MaryMaryVeryContrary · 19/05/2024 14:25

I wonder if sleep deprivation is also a contributing factor. Modern parenting seems to think it’s the norm for children not to sleep through until age 4, and to be up multiple times a night at 2/3.

OP posts:
amiahoarder · 19/05/2024 14:28

This reply has been deleted

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ for privacy reasons.

This

KirriIrry · 19/05/2024 14:29

MaryMaryVeryContrary · 19/05/2024 12:54

I was going by DD’s class. Normal state primary in an average area. 25 kids so quite a small class. 3 children with high needs. One is completely non verbal and has no understanding at all. One has anger problems, kicks/punches kids on a daily basis and trashes the classroom plus learning difficulty (he is verbal though). The other DD’s friend, lovely boy with autism who is verbal and I imagine will live semi independently but will need support I imagine for all his adult life.

Apparently that’s quite a low SEN intake as well.

But is that because numbers of children with these challenges are genuinely higher or because they are now being educated in mainstream when they wouldn’t have been before?

amiahoarder · 19/05/2024 14:30

Harvestfestivalknickers · 19/05/2024 14:20

I think years ago before 'screens', society was a lot more community focused. We were left to play unsupervised outside as children, but the parents and neighbours kept an eye on everyone playing together. We walked to school with the neighbours children. My parents never set foot inside my primary school. I didn't do any 'organised' activities other than Brownies. By being left with other children to play, we sorted out our disagreements, explored the neighbourhood, developed indepence and resilience.
My parents never intervened in childish squabbles but wouldn't think twice about telling off another child if they were behaving badly. The 'community' was both supporting but had clear behaviour expectations.
Now, that sense of community has gone. Children spend much more time at home on screens. They no longer spend hours playing and exploring with other children, developing resilience. They get anxious when faced with adversity as they have never had to work things out for themselves. Activities are 'organised' now, parents ferry children from activity to activity. Children no longer cycle to their friends house to go to the park to play unsupervised. I think we do a disservice to our children by trying to 'fix' things for them, we shouldn't be approaching teachers to sort friendship issues. We've got to let children navigate their own paths as they grow up.
Sadly children who spend weekends with 'Disney Dads' are being let down by parents accommodating their every whim.
I think we just aren't preparing our children for the real world. They need to face adversary in childhood in order to develop the skills needed as an adult. By giving children extra time in exams, providing 'safe spaces' andclearing every obstacle out of their way isn't doing them any favours.

And this - but I feel a few organised activities are fine as long as there is plenty of free play and social interactions too

Guiltyaboutwork · 19/05/2024 14:32

Another reason children don’t go off on their own cycle is the level of traffic - it genuinely is more dangerous.

WalkingonWheels · 19/05/2024 14:33

KirriIrry · 19/05/2024 14:29

But is that because numbers of children with these challenges are genuinely higher or because they are now being educated in mainstream when they wouldn’t have been before?

No, I don't think so. I think they're higher all round. Ten years ago, I may have had three or four children with ALN in a class of 30 ish.

My last year 2 class had 24 children with severe disability, behavioural issues, neurodiversities etc. The vast majority came from parents with the same issues (or high deprivation).

TheBestEverMouse · 19/05/2024 14:38

In my professional experience the overriding cause of many of these things is poverty.

If parents are working multiple jobs they don't have the energy to 'parent'. It also exacerbates or causes mental ill health. Which drains people's energy to parent. Worrying about having a roof over your head drains your energy to parent.

The sooner we start actually tackling poverty the sooner life for everyone will improve.

Bubblessz · 19/05/2024 14:39

I left school in 2012. I went to a school in Birmingham. The school didn’t care about education. For example I was always in top set for everything, but in year 9 they suddenly placed me in bottom set for English. My parents queried this but it took an entire year before they moved me back to top set. There were 8 sets so you can imagine the shift in teaching. They were preparing people for sitting foundation papers, I was going for the higher paper.

Their rationale was “that was obviously a mistake to put you in that class, but you’ll be fine”. I left school with A grade GCSEs, but that year of subpar teaching could have prevented me from getting A*.

The classes in general were cliquey in a weird way, being smart or getting high grades was embarrassing. The teachers encouraged this culture. There were plenty of areas where pupils could hide & smoke, teachers would even join the students in these areas. I was smart/shy and an outcast. You’d get mocked in class for making any sort of contribution by your peers, yet the teachers wouldn’t do anything as it those same pupils they were friendly with. Classes generally were disruptive with aggressive students, loud jokesters, drama happening every other class.

It’s weird to think it’s now that generation that are having kids as presumably they’re raising the same behaviours as being okay. So the cycle continues. Plus someone like me who was an outcast, would probably not encourage my kids to have the same school experience as me so I might not encourage them to be studious for example so they don’t face bullying

OvalLemon · 19/05/2024 14:40

I do agree with you, however I think it’s obviously a lot more reflected in statistics than it would have been say 20 years ago. There is a big focus on mental health now and it’s easier to diagnose dyslexia or other things that make schooling more difficult.
Cost of living and both parents working also means parents are less time rich and therefore some leave parenting to nursery/school because they have no choice.

luckylms · 19/05/2024 14:41

WalkingonWheels · 19/05/2024 14:33

No, I don't think so. I think they're higher all round. Ten years ago, I may have had three or four children with ALN in a class of 30 ish.

My last year 2 class had 24 children with severe disability, behavioural issues, neurodiversities etc. The vast majority came from parents with the same issues (or high deprivation).

so we come from a very middle class London borough, children are apart of a very traditional catholic school with a lot of top line range rovers dropping the kids off.
my DC is highly disabled and moderately SEN, probably the most complex in their class but there is a further 4 children with ehcp in their class all from including mine deemed “ middle class “

turkeyboots · 19/05/2024 14:47

The answers will be a complicated mix of "all of the above" poverty, screens will all fall in the mix.
But no one has mentioned parental age, which has been steadily rising since the 1970s, and has links to increasing rates of ASD diagnosis globally. ASD was always there, but the increasing rates can't just be based on better diagnosis.

Edited to add that residential units were there in the 90s. My mother had to fight to keep my very dyslexic sister out of one and in mainstream education and living at home.

TryingAgainAgainAgain · 19/05/2024 14:50

BusyCM · 19/05/2024 12:08

I don't see much disruptive behaviour, I've been a cm for 15 years and have my own teens....most children are polite, well behaved, kind, engaged.... most of the time.

The odd child with 'problems' either goes on to have an ND diagnosis or has a disruptive home life with ineffective parenting. I wouldn't say this has particularly increased though.

There is a very passive style of parenting at the moment which gives parents more trouble in the long term but the children react well to my routine, boundaries and behaviour modelling so I don't get involved, they will soon realise!

How to tell us you don't look beyond your own tiny world...

Havesome2024 · 19/05/2024 14:51

MaryMaryVeryContrary · 19/05/2024 13:03

There were no institutions in the 90s. I really think the numbers are far higher although I would be interested in comment on this from any nursery or early years professionals on here

Of course there were, SEN children would maybe spend an afternoon a week in a mainstream class, now they are in the classes full time.

Happyinarcon · 19/05/2024 14:52

Sinuhe · 19/05/2024 13:47

school went downhill when they introduced something called a ‘positive discipline behaviour model.’ It meant that bad behavior from naughty kids would be ignored, however they would be overly praised when they displayed good behaviour

Oh gosh! I remember DD constantly complaining about this... all the naughty kids had cinema afternoon, special lunchtime treats and even a prize giving! For just behaving as would be expected.
She hated school because she was one of the kids always underestimated (academically) and overlooked (quiet kid in the corner...). She's at uni now, pulling in 90-100% on her essays and exams. At school, I was told she'll fail GCSE's and A levels.

We are to liberal with our kids plus time constraints from parents, poor quality of food and to much screen time... to sum it up.

Exactly, imagine how a 6 year old feels if he or she is getting bullied, but the minute they get angry and lash out they get in trouble while their bully’s bad behaviour is ignored? And then they can’t really explain to their parents what’s doing on. It breaks my heart to think so many parents unwittingly send their kids into these awful environments. I’m glad your daughter ended up doing well :-) My daughter is also one of the overlooked and underestimated.

WalkingonWheels · 19/05/2024 14:52

luckylms · 19/05/2024 14:41

so we come from a very middle class London borough, children are apart of a very traditional catholic school with a lot of top line range rovers dropping the kids off.
my DC is highly disabled and moderately SEN, probably the most complex in their class but there is a further 4 children with ehcp in their class all from including mine deemed “ middle class “

Yes, absolutely. I'm not saying that it isn't different in other schools. That was just my last class. But there are higher levels of ALN now, whatever the reason.

Havesome2024 · 19/05/2024 14:54

Also 1 in 10 not working sounds very low to me.

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