To agree with Esther Ghey?

[ProfessorPeppy]

https://www.theguardian.com/media/2024/feb/12/i-want-to-make-things-better-esther-ghey-on-her-hopes-for-online-reform

I’m a teacher in a secondary school. I believe that the massive uptick in social problems we are experiencing in schools results from unfettered smartphone use and access to social media. School refusal, eating disorders, gender identity issues, self harm, anxiety, depression. ASD/ADHD seems to be a common underlying starting point for such vulnerabilities, but neurotypical children are also adversely affected. So many of the children I teach say things like, ‘everybody is looking at me in class, it makes me anxious’ - surely this results from a life spent on social media? Cameras on phones mean that anybody can be recorded/broadcast themselves at the click of a button, perhaps without their permission.

DS1 is 11 and about to start secondary school. He doesn’t have a phone…yet. He has an ASD/ADHD dual diagnosis and is medicated. I can clearly see that he might be vulnerable to the adverse effects of smartphone access, so I’m thinking v carefully about my next steps.

YABU: these problems have always existed for young people, and this has nothing to do with smartphones/social media.

YANBU: smartphones/social media have amplified these problems, especially for ND young people.

you can sync your child’s phone to your so you can monitor messages and phone calls. Block non age appropriate apps on their phones.

you can get phone contracts that don’t include social media apps as part of their package. Limit the internet access on their
phone.

safety and wellbeing of young kids on the internet is paramount, take a multi prong approach. So what if everyone else is doing it.
if your child is sneaking burner phones, find it and confiscate it. Tech and media companies are not concerned with children’s safety and they financially benefit from the opposite.

lots of things are not that easy, but why give up before even trying

I partly agree with her; but I do not think there is one cause. Part of the underlying problem is also parents who want to be their child's friend instead of their parent, and go along with everything they want to do.
Its not a new problem;

A hobo befriends a child and leads him astray. Who is to blame?
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0512535/characters/nm0341431

I have a 6 year old, before she hits 11 I would love to see social media access being for age 16 plus. It’s full of adult content and is as detrimental to their growing brains as smoking and alcohol are to their bodies. I can see value in a phone at age 11 for calls, texts but literally the basics.

It’s the government who needs to step up and say enough is enough, the time and money wasted in schools on problems arising from social media should be enough. Inevitably feckless parents will demand their kid needs access to Facebook, tik tok etc so they can contact x,y,z etc but we managed to have everything we took for granted shaken up in the pandemic when going out was essentially illegal so why can’t the government rip off this plaster and deal with the danger to our kids of social media?

My kids have just left school but have had regular mindfulness at school from an early age. They and their friends absolutely hated it and found it a complete waste of time. I do not believe this stuff is actually helping children.

I’ve recently come across this organisation
https://delaysmartphones.org.uk/about/#:~:text=Our%20aim%20is%20to%20protect,their%20mental%20health%20is%20today.
some people on this thread might be interested

I 1000% agree OP - I have been saying this for years. Constant internet/screen access has ruined a generation of young minds. It ought to have been over 16s only from the very beginning, but it's out there now.

I don't think there's a lot to be done for the current generation of phone addicted kids - I think that if you removed their phones now a lot of them would self harm, melt down etc

HOWEVER, that doesn't mean we can't put a stopper in this shit show for the generation coming up behind them, the younger primary school aged kids we have now. They need to be phased out for kids. Put a ban on phones with internet access for kids under 10/11 and then gradually increase that age year on year, until it hits 16. So then you aren't confiscating smartphones for current teens but you are preventing the next generation from having them in the first place. Of course you will get some families who ignore and just give their kids smart phones anyway, but maybe with a threat of prosecution they would be in a minority and the overall amount of smartphone access to kids could be hugely reduced. Some families will always flout sensible stuff like that, but a lot wouldn't and it would make a massive difference. I think a lot of families would be happy to have this worry taken out of their lives - and brick phones might be cheaper and more affordable which might add to their appeal. Cheaper and safer.

Can somebody please tell me what mindfulness is?

https://www.nhs.uk/mental-health/self-help/tips-and-support/mindfulness/

Thanks.

I agree to some extent regarding phones. I do not agree with mindfulness taught in schools. Recent studies have shown it doesn't actually help teenagers when taught in schools (although it doesn't generally make their mental health worse either). Although the NHS link above says some people find it does make them feel worse.
To do it properly you need to be quite focused and analytical, these are not traits I would identify many teenagers as having in great abundance.

What happened to her daughter was a tragedy and I admire her finding the strength to stand up for what she believes in - but I also do not agree with her. To me education is the most important weapon. I mean lots of things are illegal for teens - drinking, drugs, under age sex….does that stop them? Education is not going to solve everything but I think kids need to be taught what is in and what is not ok - and what to do or who to speak to for the not ok things.
I have been lucky in that I have older teens who I did let use WhatsApp when they were preteen because they were young enough they were happy to confide in me if issues arose. They don’t post on social media now. Their choice. I think they learnt too many negative outcomes.

I agree @Ohnoooooooo Education is crucial. Not just education about the dangers and misuse, but education about a balanced life, etc. I do think that schools could make it easier by banning smart phones and only allowing basic phones.

Mindfulness is not navel gazing. I completely agree with you on the navel gazing but mindfulness is different and something we can all benefit from. It's the opposite of modern life and is about focussing on one thing at a time and reducing the types of thinking that is really bad for mental health.

Too many parents wanting to be their child's best friend, rather than, you know, an actual grown up parent.

Too many parents too weak willed and inept to set firm but fair boundaries and stick to them.

Too many parents giving far too much serious credence to every passing whim and whimsy expressed by their child.

Too many parents wrapping up their children in cotton wool and effectively hamstringing them in the process.

Too many parents desperate for their children to like them rather than respect them.

I completely agree OP. Mobile phone use and social media is ruining the world!

"Cameras on phones mean that anybody can be recorded/broadcast themselves at the click of a button, perhaps without their permission."

I was thinking this the other day. It must be so hard growing up at a time when anything you do or say could be recorded and published on the internet. The pressure of that must be awful as a teen.

Absolutely this. Reading is a crucial influence on the ability to focus.

Last figures I saw, the average American spent 17 minutes a day reading books and 5.4 hours on their phone. The proportion of Americans who never read a book in any year has more than tripled since the 1970s.

Lots of evidence exists that kids reading from books are more focused than when reading from screens - the difference is almost a full year's development in reading comprehension.

Parents need to be there for their children - but in a way that teaches their children how to face up to what life throws at them with resilience. Encourage them not to be afraid of the world. Life is frequently unfair. People aren't always 'kind'. Be your child's advocate but not in a way that suffocates them and infantilizes them.

Parents need to start being their child's safety net. And stop being their child's straight jacket.

What a brilliant initiative.

Phones have been banned in a few schools. I think this needs to be rolled out countrywide. Gives children an all day break including at break and lunchtime encouraging them to be present and also means other children aren't worried about being recorded or photographed.

For goodness sake the judgement because a murdered child was trans. Just stop. She was murdered and her mother is trying to make things better for future teens. Stop trying to make this into yet another MN trans witch hunt.

I think smartphones are problematic at society level, but I also think it’s more complicated than just “smartphones bad”. I would definitely support schools being phone free- my dc will be at schools with this policy all the way to end of year 11 and I think it really works in terms of their social skills, mental health, activity levels and engagement with non screen activities like music or art club etc. I also discourage them from taking phones out and about if they don’t need them, like if I’m just driving them to rugby practice, they don’t need to be scrolling on the journey. There is a middle ground between “no phone” and “full and unfettered access to the dark web and tiktok trash” but it requires active parenting and sometimes having to be the bad guy. No phones in bedrooms overnight is my hill to die on and the dc know if I catch them the phone is confiscated for a week, no exceptions. I also don’t allow days where they are just on screens ( and especially phones) all day.

I also think peer group has a massive impact on use of phones- ds is 13 so I do allow social media but tbh he’s not that interested in it, possibly because his friends aren’t really either. They all play a lot of sport or are big into music ( youth orchestras/ bands etc) and I think having “real life interests” definitely combats the impact of excessive SM, both because less time to scroll, but also more time spent with RL people and broader RL experiences and networks which is good for mental health and confidence/ resilience etc . I know some MNers worry about peer influence but I have to say my dc’s friends are a positive influence if anything.

re mindfulness, yeah, I mean I do it sometimes but I’m not sure it’s helpful on a mass basis.

Also a secondary school teacher. I agree with you fully. It’s very worrying and only going to get worse, I’m afraid.

The issues of the victim and the perpetrators are linked by late diagnosis of ND and the complete absence of support in early years. Brianna should have been diagnosed before it became a crisis. Including what led up to her being in an inclusive unit where she met her murderer.

The LA wanted to place my extremely vulnerable ASD son in a PRU because he was too anxious to attend mainstream. Over my dead body. PRUs/inclusion units place together the most vulnerable with the most likely to exploit vulnerability.

The boy should have received support before becoming selectively mute and his doing sudoku at trial was used against him. Perhaps then his vulnerability and behaviour would be better understood.

Yes, most DC seem to cope at primary so wait and see seems reasonable. Then secondary school and teenage years hit and what do you see?

Vulnerability to eating disorders, self harm, gender identity issues, reliance on social media when real life interaction seems impossible, fear driven obsessions with weapons and violence and breaking the norm because you don't feel safe. Kill or be killed.

This is what can happen when support is denied or delayed because the child seems fine in mainstream. I'm surprised it doesn't happen more often.

But if we imagine the problem is gender identity or social media influence then perhaps it will.

There are too many children with issues now to provide the gold standard of care for them. It’s about just patching things up as best we can now. It’s really depressing and I’m seriously worried about our workforce in 20 years - it seems half of it will be absent due to MH crisis or finding the workplace too triggering or a sensory overload. Things aren’t looking good at all.

I was beginning to think I was the only one with this opinion.

That poor kid.