Incident at school

McVities99 · 2024-03-19T18:07:40+00:00

I have a 5yo boy in reception. Today I learnt that he got into a scuff with a year 5. After school club said they don't know what happened. My son said an older kid told him to kick the other boy (both year 5). He said no but he kept saying 'do it do it do it' and got stressed and kicked him. It ended up with the two older kids fighting and my son stuck in the middle. Son was upset after school and said he really didn't want to kick him but he was scared of the big kid. Nothing like this has happened before and would be grateful for any advice on how to approach it with the school and also with my son. He's just got home and is having some down time.

DelphiniumBlue · 19/03/2024 18:20

Best to speak to the school and tell them what happened. They need to be aware of this as it is a safeguarding issue. Your chid is not being kept safe.

I'm wondering why Y5 children are mingling freely with reception children, there should be systems in place to keep them apart unless very heavily supervised, because of just this sort of situation, and the fact that big children can cause quite a lot of damage to little children. In my school they are in different playgrounds, and in other schools I know they are on different timetables ,in order to avoid this.
Your DS clearly knows he shouldn't have kicked the Y5 child, but it is very hard for someone so wee to withstand pressure from an older child. Try to give him some strategies as to what he can do if this situation arises again ( walk away, tell a teacher, etc) and maybe see if his teacher can help. The Y5 should be feeling ashamed of themselves tbh, and the child who was kicked probably knows that DS was told what to do by the older child.
It may be that the school runs some sort of restorative justice scheme, whereby your DS can apologise to the kicked child, in a controlled environment, so that he doesn't have to be worrying about what will happen if he bumps into him in future, and so that he can be reassured that the boy doesn't bear him ill-will.

Original poster

McVities99 · 19/03/2024 18:24

DelphiniumBlue · 19/03/2024 18:20

Best to speak to the school and tell them what happened. They need to be aware of this as it is a safeguarding issue. Your chid is not being kept safe.

I'm wondering why Y5 children are mingling freely with reception children, there should be systems in place to keep them apart unless very heavily supervised, because of just this sort of situation, and the fact that big children can cause quite a lot of damage to little children. In my school they are in different playgrounds, and in other schools I know they are on different timetables ,in order to avoid this.
Your DS clearly knows he shouldn't have kicked the Y5 child, but it is very hard for someone so wee to withstand pressure from an older child. Try to give him some strategies as to what he can do if this situation arises again ( walk away, tell a teacher, etc) and maybe see if his teacher can help. The Y5 should be feeling ashamed of themselves tbh, and the child who was kicked probably knows that DS was told what to do by the older child.
It may be that the school runs some sort of restorative justice scheme, whereby your DS can apologise to the kicked child, in a controlled environment, so that he doesn't have to be worrying about what will happen if he bumps into him in future, and so that he can be reassured that the boy doesn't bear him ill-will.

It happened in after school club but I am still a bit worried that he was with older kids and not being watched for long enough for it to happen. Maybe I'm expecting too much.

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DelphiniumBlue · 19/03/2024 18:35

You are not expecting too much.
I know if this happened at my school, we would take it seriously, even if it were in ASC, and even if on the face of it , it's the ASC's responsibility. I know we would be asking questions. It's not OK.
I think you should raise it, in writing, with someone fairly high-up, eg Head or Deputy, as they have the school's reputation to consider. Also raise in writing with the ASC. You may have spoken to a teenager on minimum wage who didn't know what happened, or know the procedures that should have been in place. It looks like your child might not have been properly supervised, and the risks of mixing older and younger children in the absence of strict supervision were not properly assessed.
Keep it polite, and don't expect to be told the outcome, but do flag it up to those responsible in both organisations.

Original poster

McVities99 · 19/03/2024 18:44

DelphiniumBlue · 19/03/2024 18:35

You are not expecting too much.
I know if this happened at my school, we would take it seriously, even if it were in ASC, and even if on the face of it , it's the ASC's responsibility. I know we would be asking questions. It's not OK.
I think you should raise it, in writing, with someone fairly high-up, eg Head or Deputy, as they have the school's reputation to consider. Also raise in writing with the ASC. You may have spoken to a teenager on minimum wage who didn't know what happened, or know the procedures that should have been in place. It looks like your child might not have been properly supervised, and the risks of mixing older and younger children in the absence of strict supervision were not properly assessed.
Keep it polite, and don't expect to be told the outcome, but do flag it up to those responsible in both organisations.

They didn't have any record of it or anything for me to sign but said they'd have me sign something tomorrow. No idea what it's going to say as they don't know what happened. I've talked to him about walking away or telling a supervisor if it happens again however I'm not sure how easy that would be for a 5yo to do when he's got a 10yo coaxing him into doing something he doesn't want to. I believe what he is telling me.

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cansu · 19/03/2024 18:54

1 it takes seconds for a child to kick or hit another. They do not have high ratios in after school club. You can't assume there was no supervision. Two children can be chatting or playing one minute and fighting the next.

Your child kicked another. They know that isn't OK. The fact that an older child encouraged them to do it is not an excuse. Sounds more like a child trying to find a good excuse for mum. E.g. he made me do it!

LightSwerve · 19/03/2024 19:01

cansu · 19/03/2024 18:54

1 it takes seconds for a child to kick or hit another. They do not have high ratios in after school club. You can't assume there was no supervision. Two children can be chatting or playing one minute and fighting the next.

Your child kicked another. They know that isn't OK. The fact that an older child encouraged them to do it is not an excuse. Sounds more like a child trying to find a good excuse for mum. E.g. he made me do it!

If an older child of ten tells a younger child of five to do something, that is relevant.

It is bullying to encourage very young children to do things like this.

Whatever the situation, there should be adequate supervision to prevent bullying and violence.

Original poster

McVities99 · 19/03/2024 19:08

cansu · 19/03/2024 18:54

1 it takes seconds for a child to kick or hit another. They do not have high ratios in after school club. You can't assume there was no supervision. Two children can be chatting or playing one minute and fighting the next.

Your child kicked another. They know that isn't OK. The fact that an older child encouraged them to do it is not an excuse. Sounds more like a child trying to find a good excuse for mum. E.g. he made me do it!

He has never harmed another child. I believe what happened. I can usually tell when he is lying. I also doubt my 5yo would have chosen to kick a 10yo from his own free will. It would be very out of character. He's nervous around bigger kids. I think it's relevant.

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cansu · 19/03/2024 19:41

I didn't say he was lying. He doesn't have to kick someone because someone tells him to do so. He knows he shouldn't kick.

Original poster

McVities99 · 19/03/2024 20:54

cansu · 19/03/2024 19:41

I didn't say he was lying. He doesn't have to kick someone because someone tells him to do so. He knows he shouldn't kick.

Of course he knows he shouldn't, but he's 5 and was being pressured by a 10yo. He told me he said no and they kept following him when he ran away and he just wanted them to leave him alone.

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MissHoollie · 19/03/2024 21:00

It's normal kid stuff.
Good lesson learnt
I'd speak to him about not doing that hat others tell him etc and move on

Marblessolveeverything · 19/03/2024 21:00

I would not be happy with such an age gap unsupervised, this could be so much worse.

Littlefish · 19/03/2024 21:04

Is the after school club run by the school, or by a private provider?

Original poster

McVities99 · 19/03/2024 21:05

Littlefish · 19/03/2024 21:04

Is the after school club run by the school, or by a private provider?

Private provider but my son doesn't want to go to school tomorrow because he's scared. He's never not wanted to go to school.

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Soontobe60 · 19/03/2024 21:09

cansu · 19/03/2024 18:54

1 it takes seconds for a child to kick or hit another. They do not have high ratios in after school club. You can't assume there was no supervision. Two children can be chatting or playing one minute and fighting the next.

Your child kicked another. They know that isn't OK. The fact that an older child encouraged them to do it is not an excuse. Sounds more like a child trying to find a good excuse for mum. E.g. he made me do it!

Absolute rubbish! theres power play going on here. A small child being goaded into doing something by someone twice his age - the older child is exerting his power and the younger child felt like they had no choice but to do what he was told.

Littlefish · 19/03/2024 21:11

@McVities99 as it's a private provider, then the incident is nothing to do with the school.

Speak to the provider, and ask them what ratios they use. It could be as high as 1:15.

woahhhh · 19/03/2024 21:12

cansu · 19/03/2024 18:54

1 it takes seconds for a child to kick or hit another. They do not have high ratios in after school club. You can't assume there was no supervision. Two children can be chatting or playing one minute and fighting the next.

Your child kicked another. They know that isn't OK. The fact that an older child encouraged them to do it is not an excuse. Sounds more like a child trying to find a good excuse for mum. E.g. he made me do it!

Don't be ridiculous. The kid is 5. The other two are YEAR 5. And then the other two started fighting each other.

You honestly think a 5 year old rocked on up to a year 5 and started a fight 🙄

woahhhh · 19/03/2024 21:13

cansu · 19/03/2024 19:41

I didn't say he was lying. He doesn't have to kick someone because someone tells him to do so. He knows he shouldn't kick.

You are a bit clueless aren't you. Or just being obtuse. I hope it's the later because then you would just be awful. If it's the former then you are worryingly thick.

Original poster

McVities99 · 19/03/2024 21:24

Littlefish · 19/03/2024 21:11

@McVities99 as it's a private provider, then the incident is nothing to do with the school.

Speak to the provider, and ask them what ratios they use. It could be as high as 1:15.

Thank you. I'm still going to speak with the school because he's scared of seeing them in assembly. Just to let them know. I'm going to email after school club in the morning.

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LightSwerve · 19/03/2024 22:16

cansu · 19/03/2024 19:41

I didn't say he was lying. He doesn't have to kick someone because someone tells him to do so. He knows he shouldn't kick.

It's called coercion, it is well understood as a form of bullying in itself.

Original poster

McVities99 · 20/03/2024 07:03

LightSwerve · 19/03/2024 22:16

It's called coercion, it is well understood as a form of bullying in itself.

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Exactly. Of course he shouldn't have kicked him but he was scared.

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