UC utter bafflement

[ComeAlongPeggy]

I am supporting a local parent who claims UC. I have tried to answer her questions via the CAB and online and have drawn a blank so I’m asking here in case lots of you know the answer (they can’t be uncommon questions!).

She gets £1400 pm UC. She can work, but not ft because she is also a ft carer. But in month when she has worked and earned c£300, she has received the same amount of UC but has also been contacted by her local council for council tax payments (she previously had 100% of her council tax covered).

What she would like to know is how much she can earn each month without UC being reduced and without her council tax benefit being reduced.

To be absolutely clear, she’s not lazy and she works (unpaid) harder than I do in my 40 hour a week job. But every penny counts and because some weeks she can work more hours than others, her income is very “lumpy” (this is dependent on her caring responsibilities - eg during school holidays she can’t work at all, her child would not be able to access holiday clubs etc and a babysitter would cost as much as she would earn). Any paid work she does is very much like someone with a ft demanding job taking on an extra evening/weekend job so it really has to be worth her while financially as it puts her under quite significant physical and emotional strain to do any paid work at all. She would love nothing more than to be working ft and not claim UC but this won’t be possible for a few years at least.

If you’ve read this far, thank you! Any help to navigate this would be amazing. I have tried to speak to UC but they don’t seem to have clear cut off’s as to how much you can earn etc.

There’s no specific amount which will reduce her income or council tax benefit. It’s different for everyone and their individual circumstances.

Im not 100% confident in working it out or I would offer! There is a great group on FB called “Universal Credit and Legacy Benefit Advice” (picture is of a road type sign). The admins and moderators are really great and helpful. I’m sure they’d be more than happy to help you out!

Thank you @starlight889 she migrated from tax credits and says the rules were much easier with that system

I’d be careful if Uc get wind of the unpaid work they will use it against you. The only reason they have a work allowance on universal credit is so they can use it against you on the next assessment.

If she has children she'll have a work allowance. The WA is £379 pm if you get housing element and £631 if no housing element. You can earn the equivalent of the working allowance without UC being affected. Council Tax Reduction rules are separate to UC. Everyone is better off if they work on UC due to the 55% taper.

By "unpaid work", I assumed OP meant the person is an unpaid carer, not that they go out and do unpaid voluntary work that someone else might be paid for.

Yup And when you go to your next assessment they will use the fact you are able to work part time against you. It happened to me my claim was removed. You have to be be careful not to do a job that contradicts in anyway what your claim says. If for example you are off with anxiety and you get a job in supermarket they will say as the position you held showed your anxiety doesn’t have a profound effect on your wellbeing you are able to work full time. It’s sneaky but it’s what they do

Each Local Council is different - in mine everyone of working age has 25% of their Council Tax Support removed so pay something even those on benefits. The only exception is pensioners receiving Pension Credit.

This year they have decided that if you receive UC and any earnings above £O, even £1, you will have 40% of any CTS removed. They have also decided not to show their calculations when the 40% rate kicks in.

The Council needed to bring in Consultants to come up with this system, having read the Consultant's Report they could have just come up with this themselves. Either way it's pretty shocking.

If you are a f/t Carer and receive Carers Allowance, Carers Allowance is deducted £ for £ from UC, leaving a much smaller WA for 'tapered' earnings.

@ComeAlongPeggy if you want to PM me her location, I can work it out for you. Without her location it's impossible to say. You could use EntitledTo, as an alternative, and plug numbers in trial and error fashion.

Your posts are irrelevant to the OP. The person in the OP does not have LCW/LCWRA. They are a carer, therefore will not have any work commitments and will not be reassessed as long as she remains a carer for someone in receipt of one of the relevant benefits. Completely different situation.

In my area, income is assessed in bands, so there can be a cliff-edge drop in council tax reduction if 25% if income increases by just one penny from one band to another.

@Despair132 the unpaid work is her unpaid work as a mother and carer to her child. Not work for anyone outside her immediate family.

@Rosieposy89 thank you - this is exactly what I needed to understand!

@TheHateIsNotGood ah…. She gets carers allowance and her child hers higher rate DLA

@Lougle thank you so much. I think spending a bit of time on entitled to might be the best bet!

Thanks everyone. It’s the council tax support suddenly falling away that’s causing her the most concern. It’s so tough because she wants to work as much as she can but fees quite trapped by the restrictions because she can’t afford to lose any element of her UC at the moment. Once her child is older/more stable she will be able to ditch the whole benefits system and go back to ft work but it’s a drudge at the moment. I’m learning a lot as I support her! Eye opening.

@ComeAlongPeggy is she getting Carers Allowance? There is an earnings limit on that, as well as it being deducted in full from UC. However, she can also get a carers element on UC, which isn't earnings limited.

Since she is getting Carer's Allowance, she cannot earn more than £139/wk.

Council tax regulations vary slightly between local authorities, so no-one can give you a definitive answer without knowing her council.

@Lougle she gets carers allowance, higher rate DLA for one child and child benefit. Plus UC.

@Hont1986 ok, thank you. I’m going to spend some time on entitled to this afternoon with her

She won’t lose any element of her UC. Carer’s allowance will stop if she earns over £139 after deductions, but UC’s carer element and severely disabled child element will continue.

If she earns more than her work allowance (£379 if she has a housing element on the claim/£631 if no housing element) there will be an earnings deduction of 55p in every pound over the work allowance. So, she won’t end up with a lower UC award by working.

Council tax support is specific to each council and the amounts aren’t easily accessible to view.

Is she claiming carers ELEMENT? that's different to carers allowance. Also the disability element for receiving dla for her child. ?

If she isn't earning more than £139 per week (because she's not allowed to and keep carers allowance), then she definitely below the work allowance of UC, but it will depend on her local council's scheme as to the Council Tax Reduction. In my area she would get 100% reduction.

Make sure she's actually got the carers element of UC as well as the carers allowance (which is the separate benefit).

The £139 per week for carer’s allowance is after tax, NI and some expenses such as 50% of pension contributions and some travel costs, some business costs, some childcare costs.

If she isn't earning more than £139 per week… then she definitely below the work allowance of UC

Not necessarily for those with a housing element on their UC claim.