AIBU to not understand the numbers on my DD's school report?

[UndertheCedartree]

I'm so confused!

My DD is in Y7. She started the school a term late so this was her first report/parents evening. I asked some questions about the grading but honestly I left more confused.

On her report there are numbers from 1+ up to 4. There is a number for a target and then a number from her latest assessment.

First of all I'm so confused where they get the targets from. They told me they are from data they get from her Primary school but lots of the subjects they didn't do at Primary school or not much anyway. I asked if 4 is the highest (like an A) and I was told a 4 is where they should be at the end of Y7 then a 5 is for the end of Y8. So does that mean my DD is really behind if she isn't close to 4s? And if so I don't get it as she was only a little behind in Maths at Primary. And why are her teachers so happy with her if she is doing so badly! 😂 It's all such a mystery! What happened to ABC! It's all about data now, but I just can't get my head around it.

So if they set her target as say 2 and she then scores a 3 on her last assessment they will say she is 'exceeding' and all is fantastic but actually it is a whole point away from where she should be at the end of Y7 so surely eventually it means she'll be way behind in Y11 and fail all her exams?

So my daughter is in y7. It’s sounds like they’re using the GCSE grading as if they were to sit an exam now. So no getting an A (9) in y7 anymore even for top students. We got told most were getting target grades of 1/2 for the y7 but based on my daughter getting top grades in her SATs she was being given target grades of 3/4s depending on subject. Grade 4 is actually a GCSE pass at an old C. I was just talking to a friend today and we were saying that for example those predicted 5/6 in their GCSE don’t sound like they’re doing massively well but in real life they’re Bs!! Talking year 10-11 here for this bit. The school uses the term MEG - minimum expected grade now as their target grade even though they agree it sounds less inspirational than target. And as other posters have mentioned the targets are set by a computer and not the teacher. On track means they are where they should be. Exceeding means they’re are doing better. Below or working towards means they might have a bit of work to do - or might choose to drop the subject when they take their GCSE options if they aren’t core subjects.

And yes. All grade targets are based on their SATs despite not getting SAT grades in subjects other than maths and English.

Also our school does an attitude to learning grade numbered between 1-5 with 5 being the best. But this is purely for attitude. So even low achievers who work hard can get a good attiitide score but this means nothing in real life when they look for jobs!!

Also my eldest is in y10, the year that covid stopped the SATs. They decided to do CAT tests at the start of y7 in order to gather date for the prediction of future grades even though they were all given teacher assessed SATs grades in their end of year reports. Obviously no one was believing the teachers without exam conditions being in place and a standardised test.

One of my youngest daughter has a friend (y7) who missed SATs due to an unfortunate accident resulting on a lot of school missed. The secondary had to data to go off and she’s spent y7 being moved sets for many of her subjects as they didn’t know where to place her.

It says on ours at the bottom the scoring system, does it not say anything? Normally 4 is good with ours and 1 is bad?

I think you have had quite a bit of good advice but just in case this helps.

Schools do vary so I’m pleased you’ve asked for a better explanation as it might be different in your school to what you are told here.

DD in KS3 also gets only numbers for attainment and target and no commentary at all.

I was told the targets for end of year are relatively arbitrary but based on what they’ve previously done.

The other score is what to focus on as this should be where she is now.

As others have said, at our school it’s 1-9 based on GCSE grades which if they are progressing at a rate they expect them to then it’s an increase of 1 grade per year.

A PP said a 4 would track to a 9 but I think that’s wrong.
yr 7 = 5
yr 8 = 6
yr 9 = 7
yr 10 = 8
yr 11 = 9

I agree with PP who said 7/8/9 are all equivalents to As.

So someone who is achieving a 1 at the end of year 7 is expected to get a 5 (which is roughly a high C/low B in old money) for GCSE but obviously a lot can change in that time.

We also get effort words like outstanding, good etc which is what I most focus on.

Where my girls went, from Y7 the grade on the report was where they were on the gcse's exam results. So they knew how far off the target for Y11 from the off.

Oh my! This does sound confusing!!!

we had percentages. It was up to the teacher to design the test so that 50 was a fail and 80 was very very good.

this makes no sense. And I remember being seven and we had letter grades but it was like G-good S-satisfactory E-excellent. I remember being soooo frustrated with the teachers saying im soooo good - but Kathryn got an E and I got an S+. SO WHAT AM I DOING WRONG AND WHERE!!!

anyway. Percentage is better! You know where you’re failing. And I really feel you, bringing up past traumas over here! lol. This is beyond confusing.

it’s like the driving instructor that you have to do 4 drives with giving you a 6/10 on the first one, only so you can show improvement with their instructions- but nothing really changed!

@UndertheCedartree

It’s great to hear you’ve put a plan in place with your DD’s maths teacher. That’s great as she’s still year 7 so has plenty of time before GCSE exams etc.
As a previous poster said, I agree that focusing on helping her maths skills now should really help her later on - both in GCSEs and just general life, like being able to work out how much wages she’s due, how much spare money she has left when she’s paid her bills etc. as an adult.
I’m sure you’ve probably got this in place, but I’d really recommend regularly checking in with your DD’s maths teacher to review the plan you’ve made and her progress towards her goals. Perhaps you could email/have a phone call with her maths teacher on a regular basis maybe once a term?

Also I feel I ought to mention about self-esteem - please try to regularly point out what she is good at and what she enjoys so she develops good self-worth. Try to teach her to recognise her own strengths too. I’ve worked with children who’ve really struggled in English or Maths and who’ve had really poor self-esteem and who constantly judge themselves against their peers who achieve much better academically in English/Maths than they do. It’s heartbreaking to see. There’s so many other things that people can be good at aside from just English/Maths but some children really struggle to see that. I’ve seen it lead to mental health challenges in later secondary. Please just keep this in mind about your daughter’s self-esteem as she quite possibly compares herself negatively to other children at sometimes just because of maths.

Also, it might sound like an obvious one, but I highly recommend that she learns to be fluent in times tables up to 12 x 12. If someone doesn’t know these, it can really hold them back in many of different areas of maths in secondary school.

Also, I recommend seeing if there’s any activities she could do to improve her number sense. Lots of children who struggle with maths can struggle because of their number sense. (This is such a long message already! So please Google ‘number sense’ if you’re interested in this. There’s lots of activities she can try to try and improve this & the best idea would be trying this regularly - e.g. 20 mins every Sunday).

Finally, I just thought I’d mention the condition dyscalculia. It’s not that well known, but it’s in the same family of conditions as dyslexia. Whereas people with dyslexia struggle with reading/writing/spelling, people with dyscalculia really struggle with maths and numbers. It’s a Specific Learning Difficulty and at school is a Special Educational Need (SEN) but unfortunately it often goes undiagnosed and unsupported. I’m obviously not claiming that your daughter has this! But I thought I’d mention it, just on the off chance she has symptoms of this and it hadn’t been picked up. If this is the case, please discuss with school (e.g. SENCO and her maths teacher and her tutor) and she should be able to get extra support in place.
You sound like a great parent and you sound very engaged and supportive of your DD’s education so you’re doing great!! Best wishes for the future to you and your DD!

Yes, when I was at school I think we had one report with ABC etc. Then the Summer one showed the percentage we got in our exam. They seem to do assessments every 5 minutes but one of the teachers did comment that she didn't think the last assessment really showed DD's ability (she scored too high) and it was because she had a lot of help from the LSA. Not sure if they have official summer exams.

My DD had Long Covid when doing the SATs and in the preparation time. Her SATs results don't really reflect her ability. So essentially it seems no one will push her to achieve her potential because of that?

Dragon and beetle?? 😂

No, it was different because it was based on what a child of that age was expected to achieve.

This is not based on that. It is based on some very random 'targets'. Her target for Maths is 1 so she could get a 1+ and be 'exceeding' but that doesn't necessarily mean she is meeting her potential, let alone exceeding it.

The actual report just says 'meeting' 'exceeding' etc.

The number targets are on an app you can look at and there is no information about what they mean.

Thank you for your kind words and all the information - so, so helpful! 💜

I emailed school to ask how the targets are worked out and what the numbers mean. Her head of year kindly replied letting me know what 'exceeding' 'meeting' etc. means! So I'll need to try again!

Helpful!

I'm an old fossil (67) but quite frankly this is all unintelligible gobbledygook to me. What on earth is wrong with plain English, I'm convinced this nonsense is used to make parents feel left out of the loop.

So I have managed to get more information.

The target grades are based on SATs. (Wish DD hadn't done them now. I thought they were to see how good the school was) I had no idea her predicted grades for GCSEs comes from her SATs where she did not perform to her potential due to Long COVID! Oh well, at least there won't be any pressure on her.

The numbers they get are based on GCSE grade. So in Religious studies she is 'developing' as she got a 4 in her last assessment and her target is 4+. However, the 4 means she could take a GCSE in Religious studies now and pass!

But Maths she is 'exceeding' as her target is 1 but she got a 2 in her last assessment.

So you tell me...which is she doing better at? 'Developing' ( assessment score 4=8 GCSE) or 'Exceeding' (assessment 2=6 GCSE)

I'm sure I just need a bit of a paradigm shift!

That's how my kids' school did it too. It's a load of bull! And totally against the idea that SATs are a measure of the school / teaching and not the kids.

I know! That's what we get told and then all of a sudden their whole school life til 16 is mapped out due to them!

I have suggested to various schools I have been at that secondary grades should be given with centiles in the school (like the red book for height and weight). You could see your child moving up and down from term in each subject. You could see where they were now compared to when they entered the school, if they were getting comparatively better or worse. Then, on the right hand side, you could see what grades kids are those centiles got in their GCSEs last year.

I’ve been shot down every time - no one wants to give that much info to parents, particularly when it could be interpreted negatively against the current teacher.

When the grade above A (above) is E (exceeding) as it was at one of my schools, you know the world has lost the plot.

Centiles is a terrible idea! What good would it do? Oh Mrs Smith, Johnny is on the 1st centile, now what are you going to do about it?

And imagine the impact on children's self esteem - haha Johnny you're right at the bottom!

I'm honestly not sure how the SATs grades relate to the target grades.

DD got a decent grade in English but a bit low for Maths in her SATs.

From that she has 3s and 4s in more arts based subjects and 2s in science type except Maths is a 1+. So she has a 2 for Technology where she is apparently top of the class. She has a 3 in Geography which is her worst class. So not sure of the accuracy of these targets!

I’d focus on the comments/targets and not worry about the grades at this stage. They are designed for the school to prove it’s tracking and that it is adding value. My school currently has a 1-12 grade which is new and which we, as teachers, still find confusing!

As a teacher, the grade predictions are pretty nonsense but for you as a parent the range is probably what matters. So if the school does 4 as the top of y7, then knowing your child is too, middle or bottom helps a bit know where they are in relation to their cohort BUT that doesn’t necessarily mean a gcse grade 9 partly because most schools don’t get an even run of grades - if 20% get a 4 on y7 it other be completely unrelated to the % that get a 9 in y11 ifswim

also ofsted (and most good teachers) think doing this kind of gcse flight path is totally nonsensical and turns kids off learning. They should not be doing gcse style content or questions in ks3 - they should be learning the wider subject and a strong foundation for all subjects (I’d argue whether the school does it for gcse or not!) so they are interested in learning in later life

your school should send the report on one side of the paper and an explanation on the other. No parent has this info in their head when they get one a year