The blood of the covenant is thicker than the water of the womb

[GettingTetchy]

Am I being unreasonable to say that ‘The blood of the covenant is thicker than the water of the womb’ is a recent invention that fits in with modern ideas.

YABU = this is the origin of ‘blood is thicker than water’

YANBU = ‘blood is thicker than water’ always meant family is more important than everyone else.

Wikipedia is your friend on this.

“Writing in the 1990s and 2000s, author Albert Jack[18] and Messianic Rabbi Richard Pustelniak,[19] claim that the original meaning of the expression was that the ties between people who have made a blood covenant (or have shed blood together in battle) were stronger than ties formed by "the water of the womb", thus "The blood of the covenant is thicker than the water of the womb". Neither of the authors cite any sources to support their claim.[18][19]”

Thank you @ApoodlecalledPenny.

I thought the thread was going to be about this; DS's cargos 🤣

I reckon whoever said this hadn't given birth; otherwise they'd have known that childbirth itself is actually a lot more bloody than it is watery.

https://grammarist.com/proverb/blood-is-thicker-than-water/

Walter Scott used it in the early 1800s to mean family ties are the most important.
It dates back to 12th century Germany though, also meaning family ties are strongest.

I do like the new interpretation of the phrase, but, yeah, it's new.

True. That’s one reason it’s annoying.

I haven't come across that saying before and I think it's horrible. Very misogynistic as of course the ones you have spilt blood with would be men, and the giving birth would be women. So they are saying your war buddies mean more to you than your own mum???!!!

I hadn’t heard that explanation until yesterday either @DoIgotothefuneral (and I don’t want to hear it again!)

Never heard this phrase before.

I read it and thought marriage covenant.

I.e. you cut the apron strings and support your wife rather than pander to your mother and be one of those DHs people on here refer to as a DH problem.

A covenant is a contract, not a battle.

I am not too bright, so bear with me on this.... or it was my upbringing.

I always understood 'blood is thicker than water' to mean you look after family before friends. That was what my parents told me anyway.

But now, I kind of get it means the opposite.

Blood is thicker than water DOES mean family are more important than non family.

Yes. I think your parents were right. This strange explanation is new and false.

The original phrase was blood is thicker than water, from the 12th century. Where is the extended version from, when was that written? The original is staring that familial ties come back all else. The 'newer' version, depending on when it was written I suppose is stating that certain events may tie you more closely to friends than family, a 'you weren't there so you don't understand' idea I assume

I thought it was The blood that is spilled on the battlefield, is thicker than the water that is in the womb.’
Which is the opposite to how most people interpret it.
I do agree it’s misogynistic to suggest that the bond between a mother and child is not as strong as the bond formed between 2 men during battle.

Ok, thanks. Although, I do think the people I choose to have in my life are more important than the ones who take it for granted. A lot of my family are terrible, and I don't want anything to do with them.

Have you ever heard it used to mean anything like that? Or just as a put down to anyone who uses the expression to mean family ties are important?

Lots of sayings have changed into less encouraging sayings.
Curiousity killed the cat - but satisfaction brought it back
Jack of all trades but master of none - but better than just master of one
And so on.

It's not misogynistic imho. One could argue that water of the womb was used because with sperm, it wouldn't make consistency wise sense....
It's simply saying that relationships outside of family can be stronget than family ties. Out family relationships can be stronger bond than family relationships obviously. Not all families are good.

Now it's used at people who want to go NC from abusive families.

I think these are 2 completely separate things. The fact that they both refer to blood and water is making people think they are versions of the same saying, but they have very different meanings.

Have just read the Wikipedia entry above. Interesting - so the modern usage of " blood is thicker than water", referring to the strength of family ties, has completely changed the original meaning. You learn something new every day!

‘Jack of all trade’ seems to have gone full circle: Jack of all trades = compliment
Jack of all trades but master of none = insult
Jack of all trades but master of none - but better than just master of one = compliment
“Satisfaction brought it back’ is a good retort to ‘curiosity killed the cat’ and was presumably invented for that purpose.

Wikipedia can’t find any citation before the 1990s that means anything other than blood ties are more important than other ties. That was the original meaning.

It doesn’t I don’t think, that’s just a later invention

‘Blood is thicker than water’ is mostly used to make people feel bad for having boundaries with their biological family so I prefer the ‘new’ meaning although have always understood that ‘blood of the covenant…’ is not the original saying.

That might explain it.
It used to be used more often to mean I’ll be there for you.