Not to negotiate my inheritance

[Needafriend14]

I need a hand hold and some advice please.My DM passed away last July after a battle with cancer. Im still grieving there isn't a day goes by that I don't think about her. I miss her so much.she was my best friend, confident and gave me unconditional love.I was blessed. We were joined at the hip.I took her to luncheon clubs, art clubs ,GP hospital appointment, shopping etc

Rewind 5 years ago and she 'gifted' me and my family a deposit for a larger house so she could move in with us.I had an extension made like a flat to accommodate her.

She took ill last February and it was down hill after that.My 2 brothers (lets call them Bill and Ben) came into ours lives after only visiting once or twice a year..

They asked about a Will and had she had made one.She had I was given 40% both Biil and Benn 30% ( I know very distasteful at this time in her life) they knew about the gift and said it was Ok. However they had the Will revised (unbeknown to mum, she agreed in the end that Ben instead of Bill and myself was executors. I was still one of the executors.

Fast forward 5 months when she had passed away and Ben couldn't wait to send it to probate.He didn't organise anything else.

Anyway legalities went through and I don't think it was what they had been planning (I think the solicitor knew what they were up to). To their dismay the 'gift' was included in the final distributions.Ben rang me and said I hadn't disclosed it. I said I had and he asked the probate manger proof or this.When received proof he suggested that I get back to her and say that I borrowed it ( the gift)He then asked probate to revalue the Will because it wasn't fair and claimed that he me and DM had had a conversation about early inheritance !!

All over Christmas he was messaging me saying he has now hired a booking ledger to look at 7 year statements (I presume he thinks I have been dipping in her account) I haven't.

It has been horendous no compassion I have been in bits.

All through this he is saying (in a very polite professional way he is just doing what an executor does) and wants to distribute the money evenly. Because I had the gift and it should be equal.

This point I am not communicating with him. Bill gets on and suggests a mediator with legal qualifications. I state I don't need one there is nothing to discuss the probate manger has confirmed twice that everything is in place and that signatures are needed.

Any way Ben won't sign the final documents and has threaten me( in a nice way) with the 7 year statements.His last message was 'no stone will go unturned' We need a mediation!'

Sorry it's so long thanks for reading I just needed to get this off my chest to see what you all think AIBU? It is effecting my wellbeing and I can't put mum to rest.

I'm not sure I understand? Does Ben think the money your mum gifted to you should be seen as a 'loan' to you and therefore be part of her overall estate?

Do you have anything in writing to prove your Mum gifted you the money outright?

Your gift is to cover the expense of your mother living with you in her final days. They did not have the expense of building a livable space for your DM so they should factor that in.

If balancing the books, consider your gift and then also throw in the money spent for your granny Annexe to the calculation.

Just to add, the time spent caring for your mother that they haven't had to pay care fees for a care home or care visitor they should count that as their gift.

The hourly rate for care is about £12 per house so tot up ALL the hours of care that you gave her (that Bill and Ben did not have to pay thank to your efforts) and then say you are entitled to extra because of that

God, this sounds so upsetting. Sorry OP you've had a difficult time. Can't offer advice as I know nothing about the topic but you should get your own legal advice, your DM wouldn't have wanted this to be the situation. Remember the relationship you had with your DM and the special, great times you shared. Bill & Ben were not there and your DM knew that you were.

Just to clarify, your mum gifted you a deposit for a house, which she then lived in with you.

Upon her death, all her assets were split 40/30/30 (you/Bill/Ben) but this does NOT include (quite rightfully!) the deposit she gifted you.

And the problem is that Ben thinks the gifted deposit should be seen as a loan and form part of your 40%?

e.g. she gifted you £100k. She had £200k of assets when she died in which you got £80k, and Bill and Ben got £60k each. But Ben thinks the assets should be £300k (and include the deposit) so you get £120k and him and Bill get £90k.

I think Bill's idea of a mediator is sensible. It might help Ben see sense. At some point he will surely want his share of the money?

Sorry your brother is such an inconsiderate dick!

Ben sounds like an absolute turd. You have done and are doing nothing wrong.

I am very sorry for your loss, OP. I hope my own DD and I have the same lovely relationship that you had with your mum.

I don't understand however your comment that they changed the Will without your mum knowing. That simply isn't possible unless you mean they pressurised her into changing it (but she still would have known it was being changed).

It was a gift everyone knew it was a gift and now the missing in action brothers want a share in it. I would wait and see what they try to throw at you. If you have nothing to hide they can find nothing. Probate have accepted it was a gift, if the estate is into IHT there might be some tax to pay, although well into taper relief.

Let him do his worst, I hope the estate isn't paying for his belligerence. The solicitor should be the one to investigate any suspected irregularities, can you talk to the solicitor and find out what is going on? The brother is not now doing what executors do, that was finished with probate passed, not signing off because he wants a share of your gift is not being an executor.

I am so sorry you are going through this OP.

You are right to stand your ground. However I think you will be most successful, and ultimately come out ahead, if you consult a solicitor. Best wishes

A solicitor to act on your personal behalf, I mean

He has the right as executor to check for gifts as he needs to add those to the probate forms.
This does not affect the will and he must distribute money based upon the status of her accounts at the time of death.
If he won’t desist then get a solicitor’s letter drawn up; a gift is a gift during someone’s lifetime - if she’d wanted it to be taken account of in her will she would’ve altered it.

Funny how people who have absolutely no intention of doing even a small share of caring for their relative suddenly become interested in sharing things equally when it comes to money.

Years ago I knew someone in the reverse situation, an elderly relative had loaned someone some money, but did not have any paperwork about it just a verbal agreement. Elderly relative died and loan recipient claimed it was a gift and refused to pay it back and, since there was no paperwork to say it was a loan, they got away with it. Do check your legal position. But either way there's no point going to mediation since it's clear your brother is not going to accept a compromise.

I'm sorry for your loss. You did the best you could for your mum, I'm sure your support made a great difference to her final years.

This is so similar to the separate cases of two friends of mine who both looked after elderly parents, altered their houses and lives to accommodate them, then siblings who had barely visited tried to challenge the will. Neither challenge succeeded.

One matter I’m wondering about though - the gift was within 7 years of death and the value of that ( on a sliding scale ) can be taken into account when calculating any IHT due, thus reducing the residual estate to be divided.. Of course, the total estate may be under the IHT level. I’m just remembering this from when I did probate on my parents’ estates and could be not entirely accurate/up to date.

Oh dear - all so sad; and while you are grieving. People can be so money-grabbing.

Thank you all yes its true I did take care of her.

TimeGrabsYouByTheWrist Yes that's what he is trying to say but I couldn't go back to probate and say it was a load I declared it. He tried to say if you say it's a loan you can get away with not paying tax!

Hecatoncheires. Thank you its true I haven't done anything wrong however at times I get a really critical voice in my head. That's when I think IABU.

Spirallingdownwards · It was changed 4 weeks before she passed away Bill said he didn't want to be an executor and Ben stepped in because he is more manipulative. They are always working together.

Ben is a real turd both are its not as if they need any more money they both have holiday homes, various properties and Ben lives on millionaires row in Windermere.

I cant afford to negotiate I will have a large tax bill.They are both bully me as usual.

a gift is a gift during someone’s lifetime - if she’d wanted it to be taken account of in her will she would’ve altered it.

Surely the fact that she had given the daughter who cared for her, shared her home and life with her and was always there for her 40%, whilst the sons who sent a Christmas card in the post and saw her once a year got the lesser (still very generous, in the circumstances) percentage of 30%, is already proof that she considered the earlier payment an outright gift (albeit one that she herself benefited from too)?

Otherwise, if she hadn't wanted to reward her daughter for everything she did for her, she would have started at 33.3% each and also stated that the estate was to include the earlier gift - which doesn't really sound so much a gift at all as a payment for her own living expenses, anyway.

Rather than obsess about getting more, I think Bill and Ben should consider themselves very lucky to have got 30% each. I'm not the typical MNer who says that nobody should want/hope for/expect an inheritance - but leaving somebody an inheritance is usually a sign of love between the two of you. Only bothering to see your elderly mother once a year in her final years and then only caring about how much money she had after she's gone doesn't actually sound anything like love in my book.

@Boutonnière has raised an important point. The money gifted to you must be counted when determining whether IHT is owed, as your DM died within seven years of making the gift.

The executors and legal team need to see records of all gifts made within the last seven years for the purpose of dealing with IHT. However it really does not sound as if this is your brother’s main issue

MaybeRevisitYourWipingT3chnique Thank you so much Im going to send them both an email with this in.

Also thank you all , it is setting me up for sending a strong email. They both need to reframe their way of looking at this situation.This is so distasteful mum would be mortified.

Your DM knew what she was doing. She gave you 40% and a gift as you cared for her. She gave them 30% and no gift as they abandoned her.

Normally these days when you gift someone money to buy a house the conveyancers are all over it with AML checks ?

Even 5 years ago my guess is AML checks would have been in place and the conveyancer/mortgage holder would probably have required a signed statement from the person giving the gift that it was indeed a gift and they had no further claim on it ?

OP, I think your email to your brothers should say this. Blunt as fuck.

Ask an accountant to add up all the hours of caring you did. Invoice both of your not dear brothers a third each...

I'm sorry about your mum.

I'm not entirely clear what the position is or what change was made to the will. Am I right that all that changed was one brother rather than the other was made executor (and you remained executor? And you still have a 40% share of assets?

So brother is now arguing that the gift you had 5 years before death should be counted as part of your 40% share? That won't usually be the case as anyone is free to give away what they want during their lifetime. "The estate" is only what is left actually at the point of death.

If the gift had been a loan then you would have to repay it to the estate or (more likely) account for it in your share. But that isn't the case and your brother has no hope of proving it. The fact that you used it to develop your home to facilitate your mum's final years is substantially in your favour.

BUT there is a separate but related IHT point and your brother is right that this needs addressing. Any gifts (unless exempt ones and I don't think this would be) given within the 7 years before death are subject to IHT. It is on a sliding scale though so with each year that she remained alive the IHT sum would have decreased (this is called taper relief). The date and amount of the gift will be important so that the overall IHT on the estate can be calculated correctly. I presume that you can prove this.

I'm not sure why your brother is banging on about an audit of full 7 years of accounts. He may want to check that there were not further gifts to you within that time. As executor he can (probably should) do so, so I suggest you cooperate with that.

Once the IHT on the remaining estate is calculated and the additional taper IHT on the gift is added in, and any allowances deducted (ie nil rate band) the remainder is the estate assets to be distributed.

I expect your brother(s) will raise that the tapered IHT on the gift should be deducted from your split of the assets, not the assets as a whole. Technically I think the second position is legally correct (I'm a lawyer but not a probate lawyer so might be wrong) but it is possible to agree the first position.

When my FIL died he had made some significant gifts to SIL in the last few years and there was a chunk of tapered IHT. The probate solicitor suggested SIL could agree to have it deducted from her share but as she was the poorest out of the siblings the others agreed to lump it all in together.

I suggest (if you haven't already done so) that you give your brother proof of the gift, agree that the executors should check the 7 years of bank statements for any other relevant gifts, but be clear this needs to happen within a reasonable time (3 months? 6 months?) If he delays unreasonably you can apply to court to have him removed as an executor under article 50 of the Administration of Justice Act 1985.

Mediation sounds like a pointless waste of time and costs. There is nothing to negotiate, just facts to establish.

Did your mother sign something to say the deposit was a gift? This is usually a requirement when purchasing a house with financial help from someone else. I had to when my mum gave me money for my first house. It's to prevent legal issues in the future.

Goodness that's so awful for you.

As others have said, I'd assume she left you more as you've shifted your life to accommodate her needs, yes you wanted to, but they've just let you sort everything and doesn't like the outcome - good luck and so sorry for your loss 🥺