Is this child being abused?

[DDDN]

This is more or a WWYD but posting for traffic…

I was doing nursery drop off today and saw this mom with twins (3-4 year old) First time seeing her there so maybe new? She said ‘I should slap you for this…lets go’ to one of the children. First part in foreign speech (I speak this language too) and ‘lets go’ in English. I believe the child left something…I was in the corridor fixing my child kids’ coat in direct view of the doorway they were standing at (6 meters away from them). Not sure what to do or even if anything should be done??? I do not want to get involved in other moms business but can’t get the image of the child out of my brain…he was just looking up at her frozen. I feel like she said it to my child…I know that sounds crazy. I did say to her ‘be careful what you say. You might get reported in the language we both speak. She said ‘ok thanks ‘- totally unperturbed.

Mind your F business and move on? Or
Don’t be stupid - tell staff!

I don’t want to cause issues for anybody…I mean some people can say violent things and not actually action them…wish I never over heard this.

@Mama2many73 ,

Again I wasn’t there to hear the tone or see the child’s reaction.

But you are completely misrepresenting the OP. The child, who clearly had refused to walk, was told they would get a smack if they didn’t move. They weren’t told that they needed or deserved a smack.

All the child needed to do was walk when asked to. The fear was probably zero. And it might have been an empty threat anyway….

Because context is important. I don’t agree with smacking, but mentioning that it’s still legal is key to a post about asking if they should report

I wish someone had reported my mum for shit like this when I was little.

Sorry, that was a classically unhelpful Mumsnet response from me. (Dramatic statement, no guidance, nothing useful to say, mic drop routine.)

I do think a report would be useful, OP. I used to be the kid who would be sniped at (and later swiped at) like this by my mum. Not even the people close to me took it seriously. It would have been nice to have had these things properly looked at by another adult in my life.

I genuinely despair of some of the performative 'I'm a better parent than you' posts on here. 🙄

If the mum was threatening to give them a slap she was probably at the end of her tether. If the child then moved it obviously worked. No harm, no foul.

Plenty of children in this world that would significantly benefit from having a smacked arse once in a while.

I'd mind your own business OP.

If a (for all we know isolated) threat constitutes 'abuse' in a country where snacking is legal, most people over the age of 30 were abused because they grew up in a time when not only the threat to smack was a regular thing but also the execution. For what it's worth I don't smack my kids. But I also don't believe that whole generations were collectively abused.

I think there is this naive belief that there are these people out there who can turn a cold crap parent (even assuming this woman was one, which she might not have been) into a warm loving one, and lots and lots of them, when you consider how many poor parents there are.

Most people who say ‘I wish my parents had been reported’ think that, I believe. Would they have really wanted to have been removed to a care home or to foster parents? Do they really believe that their parents would have been radically changed by a couple of social worker visits or a mandatory parenting course?

Reporting something will only make a difference if the sum of the reports exceeds a high threshold (way beyond an occasional actual smack). There is just zero cause for concern based on the OP.

Have those saying to report thought about this or is it just reflexive virtue signalling?

Yeah, you're right. Best not to say anything at all 🙄

Report it.

It will be a single piece of a puzzle. Only if there are other pieces that have come to light will it form a picture of concern.

Why do it? Because safeguarding children is all our responsibility.

I don't care that hitting small children is still currently legal in England. Hitting your child is not good parenting and parents who do this on a regular basis need to be offered advice/parenting course to help them develop other skills to manage behaviour.

There are enough threads on here about children behaving utterly ferally while their weak parents stand by pandering to them.

Lots of other cultures are far stricter with their children and have much higher standards of behaviour. That's a good thing.

I wouldn't dream of reporting a mother for this.

Totally agree with this.

Parents from other cultures must think we are totally mad.

I would report this to the nursery manager. As PP have said, it’s better to be safe than sorry and safeguarding is everyone’s responsibility.

If the mum talks to her child like this in public and he is visibly frightened of her in public, there is a chance that more serious things are being done to the child at home behind closed doors. What the mum is saying is clearly frightening and upsetting her child and that is never acceptable. He should feel safe and comfortable around his family. Yes he may have done something wrong, but there are ways of helping children realise they have done something wrong that do not involve physical intimidation and that are effective.

It’s crucial that this child is protected, especially at such a young age - first of all, so he knows there are responsible adults looking out for him, and second of all, because he’s very young so he’s particularly physically and mentally vulnerable.

If something does happen to the child and you have already reported his family’s behaviour, at least you will know you have done what you can to support him and help him. I’m not saying that anything will happen, but just in case.

I completely agree with this. By reporting the mum, you are not risking anything or doing any harm. You are helping to prevent any future harm by providing a piece of a puzzle that paints a picture of the child’s life, upbringing and risk of harm.

What the mum is saying is clearly frightening and upsetting her child and that is never acceptable. He should feel safe and comfortable around his family. Yes he may have done something wrong, but there are ways of helping children realise they have done something wrong that do not involve physical intimidation and that are effective.

Oh come on. Young children are often upset and frightened by a telling-off. That's what makes it effective. There is a world of difference between 'you'll get a slap if you don't x' and a physical beating.

I have a friend from another culture whose mother smacked him as a child – until one day he laughed at her and said 'mom, I'm too big for that'. They are as close as can be, and he is the most decent, respectful person I know.

I have another friend covered in scars from his father beating him with a belt. These experiences are in no way comparable.

Thanks to everyone for their perspectives on this. I think some clarifications are in order:

1. the child was not being difficult. The context was: child had forgotten something. Upon realisation, mom said the comment to him then ‘lets go’ to him. I said what I said and off they went (presumably in search of the item).
2. The specific words used in this language means to slap someone in the face in a harsh manner.
3. Tone - raised voice and angry.
4. child - staring up at her with a blank/frozen look

I have read all comments and understand that there is a moral and legal aspect to this situation. I also understand that in some cultures/countries/situations/households smacking is ok. I decided to report based on age and context. Some will agree and some will disagree. While I feel I may be breaking this weird sense or mom loyalty to other moms…I feel the age of the child (possibly non verbal or sen - who knows?) is compelling enough….thanks everyone. I may no longer respond as to me this situation has been resolved. I reported it this morning. As many assumed - did not seem like big deal…

@DDDN you did the right thing! It could be nothing, it could be something but at least you have reported it to people who can act on it.

Well done you, it can be a hard decision to make 🤍

I realise there’s a difference between threatening to slap a child and actually slapping them. The point I’m trying to make is that I don’t think it’s acceptable to hit a child or to threaten to hit them.

There are other ways - that are still effective - to tell off children without hitting them. For instance, lots of teachers (in the U.K.) manage to tell off children effectively, but none of them use physical violence or threats of violence - because if they did, they’d be struck off.

When I was a kid, I was hit by one of my parents a few times. I know the reason for it was because that parent was very overwhelmed and stressed, but it still doesn’t make it okay. It upset me and hurt me, and made me scared of that parent for a long time. The only thing it taught me was that I should be scared of that parent and that it was okay to hit people. I no longer think those things now and I have a really good relationship with my parent - but in spite of that, not because of it.

I think using age and context to judge the situation is a good idea. I think you
did the right thing.

This with bells on.

Common sense.

Sorry side not but what register is this and who is in charge of it??

Yes, I did want to go into care. And she'd stopped hitting my older brothers once social workers got involved and put him on a protection plan - she just managed to keep me off the radar by not sending me to nursery or school until she absolutely had to, choosing a different school in the belief she'd avoid staff who knew the older siblings. Which she did for a while until one started at the school - the hitting reduced until I changed school again and then it went crazy for the rest of my childhood. But no records of hissed threats or bruises to validate any disclosures I made and were ignored.

At times I froze because I knew one way or the other, I was going to get slapped, punched or pushed and if I could bring it about sooner, it would be less than if she'd had hours/days/weeks to wind herself up to the most satisfying and cathartic battering.

Less keen on the 2am shock and awe as I got tipped out of bed and made to clean/duck my books, toys and furniture being thrown at me, and even less on the hot iron held so close to my face that I could feel the heat as she said she was going to melt my face off, but if I could get a slap, that was less stressful than wondering when it was going to come, mind.

With the additional info provided by the OP, it sounds like she did the right thing by reporting it. Context is everything.

It still probably won’t go anywhere, but may contribute to something more significant at some point.

Report that you hears a parent threaten a child and use the exact words. You need to be safe.

Tell the staff . Unfortunately if you are in England then physical punishment from parents is lawful and probably nothing will get down