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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To ask an instructor to ban another child from the combat class?

42 replies

Ahbegyuhpardun · 03/02/2024 13:32

Ok so I haven't actually done this! and I feel really guilty about the thought of doing it, but it's the only solution I see working for us.

My just turned five-year-old has been in a judo club since September, he really enjoys it and it's really good exercise. The instructor is generally very nice but there's one little boy in the class who constantly targets my son aggressively. He's two years older than mine, but the same size so they're often paired together.
He really inappropriately hits and stamps on him (usually in the neck and groin) but only when he thinks no one is looking.
My son doesn't cry about it, he either ignores it or tells him not to do it but in a kind of high pitched anxious way, that to someone who hadn't seen what had happened leading up to it, would make my son look like he was winding this boy up.

He's never been bruised or anything like that. We didn't mention anything when it first happened because we thought it would pan out and my Father was was coming with me and didn't want me to make a fuss (I don't think he believed me and thought I was being over protective) even though my Mother's Instinct told me I should, and I now regret not saying.
2 weeks ago it happened again and the other boy threw my son on the floor (which is natural for judo) but then proceeded to stand on his groin and his neck. The instructor never sees, so I had to actually go out on the mat and intervene (after he ignored me telling over to him and making eye contact with him telling him to stop).

The instructor then told me that he's had to talk to the boy's father before because he has had issues with other children, where he tries to hurt them constantly. For the rest of the class he then tried to target my son and make sure he couldn't take part in any of the tag games and would just hover by him so no one could release him from tag and was just generally not very nice to the point where some of the the older children again started to push him about, because all they could see that he was not being very nice. It's such a strange thing though, because he will sit there and smile and shimmy next to my son with a big smile on his face as if they're friends, and when my son puts his arm around him or goes to give a high five or something in return, he punches him in the neck. My son has only just turned five so he's been four through all this and has no idea that it's not appropriate because he does it with a smile on his face and my son genuinely thinks that they are friends.
After the last session I explained he wasn't his friend because friends don't do that, and that actually upset my son more than the violent behaviour itself. I just don't want him to think that it's appropriate and I also worry that he is actually going to get hurt in one of the sessions by this boy, so it's been building gradually for a while (some sessions have been OK hence it hasn't been addressed sooner).

It's got the point now where I'm not comfortable with him being in a class with the other little boy anymore, because my son genuinely doesn't understand that he's not his friend and this little boy will just target him every single class, so we can't keep them separate.

The instructor has had to speak to the father about it before, for another child so this obviously isn't an isolated incident I feel like the only way we can keep going to the class is if he was removed, but I feel absolutely terrible suggesting that. We do like the class and the location is great, and I feel like if we were to find another club it's only a matter of time until he gets banned anyway and then moves on to the next place.

The father never sits and watches the lessons, he will go to the coffee shop that's joined on to the never sees anything happening although he has spoken to my father on the sideline before and apparently he split up from his partner and just takes him on the days that he has him. So I'm also a little bit concerned about why he's behaving that way and why is he targeting the groin and neck... is that happening to him at home? So ultimately I feel really sorry for this little boy, but I can't have him doing that to my son all the time.

We haven't been for 2 weeks now, and they posted a picture on Facebook this week without the little boy in it, saying 'classes open as usual' so I don't know whether he was just off that session or has left. And whether it's coincidence that they've posted a pic leaving him out (I said we'd be back after the last incident but then decided against it).

I know I should have mentioned it sooner, and for now we've just pulled him out of the class. But I was debating suggesting that if this boy carries on the way he is and ends up being removed from the class, then we would probably go back?

OP posts:
Neriah · 03/02/2024 17:28

I no longer practice, but this resonated with me. Now disabled, unfortunately but practiced for over 40 years. The sensei needs to be paying attention, correcting this behaviour; and if there is no change the other child must be removed from the class - such behaviour is against all the principles of Judo. For a senei it isn't only a safeguarding issue - it is one of the fundamental priciples of judo to do "least harm" - courtesy, respect for others, and self-discipline are core to each judoka. If sensei cannot manage this, then they are not very good teachers.

But it did remind me about a lad who came to our dojo when I was about 12. In those days there were almost no women and girls in British judo - there were two girls in the junior section; and later as an adult, just me. I cannot recall his name now, but he was 14 or 15 and build like a brick shit house! Compared to everyone in the class he was huge, and got great pleasure - like your son's assailant - in "accidentally" dropping people from a height, falling on them and generally hurting them. Our senseis had warned him multiple times and did watch carefully - they worked to try to corrrect his actions by intervening, by time out etc.

One day during randori he dropped Dorothy from a huge height, and dropped on her, really hurting her. And I have no idea what came over me, but I was pissed! So as we selected next partners I made a beeline for him. And pasted him from one end of the mat to the other, and back again. I deliberately dropped him multiple times, accidentally kneed him in a few places - you get the idea. As soon as the senseis saw what was going on, they ought to have stopped us. They didn't. They withdrew from the mat, and pulled everyone else off, and left us to it. He left the mat crying, and never came back. And I learned that in judo it really is a case of the bigger they come the harder they fall.

If sensei will not control this, find a better dojo. There are plenty around now, and it would be terrible for your son to end his practice because of the irresponsible management of one dojo.

penjil · 03/02/2024 17:42

Stamping on people is not part of judo, and not really part of anything other than a purposeful act of hate.

It's not even accidental, it's a definite violent act that is being repeated.

If this other child is there in the dojo again, tell the instructor that your child is NOT to be paired up with him again, ever.

There are safeguarding issues here.

If he stamps on your son's groin in the wrong place, it could be bad news for him in later life.

Also report the unsafe acts to the leisure centre or place than runs the judo class.

SinnerBoy · 03/02/2024 17:50

PinkyBlueMe · Today 16:25

I agree, most schools will ban violent ones. My daughter used to do kickboxing karate and in her year there, two boys were banned. One had beaten another boy up in the park and his mam told the instructor, who told him to leave and never come back.

He then explained to the class what had happened and not to do the same.

This guy is a wet lettuce.

SingleMum11 · 03/02/2024 17:51

Bloody hell, stamps him in the neck or groin?

Take him out of that class right away! Your son will not have the skills to stop this, he needs the adults to step in. I’d also tell the instructor but no way would I let my child go to another class again. Find some other class or place.

Iwasafool · 03/02/2024 17:52

I took my kids to judo for years and no way should the sensei be standing for this. As Neriah said this is just not how judo works and it was always emphasised at my kids classes that you did not use judo to hurt people, you did not show off in the playground using judo, you would always be responsible.

Personally I would not have much confidence in a sensei who couldn't control his class.

SleepingStandingUp · 03/02/2024 18:16

Istopped reading after "son goes to high five him and he thumps him on the neck". You're also saying he stands on your son's neck and groin. And you're doing nothing because your Dad didn't want to make a fuss

Start protecting your son. Either call it out every single time to the instructor and say you don't want them partnered together or if they won't protect him, move clubs because that's shit safeguarding of your child.

Noseybookworm · 03/02/2024 18:31

It's the instructor's responsibility to keep control of the class and make sure this doesn't happen. You need to speak to the instructor and tell him to keep this child away from your little boy. I'd be watching like a hawk and intervening if I saw this child near him.

Luckydog7 · 03/02/2024 18:33

Blimey @Neriah

Will you adopt me!? I'm 37 but still... You sound awesome!

HoneyButterPopcorn · 03/02/2024 18:41

The instructor needs to clamp down on this. A chunk of martial arts is learning how to manage aggression and to be in control.

At DSs kick boxing class there was a boy who just went wild each lesson - running around, doing ‘power ranger’ kicks (yellling ‘hiiii-yaaaaa take that!!!’ at other kids and adults, refusing to listen, or to sit down (unless his dad growled at him from the side), and not learning anything.

Sensei was very calm and patient but in the end asked his Dad to not bring him back until he was older/would take instruction as he was just kicking/punching the other kids like crazy. The other parents were getting fed up of the whole lesson being taken up with one kid - and they really tried to call him down, even taking him aside for 1-2-1 coaching.

some kids just aren’t interested.

mushypeasontoast · 03/02/2024 19:15

I think you are being unreasonable here. I've been taking my dc to judo for 19 years from when my oldest was 5. I think over the years I've seen everything and been that parent at times, but I have a really good relationship with the coach and always gave him the chance to resolve issues.

My dc now help with coaching, will be getting their coaching qualification in the next couple of years and are aware of the little shits delightful souls that don't follow the rules. In our club, the bully would be escorted to the corner of the mats for time out and then given a number of burpies to remind them. The older students would keep a very close eye on them and be ready to step in quickly if needed.

If your dc enjoys judo, then you either need to speak to your coach about your concerns, or find another club (some are better than others). These dc are very young, too young to compete, should be 8, (unless the rules have changed recently), when the other boy starts competing he will need to following the rules or be disqualified. They either wise up at that age or quit.

Judo is a disciplined sport, rather than combat and requires resilience and discipline as well as fitness etc.
Our coach would say work on your skills and throw him harder. He would also keep them apart for a while.

VanilleA · 03/02/2024 19:21

He has spoken to my father on the sideline before and apparently he split up from his partner and just takes him on the days that he has him. So I'm also a little bit concerned about why he's behaving that way and why is he targeting the groin and neck... is that happening to him at home? So ultimately I feel really sorry for this little boy, but?

Just because he has seperated parents doesn't meant one of them is kicking him in the groin and neck. Extrapolation much.

Just go the alternate weeks when the kid isn't there for a bit?

Atethehalloweenchocs · 03/02/2024 20:14

Talk to the teacher and explain what you have explained here. Ask the teacher what he suggests?

Ahbegyuhpardun · 03/02/2024 20:54

SleepingStandingUp · 03/02/2024 18:16

Istopped reading after "son goes to high five him and he thumps him on the neck". You're also saying he stands on your son's neck and groin. And you're doing nothing because your Dad didn't want to make a fuss

Start protecting your son. Either call it out every single time to the instructor and say you don't want them partnered together or if they won't protect him, move clubs because that's shit safeguarding of your child.

You're right I'm so frustrated at not saying the first time. I went to jumpnuo and shout and my Father stopped me and took me away saying I was stopping my son from concentrating (he's a black belt in judo so was keen for him to pay attention). But since he's taken him on his own and seen it for himself he agrees now. I'm cross at both of us for not immediately saying something.

OP posts:
Ahbegyuhpardun · 03/02/2024 20:55

VanilleA · 03/02/2024 19:21

He has spoken to my father on the sideline before and apparently he split up from his partner and just takes him on the days that he has him. So I'm also a little bit concerned about why he's behaving that way and why is he targeting the groin and neck... is that happening to him at home? So ultimately I feel really sorry for this little boy, but?

Just because he has seperated parents doesn't meant one of them is kicking him in the groin and neck. Extrapolation much.

Just go the alternate weeks when the kid isn't there for a bit?

Yes sorry. I didn't mean to imply that. It's more me trying to empathise as to why he might be acting out, rather than just label him a 'problem'.

OP posts:
Ahbegyuhpardun · 03/02/2024 21:01

Neriah · 03/02/2024 17:28

I no longer practice, but this resonated with me. Now disabled, unfortunately but practiced for over 40 years. The sensei needs to be paying attention, correcting this behaviour; and if there is no change the other child must be removed from the class - such behaviour is against all the principles of Judo. For a senei it isn't only a safeguarding issue - it is one of the fundamental priciples of judo to do "least harm" - courtesy, respect for others, and self-discipline are core to each judoka. If sensei cannot manage this, then they are not very good teachers.

But it did remind me about a lad who came to our dojo when I was about 12. In those days there were almost no women and girls in British judo - there were two girls in the junior section; and later as an adult, just me. I cannot recall his name now, but he was 14 or 15 and build like a brick shit house! Compared to everyone in the class he was huge, and got great pleasure - like your son's assailant - in "accidentally" dropping people from a height, falling on them and generally hurting them. Our senseis had warned him multiple times and did watch carefully - they worked to try to corrrect his actions by intervening, by time out etc.

One day during randori he dropped Dorothy from a huge height, and dropped on her, really hurting her. And I have no idea what came over me, but I was pissed! So as we selected next partners I made a beeline for him. And pasted him from one end of the mat to the other, and back again. I deliberately dropped him multiple times, accidentally kneed him in a few places - you get the idea. As soon as the senseis saw what was going on, they ought to have stopped us. They didn't. They withdrew from the mat, and pulled everyone else off, and left us to it. He left the mat crying, and never came back. And I learned that in judo it really is a case of the bigger they come the harder they fall.

If sensei will not control this, find a better dojo. There are plenty around now, and it would be terrible for your son to end his practice because of the irresponsible management of one dojo.

Thanks for commenting!
It is interesting seeing the older kids try to be firm with him and tell him it's not OK. I've seen him be thrown/pinned down by 3 different older kids (2 of whom were girls, who are technically so much better than the boys) not in a nasty way but a firm... Stop it way. And unfortunately it's just seemed to wind him up more and then he's taken it out on my son as one of the newest/youngest.
My Dad is black belt in judo, although no longer practices and it was meant to be something for him to take my son to. And we're thinking of trying a different club. I just worry he'll follow us there after being eventually kicked out of this one as I can't see him being able to be kept on.

OP posts:
VanilleA · 03/02/2024 21:01

Ahbegyuhpardun · 03/02/2024 20:55

Yes sorry. I didn't mean to imply that. It's more me trying to empathise as to why he might be acting out, rather than just label him a 'problem'.

I get it but I think you need to be on your son's side and having separated parents isn't a cause of such violent behaviour.

wallywotwot · 04/02/2024 19:53

I thought martial arts were all about channeling & disciplining your energy so you can get it out without causing harm?
If the coach isn't able to teach this then they aren't in control and it's not a place that would be safe for your child.
It's worth having words about the bullying your son is having to endure and if you don't get a satisfactory response then you need to find a coach who is more capable and professional.

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