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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Would giving all children free school meals actually safe the public purse money long term?

342 replies

Kendodd · 02/02/2024 09:42

Really good quality, highly nutritional, tailored to children's needs and vegetarian. I know this would cost a lot, but if it improves the nations health long term, would it actually cost less?

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Wasbedeudetetdas · 02/02/2024 10:35

Needmorelego · 02/02/2024 10:34

@Wasbedeudetetdas no offence but your wording was a bit rubbish 🙂

I'll raise you 'no offence, but your reading for understanding skills were a bit rubbish'.
Rightio, can we please leave it there, have a pleasant day (meant genuinely)?

notknowledgeable · 02/02/2024 10:35

Wasbedeudetetdas · 02/02/2024 10:32

You haven't really thought this through, have you?

Yes I have, I have watched the school catering situation with despair for many decades. Parents are paying over the odds for rubbish. The value of the food on the plate is a fraction of what is paid for it - and half goes in the bin anyway. The fact that tax payers money is also being poured down this particular drain is also depressing. it is also of very poor nutritional standard, even when it is eaten.

tiggergoesbounce · 02/02/2024 10:36

Bargello · 02/02/2024 10:27

Nobody is saying that it's OK for school lunches to be rubbish because it's only a minority of what kids eat. Of course school lunches should be healthy and tasty.

But school lunches on their own are not going to be enough to address poor eating if a child is having a healthy lunch at school but going home and eating pot noodles, sausage rolls and doughnuts at evenings, weekends and school holidays.

But you asked why it is the schools responsibility to do that. Well its because as a basic minimum, a healthy meal should be standard. Just because "Dave" (sorry any Dave's) gets fed crap at home doesn't mean the school lower themselves to that standard, they should be raising the bar. It will not fix the obesity crisis, it will not fix the trauma some kids go through who are being neglected. But it will give a healthy meal to a kid, it will show a kid once a day, thats what a vegtable is and staff help to encourage them eating it when they are little.

I do agree with you in that it shouldn't be free for all, but i do think it needs to be a realistic bar for paying. I have no problems paying when we need to

Needmorelego · 02/02/2024 10:37

@Wasbedeudetetdas ok 🙂
You have a good day too 🌞

Wasbedeudetetdas · 02/02/2024 10:37

notknowledgeable · 02/02/2024 10:35

Yes I have, I have watched the school catering situation with despair for many decades. Parents are paying over the odds for rubbish. The value of the food on the plate is a fraction of what is paid for it - and half goes in the bin anyway. The fact that tax payers money is also being poured down this particular drain is also depressing. it is also of very poor nutritional standard, even when it is eaten.

So how do you suggest the food (which you think the money should go on) will become available to the pupils, without the catering staff (which you think the money shouldn't go on)?

notknowledgeable · 02/02/2024 10:38

Wasbedeudetetdas · 02/02/2024 10:37

So how do you suggest the food (which you think the money should go on) will become available to the pupils, without the catering staff (which you think the money shouldn't go on)?

Like I said, increasing child benefit for people who need it

graceinspace999 · 02/02/2024 10:38

notknowledgeable · 02/02/2024 10:32

don't employ them to start with, this is not what free school meal money is for! It is supposed to be for food. It doesn't go on food.

It does go in food - just not on the type of food everyone on this thread wants.

As for ‘ don’t employ them to start with’

That doesn’t make sense - food doesn’t make and serve itself.

I suppose we could do away with lots of jobs but then we’d be moaning about people on benefits.

I hope nobody with your attitude decides your work is a waste of money.

TheNameIsDickDarlington · 02/02/2024 10:39

I assumed the "vegetarian" thing was about choice not that ALL meals had to be vegetarian. Just an option for both.

Wasbedeudetetdas · 02/02/2024 10:40

notknowledgeable · 02/02/2024 10:38

Like I said, increasing child benefit for people who need it

So you are suggesting completely doing away with all school meal provision?
Essentially this will mean parents providing packed lunches for younger kids and older ones going to local shops? How is that going to help ensure that neglected children actually get a meal (because we all know that some parents are bad parents, for a whole host of reasons, and that is not the child's fault), or that older children are making remotely healthy choices?

Wasbedeudetetdas · 02/02/2024 10:42

TheNameIsDickDarlington · 02/02/2024 10:39

I assumed the "vegetarian" thing was about choice not that ALL meals had to be vegetarian. Just an option for both.

The use of 'and vegetarian' at the end of the sentence suggests a blanket vegetarian offering. It would really need to say 'and a vegetarian option' to make it clear that there wasn't just vegetarian meals being offered?
@Kendodd do you mean a veggie option or only veggie? Please let us know!

BoohooWoohoo · 02/02/2024 10:42

Do they still do the free fruit at break scheme ? My kids have left school/upper secondary so I suspect they may have defunded this but my kids tried some new fruits when they saw their friends enjoying it.

CheshireCat1 · 02/02/2024 10:43

Sadly for some children it’s the only hot meal that they get.

Kendodd · 02/02/2024 10:46

Vegetarian because, its vegetables, its probably cheaper (than good quality meat) better for the planet and covers more religious requirements. Meals would need to be good quality with no UPF. Only water and milk on offer to drink.

I know you can't force kids to eat well (or parents to feed them well) but this way all children would have access to good healthy food. It might also go some way to changing the culture. The food we feed our kids in school is every bit as important as the education they receive there.

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user1497207191 · 02/02/2024 10:46

Regardless of cost or nutrition, I'd love to see free school meals for all children simply due to the socialisation aspect of eating together. I feel more and more sad about the "fragmentation" of younger people eating separately, some in dining halls, some in specially designated areas for "packed lunches" and some just eating in random places, i.e. the playing fields, form rooms, library, random corners and benches, etc. I think it causes problems with socialisation, loneliness, and even bullying etc.

I can't remember why exactly, but I took packed lunches to secondary school, so ended up lonely at lunchtimes because my friends went to the dining hall for school meals. I remember asking my parents to have school meals, but it was a "no" from them, and I can't remember why. It led to me being awkward and embarrassed when eating formally with others once I left school, i.e. works christmas meals, "dates", etc.

My son has ended up the same. He got into the habit of packed lunches at primary school because he was a "fussy" eater and, to my shame, we facilitated it by giving him the choice. I wish we hadn't. He did the same at secondary school, despite them having a "canteen" style with plenty of food options, he just wanted his packed lunch and ended up eating it in random places, so he, too, missed out on "communal" eating and he was the same at Uni, always getting a sandwich or sausage roll from a shop rather than using the dining halls that the other students used, and he ended up lonely and friendless at Uni!

As for nutrition, I really wouldn't "push" vegetarian only options nor ultra healthy unprocessed foods. I think there's a middle ground of giving options, including unhealthy options to a degree, but I'd draw the line at foods/drinks which contain "dangerous" levels of salt, sugars, etc., i.e. just serve food/drinks with green or amber warning signs, and not red warnings. Give a choice - I think mandating healthy or vegetarian options is a step too far.

Rewis · 02/02/2024 10:48

In my home country everyone gets free school meals. Salad, bread, protein and sides on every meal. Obviously kids complain about school food but once you get older you really appreciate it. From my POV I don't see how children and teenagers survive with the packed lunches I've seen. I wish instill could get the uni student discount and get nutritious full lunch for 2.60€.

When googling free school lunch benefits, there are studies that show how much savings could be made after the initial investments.

Kendodd · 02/02/2024 10:48

I'm not vegetarian myself btw so not trying to push that. I just think we could probably all benefit from more meat free meals. Parents still always have the option of packed lunches.

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Wasbedeudetetdas · 02/02/2024 10:49

Kendodd · 02/02/2024 10:46

Vegetarian because, its vegetables, its probably cheaper (than good quality meat) better for the planet and covers more religious requirements. Meals would need to be good quality with no UPF. Only water and milk on offer to drink.

I know you can't force kids to eat well (or parents to feed them well) but this way all children would have access to good healthy food. It might also go some way to changing the culture. The food we feed our kids in school is every bit as important as the education they receive there.

In that case I am standing by my YABU, because only offering vegetarian options isn't necessarily healthier or cheaper, neither would it be more appealing, or definitely always better in environmental terms.

Londonrach1 · 02/02/2024 10:49

Yabu re the veg bit. I want my dd to have a full diet of all the food groups not restricted. However due to your question I think it be a waste of money.

Kendodd · 02/02/2024 10:51

TheNameIsDickDarlington · 02/02/2024 10:39

I assumed the "vegetarian" thing was about choice not that ALL meals had to be vegetarian. Just an option for both.

No, only vegetarian food available.

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Needmorelego · 02/02/2024 10:52

My daughters school has vegetarian meals only.
It's a SEN school for children with autism.
They do include fish which unfortunately means tuna which my daughter can't bare the smell of so she won't even go in the lunch hall on tuna days.
The great thing about her school is they are happy a child eats so if they turn up with nothing but a kitkat and a bag of crisps they don't make a fuss.
Kitkat and crisps child is mine by the way.
She eats "proper" meals at home. (Mostly 😂)

Boomboom22 · 02/02/2024 10:53

Yabvvvu to say veggie. Would be far too expensive to provide nutrionally balanced meals without meat.
With meat would be fine and indeed the gov do this now in ks1.

tiggergoesbounce · 02/02/2024 10:54

Like I said, increasing child benefit for people who need it

How do you ensure that reaches the child? How do you ensure that is used to put a hot meal in a small childs stomach?

pizzaHeart · 02/02/2024 10:55

Bargello · 02/02/2024 09:50

Absolutely not.

Help should be targetted to the families who need it the most. Vouchers for food in school holidays or cooking/nutrition lessons, or whatever other help they need to feed their kids a decent balanced diet. Families like those at our school who are 95% middle class professionals with a good level of income do not "need" free school meals. Most will happily take it as a freebie but that is doing zilch to address the needs of deprived kids.

Agree with this^

oatssosoft · 02/02/2024 10:56

This reply has been deleted

Sorry all but this user is a previously banned troll so we've deleted their threads and posts.

Kendodd · 02/02/2024 10:56

The question, was about the money saving long term (due to healthier population). My motivation would be child and adult health/reducing obesity. I know the government don't give a shit about the nations children (especially poor children). They do care about money though.

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