I have no boundaries, even to this extent. Why?

[greenbelthkusknf]

I have never had any boundaries. Sometimes I even feel afraid of myself as I am not sure what I will or won’t do. It’s like an out of body thing almost, I just don’t know who I am etc. I feel I constantly live in fear and when I’ve tried to asset boundaries I then feel very anxious, worried that someone will leave me or that I’ve upset someone etc. I can’t sleep for worrying. I obsess over it. Examples are wide ranging but include…

having sex when I’m not 100% comfortable

giving oral sex very regularly/daily because I feel if I don’t the person will go off me, even though I don’t always want to

meeting family when I don’t want to and would rather time to myself

being unable to asset myself if on a call with work and needing to leave to collect dc from nursery.. I mean where a call has overran and it’s perfectly fine to say it, I won’t, knowing that it’s going to cost me a fine when I get there late

apologising multiple times a day, in a shop if I brush past someone, I don’t even consider it could be them I just apologised immediately

if someone can’t make a date to meet I will bend over backwards to accommodate them by causing myself issues

the list goes on. I’m not a hugely nice person in the sense of drastically trying to be kind to people, it’s more than I am consumed by panic if I ever say no to what someone else wants from me. It comes from fear rather than wanting to be kind, I know that sounds bad but I am just being honest.

I have a v v professional job and have to assert myself on behalf of clients but I literally cannot do it for myself in any context. I feel like a fraud and also like I am letting my child down as I am not a good example.

I also can’t put my own needs first ever. It makes me cringe to ask for help or say what I want. Even at the hairdressers I decline the offer of a free head massage as I feel uncomfortable. Why am I like this?I am approaching forty and feel like such a mess. I wish I could understand it because I know intellectually and rationally that these are not healthy ways to behave.

I'm sorry OP.
I sympathise with some of what you say, though not to the same extent.
Can you transform some of those things into 'doing them for someone else '?
I.e. leaving work for nursery - you'd be being assertive for your DC.
As a starting point.

Following as I am like this too, do you ever feel as if you're kind of like a blank slate and could say or do anything to fit with whoever you're with? Counselling has helped me a bit to feel like it's OK to be me, I suppose, and to feel comfortable having boundaries with others.

My guess would be that it's quite likely the answer lies in your childhood OP. Could you explore this in counselling maybe.

It sounds like you have really low self esteem. Do you like yourself? Perhaps that’s a starting point.

Did you grow up in an abusive home, always walking on eggshells and doing everything possible not to cause upset?

I am the same. Chronic people pleaser and pushover ☹️

Following as you just described me exactly and I'm interested in the replies! I think it's a people pleasing thing, I hate other people to be put out or feel uncomfortable etc so I always put myself out but then it leaves me feeling invisible and irrelevant.

Emotionally abusive childhood?

I would recommend therapy.

That sounds quite difficult to live with (for you), it must be quite scary living with that level of uncertainty.

I think the first thing to do is to work out what your boundaries actually are, or even what you are happy to do / what you are not happy to do. Journalling is good for this. Could you buy a big nice notebook and write down different situations, and a list of things you are happy to do (where you would feel comfortable inside) and things you would not be happy to do (where you might do them, but would feel sad/uncomfortable). Just having an awareness of your own boundaries, even if you don't feel ready to change any behaviour yet, might help.

I sometimes order self help / counselling workbooks on Amazon, and work through them on my own. I find this very helpful (also cheaper and less of a big step than a counsellor). Could you find a well reviewed workbook on assertiveness from Amazon and commit to doing that as a first step?

I hope you get this sorted out as I feel sad for you. It sounds like you feel you are worth less than other people and that's simply not true.

Op I have said yabu purely because you're absolutely entitled to have your own needs met. But your feelings and the anxiety around that are normal and understandable.

I used to be very similar, I grew up in a household where the adults needs were more important than the child's needs and I was told off for expressing my needs.

The anxiety you have around this is stemming from somewhere. Whether it be childhood, bullying, a toxic relationship or something that has really affected your self esteem.

The only way through this is practice. I started small and tried to remind myself that "it's ok to say no as long as you're polite about it". That was my mantra I would tell myself before I answered anything. It gave me space to think about what I wanted before I answered and made me feel better about saying no. It felt uncomfortable and definitely gave me anxiety the first lot of times I said no and some people did get annoyed and pushed back. But I held my boundary and do you know what - they accepted it eventually because what I was doing was fair enough. I wasn't being unreasonable they just weren't used to hearing no from me. And now I'm so used to it, it's not a big deal before. My advice is go for counselling to build up your self esteem and work out where this started, then start small, saying no to little things. Like if you get an offer of a night out you could say - oh no I need a night to myself it's been a busy week but then suggest a time that does suit you maybe in a week or so if you do ultimately like the person. Similarly it can sometimes help to set advance boundaries- so if I have a meeting at 4pm and I know I need to leave at 5 sharp I'll email the chair or at the very beginning of the meeting I'll say "just a heads up folks I won't be able to stay past 5 today. Hopefully we'll be finished for then but just making you aware incase things run on." That way you've set yourself up to just remind them you have to go when 5 comes around and they know to expect that.

When you start small it's honestly like a snowball rolling down a hill, it builds momentum and gets bigger and you'll be doing it without thinking about it in no time. The key in the first instance is slowing down and taking a breath before you respond straight away.

I immediately thought emotionally abusive childhood. This was my experience and I relate to a lot of what you are describing. It's so difficult, a good first step is that you are aware of it and you can begin to implement small changes.
If it's possible for you and you feel that you had a difficult childhood I'd recommend looking into counselling.
When you grow up in abusive situations you learn that your feelings don't matter and there's severe consequences for not sticking to the rules or doing what others want. That could explain your feelings of panic at saying 'no' etc.

I sympathise as I’m similar but maybe not to the same extent - and I’ve got better over the years. Examples are - last night I was at someone’s house for a group I’m part of…I knew I needed to leave at a certain time but just stayed as everyone else was talking and I feared I’d look rude. I agree to things I don’t really want to do as worried I’ll upset people. It’s interesting what people say about tracing back to childhood - I wonder if it’s this as well

I can sympathise with you OP. I have some of the same issues as you. Therapy definitely helped. It stemmed back to childhood issues that I hadnt even realised had affected me and the therapist really helped me to work through them and assert myself. I had one therapist who was not helpful then I tried a Gestalt therapist who was fantastic.

I'd highly recommend it.

Thanks for replies. I’m trying to think about my childhood and what impact that may have had. I can’t think of anything specific, I was always told what to do and say etc and it was a very middle class environment where it was absolutely essential to my family that we kept up a good impression. That sticks in my mind and I remember not being able to relax much and often finding it strange at friend’s homes where they had more adult conversations and parents welcomed views etc. I remember a friend becoming vegetarian and telling my parents and they laughed and said it was ridiculous and if my friend came over she’d have to eat meat or nothing as she was still a child (we were 15). I remember thinking that was odd, I couldn’t work out why but I felt embarrassed they had said it even to me. I feel like a really fragile person and I hate it so much.

Similar story here. I attributed it to not having mine respected in my family and so had to learn as an adult how to set boundaries and how to identify and respect those of others.

It has gotten a lot easier the more I practice. I also encourage my children to do the same.

@greenbelthkusknf that’s interesting as I think I had a very similar upbringing. Parents were loving and definitely not abusive or anything, no pressure on me. However, I lived in a very middle class environment and got an assisted place at a private school, so stuck out amount rich friends. Also family members had mental health issues but it was all just kind of brushed under the rug and ignored in the wider family - remember constant family gatherings being embarrassed of my family, people pleasing and pretending nothing was wrong. Also a lot of worrying what people thought of me. Also raising my girls (hopefully) to not give a sh* 😂.

Some of this resonates with my own upbringing. People pleaser definitely, explains why I struggle not so much to make friends but maintaining the friendship. It wasn't easy growing up as my mother was definitely neurotic, very tense atmosphere in the home. Was like walking on eggshells most of the time.

I agree with PPs that you should get counselling and read some self-help books. I'd suggest the following:

Women Who Love Too Much (Robin Norwood)
The Six Pillars of Self Esteem (Nathaniel Branden)
Attached (Levine and Heller)

I'm sorry OP, that sounds like a very stressful way to live 😔 if I were you, I'd speak to your GP and ask about a referral for counselling. Hopefully that will help you get to the bottom of it and help you make some changes in your life.