Children taking toys off my DC

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So my DC is 19months old and we go to tots groups regularly. As I've been left on crutches and my DC has been up and down with illnesses this has become less regular. We go to one once a week now. He's become less confident after his recent spurt of illnesses and me being in hospital. I'm working on building his confidence back up.

But every bloody week at this tots group (which I also help out with) the same children constantly take toys from my DC, my little one is real gentle soul so won't take toys back or try to keep hold of them, his bottom lip just comes out and it really angers me when I look up at the parents or childminders of these children and they're either not watching and fiddling on their phones or are laughing it off. These children that keep doing it are all older than my child by as much as two years as well.

Today I'd had enough. I want to teach my little one to stand up for themselves to! So today when I saw a child trying to take a toy from my DC at first I said "no don't take it from DC, you can have a turn in a minute", child was old enough to understand but just persisted to try and push past me to take it from DC so I said "No no no" both were said nicely but with a touch of authority I'm nursery teacher. I ended up having to pick my child up with said toy just to get the child to go a way. The parent was just giving me dirty looks. 5 minutes later my child is pushing round a toy pram all happily and is shoved off of it by another child I look up to see the childminder say "oh children" and I said no, I took the pram back and gave it back to my child who had literally had it for all of 30 seconds and told the bigger child who again was capable enough to understand not to take it from my child and wait their turn, again said nicely.

Both parent and childminder always sit together with another parent, all of which have children they don't watch or are doing things they shouldn't be doing.

Anyway on the way home I was approached by two of them and told how "out of order" I was for telling their children not to do something. My reply was well I wouldn't have to if you did, I would never let my child take something from someone else, my DC is taught to share and take turns. They persisted to tell me what a b*tch I was and that you shouldn't tell someone else's child not to do something... to which I told them to stop swearing in front of my child and maybe they should parent properly or act like the caregiver they're meant to be to the children they have. They went on to say how the whole group of them were p'd off with me and would be reporting me to the lady that runs it so I would be banned, to which I told them by all means please do.

What they don't know is both ladies that run it have known me from being a week old, I'm also one of their main volunteers but they don't realise it as it involves being admin on Facebook and dealing with all the behind the scenes bits of running it. (I didn't tell them either I'm waiting on what happens next week). I also know the lady they'll report to will actually defend me, she watched the whole thing and she's also pointed out how each week these children do the same thing.

Anyway my AIBU is... was I unreasonable to tell someone else's child not to take something from my DC and to wait their turn?

I think it's perfectly acceptable to tell someone else's child "you can have X when Y has finished playing with it" and hold the space or remove your child with said toy or item. I attended a playgroup once where there was a sign when you signed in to remind parents that you need to supervise your child and step in to minimise toy stealing and physical altercations. It was also posted on the group's Facebook page that morning saying "gentle reminder about supervising your toddlers"

You need to day no. Your kids need to learn to share. I'm not in the wrong here. Your kids need to share.
I grew up in a very very working class area. I'm male. But all the women around me were strong, assertive and took no shit. This rubbed off on every girl I grew up with.do it. Tell them what you feel. Every one of the women I grew up with would

Good on you for defending yourself

they only lashed out because they know they’re in the wrong

I teach my son to take turns in the park/soft play he’s really good at it. There’s been times i’ve had to intervene at the park because another child is shoving others to get to the slide first or a bigger kid is storming round soft play knocking little ones over. Some parents just sit on their phones or cba.

Whenever I am anywhere with my 3 year old I immediately correct her if she takes someone's toy/tries to push in front of them for something. Sad to see that not many other parents do the same but I will always correct other children as well when their parents can't be arsed 🤷🏻‍♀️

Yanbu and I hope the lady who runs it reminds parents that they should be overseeing their child's behaviour to ensure no snatching behaviours.

You did the right thing. I told a child of about 4 off for kicking my toddler in the back on a slide in ikea. Her parents just stood there looking awkward and said nothing.

You done the right thing. Be interesting to see of there's any change in behaviour next week!

Are you actually a nursery teacher? If you are, have you upset any of these parents professionally?

Whilst kids shouldn't be taking stuff, it's toddler group, it happens and that's something kids learn to deal with by going. You do sound fairly confrontational and you do realise that your real gentle soul will very likely be doing this when they are 3 too, or if not this other behaviour viewed as PFB mum of a 1 year old as not acceptable.

I'm assuming you've seen the birth certificates of all of these children to check their ages and none of them are tall 1 or 2 year olds, ascertained that they don't have speech delays, that they are all only children so their parents aren't distracted for a second by a second child.

It's a kid having a toy taken off them. They will cope. You making enemies with the parents of the kids they will grown up with will probably be much more damaging to your child. Why if you are a nursery teacher can you not say 'Sorry, they are still playing with that'

You did the right thing. If parent was "distracted" they shouldn't mind you correcting their child's behaviour.

Yes, tot classes are not a free for all, they are for kids to learn how to play alongside each other, so correcting behaviour is necessary to teach the child what's right and wrong.
It also good your child sees you defending them and that just because they may be quiet doesn't mean they can things took off them or pushed around.

Sounds like the parents didn't like having someone actually stand up to them and showing them how they should behave at these classes.

You’re very wrong. My mum is passive and therefore modelled passive behaviour to her children. She used to let cousins take my toys home and I never saw them again, My sisters and I grew up like her and kids took advantage at school and then adults took advantage when I grew up. I wish my mother had raised us to be confident and assert ourselves.

It’s only in my 30s that I became my own person and stopped being a doormat.

You are likely advocating OP to raise a doormat because you prefer dealing with doormats and you want your children to deal with doormats.

Agree with this totally. I had a similar childhood, I was bullied relentlessly as a teenager, I ended up with severe mental health problems.

I could probably count on one hand the number of times DC2 has ever tried to snatch a toy off someone at a playgroup (he's 2.5) and he has always been rebuked and had the toy handed back to the child playing with it. DC1 literally never did that as they were very shy. No way will I let other kids take and take off mine, if I see it I will step in. And likewise I fully would expect people to do the same for my children if I'd missed something (for example when I had both of them with me, or if I'd popped to the loo or whatever), they all need to learn how to behave.

Good for you op.

More people need to be told that their piss poor parenting - or passive response to their child’s grabby nature (or pushy nature/ bitey nature / run around the cafe nature or screaming unnecessarily nature etc ) is shit parenting. Too many people sit back and refuse to teach their children about living in community with others because it would mean asserting themselves, and they are too selfish and lazy to be bothered. They’d rather attack you instead.

Anyway my AIBU is... was I unreasonable to tell someone else's child not to take something from my DC and to wait their turn?

I'm surprised a nursery teacher has to ask this.

It's fine obviously.

Yanbu. Totally with you here, when mine were toddlers I would never let them take toys from other children at playgroups and would occasionally tell another child “no” in a situation where the parent wasn’t supervising and their child had snatched a toy from mine. If these people have a problem then they should have been keeping a closer eye on what their children were doing.

I was out with my DD (5) last week, and it had an area that was made up of different areas like a shop, fire station, vets etc. There were two girls, one older and one around the same age as my DD playing in the shop, we waited until they came out and went to another area and then me and my DD went in. The younger girl came back around 5 minutes later and said, 'I was playing in here first, you'll have to leave' my DD looked up at me with a sad look as if it meant we would have to go and she didn't want too ' I just turned around and said politely 'No we don't, you're more than welcome to play with us, but you really shouldn't be telling people to leave, it's not polite' she said 'you have to go' (honestly never been spoken to like that by a child before. I just turned around and carried on playing with my DD, and then she left.

Yanbu - I have been in your position and done as you have, but also frequently on the other side as my dc age 3 is suspected autism/adhd and tho very caring, does sometimes jump in and start playing over someone - eg taking over something they are playing with like a dolls house. Sometimes it is also a misguided attempt to join in by my child.
I always intervene, but there are definitely occasions when I’m distracted, that other parents have intervened and I’m always content with that, if a little embarrassed sometimes that I didn’t make it there first. I agree with others that the embarrassment is likely why they blew up.

You are 100 in the right and please report the childminder to ofsted. Calling other parents a bitch is not good practice.

I am a nanny and like you I absolutely hate to see parents/careers sat around letting their kids run around snatching and basic rubbish behaviour.

There are for sure certain boundaries that aren't appropriate to cross, but from what you've described, that sounds fine to me.

I think there are lots of lessons to learn in those toddler group settings. Not hogging the toys and sharing nicely but also not snatching things already in use and starting to learn the art of compromising!

I do believe that children should be comfortable fighting their own battles though, and they should be left to figure these social dilemmas out for themselves without relying on an adult to step in and fix it for them. Very circumstantial though, of course and they don't want to feel like their parent isn't there for support and backup. I suppose its about modelling good behaviours for when they're older.

It doesn't do a child any favours to teach them it's okay to snatch from others, so although you were perhaps a bit more confrontational about it than I'd be, it wasn't wrong to say to a child that they can't snatch from someone. How else do they know what's right and wrong?

First off yes I am a nursery teacher, why would I say I was if I wasn't?

Yes I'm well aware toddlers take things from each other, however I would never not address it the situation, children do in fact need to be told no, it's how they learn what behaviour is appropriate.

When did I say my DC that I'm referring to was my "precious first born"? That's such a condescending thing to say. As parents we should be supporting each other no patronising them because they may or may not have one child.

You seem triggered by the fact I refer to my DC as a gentle soul, I'm adding context about DCs nature and it's true. Everyone of my child's nursery teachers and friends refer to my child in the same way, and yes I'm aware at some point my child will take something to but I will 100% address it, and if for whatever reason I'm distracted briefly, I'd always apologise to the other parent. That's the way I was brought up as my parents addressed things.

Not seen the birth certificates but as I'm a volunteer at the group and I help run things I've seen all the paper work which I regularly check to add children on to the system, I know all their ages and needs. Not to mention it's quite clear there are no speech and language delays by the way they talk to others at the group.

Also it's not just a case of being distracted for a second like every parent or childminder is guilty of, no one is perfect, it's constant. They literally sit there and see it as a break from having to parent or do their job ignoring pretty much everything that is happening. Half the time they aren't even in the room and it's not just for a toilet break, they just go and chat to someone in the other room. Something they've all been told numerous times by the ladies that run it is not appropriate and they should be in charge of their children at all times.

Well no actually constantly allowing you child to be pushed around sets a bad precedent and makes them think it's acceptable to be treated that way, by my child seeing me saying to others no, they will see it's now acceptable, and will start to hopefully stand up for themselves. And because exactly that I'm a highly qualified nursery teacher with additional training in unwanted behaviour, I spoke to them how I was trained, a way toddlers have been proven to respond to.

I'm not making enemies, or being confrontational, for the first time in months of this constantly happening not just to my child but others as well, I spoke up, they decided to make it personal, swearing and being intimidating towards me outside. They waited for me to be on my own thinking they had a better chance of intimidating me and having no witnesses. Well more fool them as it's on CCTV and there was a witness of another parent they didn't realise who lived opposite. I wasn't confrontational I actually calmly said what I had to say, I wasn't the one swearing in front of children. The other parent actually messaged me to check I was okay and praised how well I handled the situation, I've barely spoken to her before and she tracked me down. She also tracked me down to tell me similar has happened to her and these parents and childminders make a habit of it - something I've reported to the ladies than run it and we're actually having a meeting as all the volunteers together next week on how to deal with it, as it actually sounds like it's a regular occurrence and is the reason we've lost a fair few families recently.

To be fair if a parent asked me the same question I’d respond telling them they have every right to address it.

Think it’s just postnatal depression having a lasting effect on my confidence and making me question myself a lot. To be fair I think this has finally triggered something in me again, and kicked me back into action almost.

Thank you for the support everyone, after a mum tracked me down on Facebook and messaged me with CCTV footage of the incident today checking I was okay and showing me I’m not the first this has happened to, I definitely think I made the right decision. It’s seems it’s opened up a can of worms and we’re now having to call a meeting of all the volunteers that run the group as this appears to be a regular occurrence from these women, I can’t believe it to be honest, seems insane for grown adults to be acting like this over a voluntary church run tots group.

In the CCTV footage you can clearly see them waiting for me and waiting for everyone to go, it’s also clear just how intimidating they were trying to be and looking back I’m not sure how I held myself so calmly. As one helpful user stated I will be reporting the childminder, as I certainly wouldn’t want my child to be looked after by someone who acted like this especially not in front my child. I’d be utterly disgusted to find out that had happened and I’m concerned what these children are learning in her presence.

Not going to lie I think us all as volunteers are beyond shocked by this. Not something the ladies that run it have ever known of happening in the 60 years of the group being run. I just don’t understand it but it’s being dealt with now which is the main thing.

Well done OP, those cows can fuck off with their horrible kids elsewhere !

Good for you OP. What an odd and scary escalation on their part. Great the rest of the team are supportive.