To think 4 weeks summer is ok

[comeonlabour]

So as the title suggests, if the plans do go ahead to make summer hols 4 weeks I for one am not against it. I always think 6 weeks is way too long so 4 is more manageable

Also we will have longer half terms of 2 weeks in some cases instead of 1 so all good

Anyone else feel the same/agree with me

amp.theguardian.com/society/2024/feb/02/almost-three-in-10-secondary-pupils-in-uk-avoiding-school-because-of-anxiety

www.thedeveloper.live/opinion/opinion/why-do-uk-teens-have-among-the-lowest-life-satisfaction-in-the-oecd

We already have really unhappy teens. This would make it worse.
They need a good break to reset.

I do think that is the most important thing - what’s best for children.

Im not really sure on the answer to that, which is why I said if there are studies that show it helps disadvantaged children then I’d be for it. My own children would probably be the same either way tbh.

Some of my colleagues definitely would prefer shorter terms so I definitely don’t speak for all! Personally, I like the long break with the kids. In the half terms I usually work a couple of days so it doesn’t feel like much of a break by the time I’ve done the cleaning on top of that!

Autumn term starting mid August or summer term ending in the first week of August. Cannot imagine the latter would go down well, though the first is what happens in Scotland.

Many more parents would take children out of school for holidays.

This thread comes up every year.
We don't need to meddle with term dates
We need :

1. decent cheap holiday club provision.
2. A reduction in travel costs for those going away.
3. Free meals over the holidays for low income families.

Children and teachers need a break.
Schools need a decent time closed for essential repairs to ageing buildings.

Changing the holidays has been discussed ever since I’ve been a teacher (into 3 decades) and there’s been no change yet. Some people want more at February so they can go skiing, others want more in October to go and seek some autumn sun. Lots want more at May half term but that will never happen with the external exams. You can’t have secondaries and primaries having different holidays because then parents wouldn’t have enough holiday to be able to spend time with them all. People in workplaces who have to compete for time off would struggle to get any in August, and if they had children doing external exams, would get a week or two of August rules out already. This would be even a nightmare for teachers who taught gcse and A level classes.

We already have about the shortest summer holidays in the world and are facing a huge teacher retention crisis-this would be a disaster in Engand. I’m not sure how well it’s being received in Wales.

I presume private schools (who already have longer holidays and no attendance fines allowing them to go on holidays whenever they want) wouldn’t be dropping down to 4 weeks off in the summer, so if this is just for the ‘state school kids’ it would increase inequality between the haves and the have nots, even more!

I loved the six week holiday. My eldest two are teenagers now so independent but loved it when they were younger.
I hope it doesn't change. DS is starting school in September and I'd like to spend long, summer holidays with him. Four weeks isn't enough.
And the teachers always look exhausted by the end of the year I'm sure they'd like a nice break too

We don’t need to reduce holiday costs, we need to reduce costs of staycations.

I basically said this. I love teaching. I find teaching rewarding. That's the bit in the classroom. The rest of it, less so. The bits I find stressful and anxiety inducing are made better by the long holidays. If I didn't have the holiday, I don't think I personally could mentally cope with it. I don't know why this is such an issue for you but I am genuinely glad that there are rewarding jobs elsewhere that other people love. When my children are older, I might leave and do one of them 🤣

I absolutely hate the rhetoric that teachers should be doing the job for the love of the children and don't deserve to be paid well, to work the hours they're paid for or be treated with respect.

See also, every advert for teacher training - nothing about pay or holidays, just trying to persuade people to do the job for idealistic reasons. That's why they can't keep people on the profession - thry enter thinking they're going to be making a difference and get bogged down by the workload, behaviour, lack of SEN support etc and leave.

The long holidays (most of which are contractually unpaid) are reflected in the comparatively low salary compared to other professions requiring a similar level of education and training. Unfortunately the holidays are already not tempting enough people into the profession. Mess with them and it will be even harder to recruit.

No even as a full time working parent.i loved the longer summer holidays. The relaxed longer break was really nice and as only a certain % of staff could be off each week it meant I had a chance of getting some time off during that period .

No thanks - we can literally only afford a holiday now because where we live we break up earlier than everyone else and that week or so is a bit cheaper - would be an absolute nightmare to condense everyone trying to go away in just a 4 week block!
2 weeks at Feb half term would be shit - it always bloody rains!

Unfortunately the holidays are already not tempting enough people into the profession. Mess with them and it will be even harder to recruit.

This x 100.

Though Gillian Keegan seems not to give a shit and wants anyone with 2 GCSEs to be a teacher (on minimum wage) whilst they train. What could go wrong?

Though, much as it pains me, on this one as it’s just Wales proposing it can’t really blame Gillian Keegan with education being a devolved matter.

To be honest I think it would be better for children to have longer school days and much longer holidays, so shorter terms. Condense it basically, so that the vast majority of their life isn't focused on school. Whole days of freedom are more valuable than an extra free hour or two after school each day, where school will already have taken up the vast majority of their mental and physical energy. And in winter those after school hours are in the dark so useless for any outdoor activity. Longer school days would also be better for most working parents, and it would probably be cheaper to swap after school childcare for whole day activities in the school holidays.

I also think that the current "parental leave" policy should be scrapped because most people simply cannot afford to take this unpaid leave. It should be replaced by a more generous 2 weeks per year of extra paid leave at the rate of the person's actual salary/ earnings (so that everyone can afford to use it) for the years of primary school, funded by the Government. This would allow much more parental time with children (also important therefore to double the allowance to 4 weeks for single parents) and have huge benefits in terms of child mental health, adult mental health, raising secure and well-balanced children and children feeling rested and restored ready to go back to school and study, less stressed and more focused. And developmentally we know beyond doubt that children benefit enormously from significant time that is undirected. It's so unhealthy to put them on a treadmill of daily demands at such a young age and crushes their imaginations and creativity.

We need to focus our Government policy more on wellbeing and quality of life given that's the entire point of having an economy in the first place. Currently, because they do not have a vote, funding for anything related to children is even more woeful than everything else: education (right from early years through to university), children's services, CAMHS, means testing even of child benefit/ childcare funding which is an abomination. We need to unashamedly say "yes, children are the most vulnerable members of our society and the future of it, and it benefits us all to fund this, even those who do not have children."

Looking back to childhood many people's fondest memories will be of their summer holidays. It should be a priority and the idea it should be curtailed rather than looking at policies to extend it/ increase the quality of it as family time are bizarre to me and very short-sighted.

3 months in Ireland at secondary, June, July and August

Would teachers also get this extra two weeks of leave? If so, how would that work?

Yes, all parents should have it. Teachers say their holiday time is unpaid (i.e. they are only contracted 39 weeks per year rather than 52 with paid holidays like most employees: I've not checked a teacher contract to verify this but this is my understanding) so two of their 13 weeks where they have unpaid leave would then be paid each year, at their weekly rate of pay. Not sure I see the issue?

One of the UK's big problems is an unwillingness to invest in anything that doesn't have immediate payoffs. Time and money invested into children, quality child: parent time, high standards of education pays off many times over in terms of future productivity. This mentality also pervades healthcare here (far less focus on preventative care/ early intervention and diagnosis which is cheaper and more effective) than in comparable countries. And infrastructure (let it crumble into disrepair rather than forecast what will be required in 20 years and build that as these are long-term projects). Same for energy capacity. Same for the pensions ponzi scheme. Until some long-term thinking is applied and people understand that it costs far more to firefight totally foreseeable issues once you've let them escalate into a forest fire than it would do to buy a fire extinguiser and have that next to your campfire, the UK will continue to waste enormous amounts of money on very poor outcomes per pound spent.

Well, teachers can only take time off when the schools are closed. Would the paid leave have to be used during the normal summer holiday? If so, it’s not really helpful for teachers in terms of being “parental leave” for things like in-service days or when their children are sick.

I personally would rather they invested money in public services - in my area, everything is closing. The council run gym is only open during office hours, the swimming pool only has lane swimming and it’s almost exclusively booked for lessons, youth clubs are closing due to a lack of funding, swing parks are barely maintained, and so on.
I would much rather these services be available than reducing costs of foreign travel.

Even government funding/subsidised child entry to local attractions would be far
more widely beneficial to people who are struggling financially (and wider society)than reducing costs of foreign travel: something only available to the comparatively wealthy. Plus; it would encourage people to stay in the UK and spend in the UK rather than us losing revenue to overseas destinations.

If anything;foreign travel should be more expensive.

Well, teachers can only take time off when the schools are closed. Would the paid leave have to be used during the normal summer holiday? If so, it’s not really helpful for teachers in terms of being “parental leave” for things like in-service days or when their children are sick.

Nobody can use the existing (unpaid so hardly anybody can use it ever, but anyway...) parental leave for that, either. It has to be taken in blocks of one week minimum and has to be pre-agreed by the employer in advance. It therefore is not emergency leave/ covering sick days.

Teachers already have a lot of time off so do not have the issue that most parents have of not having enough quality time with their children, but I'm sure they would be grateful to have some of the school holidays as paid leave if the parental leave policy was changed in the way I suggested.

Teachers already have a lot of time off so do not have the issue that most parents have of not having enough quality time with their children

One of the many reasons that teachers I know have left is the inflexibility of the job in term time. There is no scope to take a day off to watch your child’s school assembly or school play or come to Sports Day or Open Days. I wasn’t able to attend a single show/play/assembly for my youngest-she doesn’t seem to remember, but I hated not being there every single time. Yes, there is more holiday than other people, but the profession is haemorrhaging teachers, so that isn’t enough to make people join/stay.