Burnt out colleagues setting standard

[TheAquaMoose]

I work in a small sales department with three other people. Two of whom are slightly more senior and part of leadership teams.

We're contracted for a 35 hour week and I regularly clock up around 40 hours, complete tasks on time, meet targets etc with no issues. I sometimes do a bit of work in the evening or at the weekend when needed but try to maintain clear boundaries for work/ life balance as I've come close to burnout in the past in other roles and have family responsibilities.

The two more senior people are both workaholics, doing 50+ hour weeks or more all the time, emailing at 11pm, weekends, into their annual leave time and never really switching off.

One of these colleagues is in therapy for anxiety, the other has been pulled up by HR for not taking breaks/ eating breakfast etc. Their results have been a bit better than mine, however their mental health and wellbeing is suffering and I'm not sure if both will be able to sustain this work rhythm forever.

I do offer to help both colleagues regularly so they can work less. One accepts but has so many other responsibilities that it doesn't change much, the other is a very reluctant delegator. It's worth mentioning we are on track to meet all revenue goals and figures are good.

The CEO commented that I'm not as driven as these two colleagues. Maybe he has a point but I also feel these colleagues set impossibly high benchmarks at the expense of their wellbeing and is it fair to expect everyone to do this all the time? The CEO has commented that everyone should be doing extra hours (not just sales).

During my working hours I am very driven and focused on meeting the numbers, getting deals done etc but I'm not prepared to do 50 - 60 hour weeks every week (I've done it occasionally for big deals and events)and risk my mental health and burnout. I'd be no use to anyone then.

AIBU with my view? I think since having kids I'm just conscious that work is work and I don't think burning myself out and sacrificing my health for a company that would replace me in a heartbeat is a good idea. That doesn't mean I'm lazy or don't care either. I work hard, but I also eat breakfast, take breaks, delegate etc

It’s not you it’s them. Find another job.
MerryOldGoat gave excellent advice.
And this is your (higher paid than you) boss’s culture problem to solve, not yours. Leave that job before you start losing your own boundaries. It will make you ill.

I had an excellent manager years ago who always said regular overtime just masks resourcing or capability issues.
I’ve always remembered that and it’s universally true.

100% right

No-one should regularly be working way over their contracted hours to achieve/exceed their targets, unless it’s your own business! You should be paid for (regular) extra time in my opinion or more staff should be employed to meet requirements. Its not good for mental health, work/life balance etc.

If your CEO remarks again just tell him the necessity for your colleagues to continually do extra hours is an indicator that they either can’t cope with their workload because they are not as efficient as you or whoever planned out their job responsibilities ( the CEO??) did not calibrate it competently and it should be reassessed! Then give him/her a big cheesy grin and head home for the day!

If you’re salaried rather than hourly paid, then you’re not so much paid for your time as for your output, there is an expectation that you will have to do a reasonable amount of extra (making international calls, finishing time sensitive tasks etc). But your colleagues are way past that and it sounds like you are pushing the limit of what is reasonable too. Don’t back down and maybe look elsewhere.

Work smarter, not longer & harder

It is illegal not to take breaks
Also, if you do not take a break, you will always be expected to not take a break

I have never worked whilst being on holiday & never will

I’d be tempted to slip the phrase « duty of care » into the conversation. Then I’d start looking for a new job.

What are you/your colleagues hourly rate like? If you calculate it with your additional hours are you at risk of falling below minimum wage? Might be worth pointing this out to ceo if he is directly/indirectly telling you you should be working for less then the legal minimum by increasing your working hours. If so it might be worth going to hr to tell them they may need to cut overtime to avoid potential legal troubles.

This sounds like a terrible work environment.

I'm not naive, I know they exist in high pressure, work hard play hard earn big commission companies, but they destroy people.

Absolutely no place for someone with family commitments, it's more for people who want to earn as much as possible in short space of time before crashing out.

I left the last job that involved targets and bonuses 15 years ago after years in retail, sales and insurance.

I firmly believe any job with targets, commission and bonus has a dog eat dog atmosphere and greedy, materialistic bosses.

The CEO has commented that everyone should be doing extra hours (not just sales).

This is utter bullshit - if the job can’t be done in the contracted hours and “everyone should be doing extra”, then they’re understaffed. Want extra hours worked? Well advertise that, recruit to that, put it in the contract and adjust the pay accordingly.

“Driven” people driving themselves into the ground is not a good business model. This sort of attitude from CEOs/leadership teams is a red flag and, honestly, it would have me looking for another job.

How much are you getting paid OP , is it over higher rate threshold ?
I mean even if you were getting paid a fortune it's still a bad workplace, but a little more understandable.

So you are gifting back all of your annual leave and then some (7 working weeks) at 5hrs extra a week.

Those working 15 hrs extra a week are gifting back EVERY weekend day they get 'off'

You are doing the work of 1.15 people, your 50hr week collegues that of almost 1.5 people. So if the 2 people you work with worked their paid for hours - the ceo would need to pay 1 additional person, Just to keep up the workload. No wonder the CEO is demanding hours for free - it's saving him about 1/3 of the wage bill!

Sorry but I am one of the few that thinks YABU. It's no wonder the CEO thinks more highly of the others and would like everyone to be as "driven".

I think you are right to take it easier and avoid burnout. I can see that you'd be disappointed that the extra that you're doing isn't appreciated.

The real trick would be to deliver just as much with less hours. Like you say, that seems impossible.

I think if you have a relationship with the CEO you could say that you are unhappy with the unfavourable comparison and you'd appreciate the constructive feedback about how you can improve without expectation of significant overtime which is incompatible with your domestic commitments.

Either that or keep your head down and don't go above and beyond any more.

Thanks for all your comments. The irony is they claim to be a people centric business with a good work life balance on paper but the reality is different.

There's a lot of things about the job I like but just starting to feel like I'm fighting losing battle and will never be seen as driven/ worthy until I work like my 2 colleagues do. Think I'll have to look at options and maybe see what else is out there

I earn 50k. Other two colleagues earn over 65k as more senior.

It is absolutely fine for you to set yourself boundaries but it's also fine for those people to work as they choose. I'm not keen on your comments about them. And HR taking someone aside due to not eating breakfast, really?? You have to eat breakfast at work? I find your post really strange to be honest. I say just focus on you and let others focus on them.

People can work however they choose yes but should it be so encouraged when affecting peoples health? it's concerning when one colleague has admitted to me they have work related stress and anxiety and are in therapy. The other told me about the HR comment - its a bit odd but they do regularly tell me they forgot to have lunch/ breakfast etc so maybe there is wider concern about that.

The CEO should not be expecting anyone to be working extra hours. If people are finding it necessary to do so to get their work done then either they need extra training or there is not enough staff. Both indicate failings of management which ultimately are the fault of the CEO. He is encouraging a toxic workplace culture which will backfire when productivity plummets when staff end up on extended sick leave due to burnout.

I worked in financial services several years ago and this was exactly the culture. Commitment and performance was measured by number of hours spent in the office not by actual results. The directors actually stopped me from giving a promotion to one of my assistants because she regularly left on time. Despite the fact she worked her socks off in her contracted hours and got everything done to an extremely high standard. They even refused to let me leave work early when my Dad was dying. I had to wait until 5:30 by which time he had already passed away.

My current industry is so much healthier. We are specifically barred from holding meetings that go on past contracted hours and if anyone is still working at 5:30 their line managers tell them to go home.

My current employers are an internationally renowned organisation. The previous ones went bust. I think that speaks for itself.

Your CEO is a dinosaur. Don't be sucked into his toxic ideas. In your place I would be looking for a healthier workplace.

Wouldn’t do that for £50k. Did it for £90k for a few years but it’s no life and not sustainable.

I disagree. Her colleagues are allowing the CEO to run a toxic culture of excessive unpaid overtime and now that’s being expected of her.

When they go off sick which will inevitably happen OP will be dropped in the shit and be expected pick up the pieces and I don’t expect a £15k pay rise will be forthcoming.

@TheAquaMoose is absolutely right to challenge the culture and be concerned for her colleagues welfare. Compassion for colleagues is a must in a caring, nurturing and non toxic work environment