Should this child be assessed?

[Boutrosboutros]

I'll post soon with my relationship to this child, but I would like to know if you think this child would warrant an asd assessment.

It's a girl, late primary age. No problems with speech - in fact she was early to speak and now has a very advanced vocabulary for her age. She struggles with friendships with children her own age, she can be bossy and precocious and doesn't suffer fools gladly. She tends to play with younger children at school. She struggles on playdates to not control the play and will often suggest 'reading together' as an activity to children who come to her house.

She's a high achiever academically but spends a lot of her time off in a dream world. She's obsessed with horses and ponies and will bring conversations back round to them where possible, although she can also have very high level, adult type conversations about life too. She's very easily upset and worries a lot about cruelty to animals and the environment.

She makes great eye contact and doesn't seem too bothered about routine or changes to it. Doesn't tend to have meltdowns and enjoys following rules and instructions.

YABU - this child may well be ND and it would be worth exploring further
YANBU - this is a normal but quirky child, wait and see what happens

Thanks for giving your opinion!

Sounds a bit like me 40-odd years ago. Possibly ND but seemed to cope OK.

What would be the reason for seeking assessment? Where is she struggling?

The parents of this child should read about autism in girls and see if this matches their dd.
There was a girl in dc’s class who was similar and she ended up with an ASD diagnosis. Year 6 was when her parents felt that the differences and difficulties with her peers couldn’t be overlooked any longer and started the diagnosis process.

Sounds exactly like me as a child, I am not ND.

Sounds like me too! I'm not ND

Sounds like you are describing my ASD/ADHD 11 year old DD

Could be ND. Could be high IQ.
Or nothing.

What does school say?

Does she struggle?

Sounds like me as a child and now my DD. I was late diagnosed AuDHD. I’ve asked for my daughter to be assessed twice because she’s so like me at the same age and paeds refuse on the grounds that she ‘functions too well in school’ 🙄 so it could well be similar for this girl if she’s bright.

Possibly neuro diverse, but if even if diagnosed not sure what difference it would make as she manages well in school. Might actually knock her confidence giving her a formal label.

Sounds exactly like me as well. Book-loving horse-loving social introvert who overthinks and worries about everything.

I'm NT. (I think).

Apart from the 'doesn't have meltdowns' you could be describing my daughter and she is autistic.

We had her assessed as the need for control and struggles with emotional regulation were becoming very hard and translated into not wanting to go to school as she was struggling (not with the learning but with the other children not following the rules properly).

We sought a diagnosis as we thought it would help her and us (and other adults) understand her quirks and learn more effective strategies. She was relieved when she was diagnosed.

@Janedoe82 autism/ADHD is not a label, it's a diagnosis!

There are a lot of sinilarities with mamy autistic daughter BUT..lack of meltdowns is a huge huge difference.

My daughter struggles in so many ways to self regulate and gets overwhelmed ..ie after school..is now missing more and more school.

I think if this child is going through life without meltdowns I would think of that as a big difference

So - to reach the diagnostic criteria you need to break it down into the key areas that they look as for the Dsm 5

https://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/autism/hcp-dsm.html

I found it really helpful when preparing for assessment to go through all of these with examples.

for example - autism is a social and communication disorder (though I don't love the word disorder it is important to remember this young person will be suffering problems in communicating with peers/ others)

In the diagnostic interview they asked questions like 'do they have problems on playdates/ do you notice a difference in how they are treated socially compared to others their age'

Do they come across as 'odd' or 'peculiar' - that would be a marked difference not just being able to talk well to adults - when you say they bring the conversation back to horses - do they do that in a way that is a bit unusually 'blind' to context compared to others their age (ie. do they do it when clearly nobody wants to talk about horses/ it's not appropriate - so it appears a bit 'odd'

They may not have meltdowns as often if they have been in same primary school since 4 and have been very well accommodated

We noticed my childs autism a lot more when we moved schools and she was enormously challenged in a new environment.

yes- my daughter has a formal diagnosis of ADHD. The only real benefit of this is she is able to access medication and gets extra time in exams. However if you asked her would she rather not have ADHD than have it the answer would be a resounding no!
Children don't want to feel different to their peers and of course it knocks their confidence.
My point is- only seek a diagnosis if you feel it will actually benefit the child having a bit of paper confirming what you already know.

Sounds like the pony girls I knew growing up tbh, and they seem to do fine as adults. Still keen on horses, very strong on animal welfare etc.

The part about playing with younger children would make me wonder, depending how long that pattern has been going on. But she is at that age where some girls suddenly lose interest in anything that doesn't involve vaping in the back field with broccoli heads in tracksuits, while others look on in horror and think "I might stick to ponies a bit longer thanks". So I would probably base it on whether she seems happy or unhappy.

Sounds exactly like me as a child and I am autistic. Apart from the meltdowns and the early speech development very similar to my autistic son

I'd ask school senco to assess and take it from there

also we live in a culture that has forgotten that mixed age play is normal - children all develop at different ages. Just because we split them all up at school - doesn't mean its unusual to enjoy play with different ages.

Your final description of her sounds less like she would meet the criteria

It may be she has traits but wouldnt pass the diagnostic criteria.

She might be, but if she isn’t struggling, would an assessment / diagnosis really help her?

@TheYearOfSmallThings I would love to know what you mean about broccoli heads?!

Thanks everyone for your replies. It's really appreciated. Many of you were close to the mark - the child was was referring to is/was me.

DS1 is the same age and has been put on the pathway, I'm finding it all very confusing - he does have meltdowns, which I didn't - but there are a lot of similarities otherwise, but I've never thought of or questioned whether I was ND. I'm finding it hard to get my head around and asking myself if I might have been autistic this whole time and not have realised.

I was definitely an 'outsider' at secondary school, bullied a lot for being a 'weirdo' and not fitting in. Autistic teens seem to talk about feeling like an alien and not understanding social complexities, which was definitely true for me - i couldnt keep up with people being in and out of favour for small things they did and I could never seem to find the right thing to say - I would be laughed at and not understand why.

I spent a lot of my teens on books and ponies as well and never fell in with the 'broccoli head' crowd (also intrigued about what that means!??!)

But when I got into my late teens things started to fall into place. I found my tribe at university and then loved travelling and working, am now happily married and think I have a lovely group of friends who I share everything with and love spending time with.

I guess maybe I had traits as a child but outgrew them? Or maybe was just a weird kid without being ND? I'm just finding it all very confusing. I really appreciate everyone sharing their own experiences and what they have found, good to hear from other women who felt the same as me but also consider themselves NT!

These are broccoli heads:

And btw OP I feel you made the right choice sticking with the ponies!

And regardless of whether your DS gets a diagnosis or not, if he is like you were then it is very likely he will be just as happy with his life when he is your age. But maybe have an easier time in secondary school (or at least have an explanation for why he is finding it shit, if he does!)

Thank you - this is a lovely reply and makes me feel better!

I'd get her assessed now so you have a fighting chance of getting an EHCP if it all goes to pieces in secondary school. (I speak from experience)

Just wanted to point out that you do not outgrow your neurodivergent traits (if you are indeed ND). You just learn how to manage life and your environment better as you mature. You do sound like you may be autistic , I have a lot of experience in this area although of course you need an actual assessment to confirm. The traditional symptoms of eye contact, etc. are not always true for every autistic person. A very large number of parents are finding out they are ND because their kids are assessed. Do also look into the traits around gifted/high potential children (look up parenting high potential charity). There are a lot of similar traits between gifted and autistic. That may also explain why you felt different.