To think we're about to see an influx of XL Bully attacks after a rehoming free for all?

[SeattleSpacePlane]

So I know the ban is about to come in. Plenty for it, many against it. Not trying to start a debate about that!

Yesterday someone on my FB shared a post from a woman who was offering to rehome an XL to save it before the ban came in. Someone commented with a group for rehoming XLs before it's too late and banned and I clicked on it for a look.

I was absolutely gobsmacked by the posts on the group. Hundreds of posts going back weeks of XLs needing new homes (I suppose expected) - but a VERY high and panicked volume of posts over the past few days, as the ban approaches.

Lots of pictures of dogs with !!URGENT!! rehoming requests. From people asking on behalf of their friend, because their HA just told them XLs are banned under their tenancy, for the XL they just found abandoned behind Tesco, because they bred an XL litter this year and a buyer has just dumped an 8 month old pup back with them. Lots of reasons. Incredibly sad for the dogs, none of this is of their making.

But it's the reaponses. Comments and comments from people offering to rehome an XL to save them. Highlights were 'willing to take one but must be good with children as I have a 5 year old'. 'I wish I could have both but I'm in a flat so one is my limit, please contact me'. 'I have an XL already who is brilliant with the kids, happy to add another poor baby to our pack'.

Dogs are currently being panic-rehomed all over the Country. People are offering their services to transport the XL from Devon to the family in Yorkshire who've agreed to take it. No home checks, no behavioural checks of the dogs, people aren't even meeting the dog they're agreeing to home. Lots and LOTS being shipped to Scotland in particular where there's no ban.

It's truly frightening the amount of people with young dc agreeing to blindly rehome an XL to save them. I wouldn't rehome a bloody Yorkie without meeting the dog first never mind an XL!

This is going to end in tragedy, surely?

AIBU to think the ban on privately rehoming them should have been immediate at point of announcement to prevent this madness? And also that, sadly, we're likely to be reading several tragic stories in the coming weeks about one of these panic-rehomed dogs turning?

Yes, I thought Dr Tulloch’s comment was profoundly stupid when it was posted. (Assuming the quote hasn’t misrepresented him.)

What else would you call a holding facility for animals waiting to die? Though unlike those humans on death row these dogs haven't actually committed a crime.

Slaughtermen/women are trained to slaughter various species. None of which at this time are dogs. I am not sure captive bolt is even considered humane for dogs - there was huge uproar when the RSPCA used that method years ago on a bunch of German Shepherds in a hoarding situation, and when that bloke in the North East was killing ex racing greyhounds that way. A free bullet is dangerous (to humans!!) and only used on dogs in extreme situations where the benefit out weighs the risk.

You'd also put the humans involved at risk from those who are breeding/selling XL Bullies and want to continue doing so. They may be a small % of the population, but theres enough of them to do some serious damage to such a facility and the people unfortunate enough to have to work there.

But again, as I say - such facilities do not exist. You'd propose what, building them? Or forcing existing kennels businesses to do this? I can't imagine they'd be particularly happy to be associated with it...

Its all moot anyway - the government has I think caused all dog rescues to potentially become these dog killing pens. It's that or some of them turn into XL bully sanctuaries which isn't really a viable solution and will lead to hoarding and neglect situations (few people continue to support sanctuaries full of unrehomable large, unattractive and non-cute animals... money dries up, standards slip and so on)...

What else would you call a holding facility for animals waiting to die? Though unlike those humans on death row these dogs haven't actually committed a crime.

I find that truly distasteful.

The rest I can’t be bothered with. I just don’t care about the fate of XL Bullies (or any dog listed by the DDA) so long as they are muzzled in public, can’t reproduce or, otherwise, are destroyed.

I absolutely despise people like this who anthropomorphise their pets just as far as is financially/emotionally convenient.

If dogs were truly capable of consciously wanting to have the opportunity to be a "mummy", they would never get over it when the puppies disappeared to go to a buyer eight weeks after birth. Or in the case of a lot of these irresponsible morons, six weeks later.

Funny how he pretends it will impact his dog to never have puppies, when he'd laugh you out of the house if you said it would affect her to have them disappear. Because it's all about the money he'd get from selling the puppies!

Yep, dogs don't pine to be mums. I knew someone who forced her bitch to have puppies and she rejected the whole litter.

My mum lives near an estate that has lots of XL bullys. She knows of one lady who took one on and had to sign a "breeding contract"... in that she by taking the bitch on, she was agreeing to breed 3 litters from her. And this was after the ban was announced.

I am not against XL bullys, as I believe the problem is at the human end of the lead.... but stuff like this is just fucked up and shows how much some people do not appreciate the gift that is dogs.

Isn’t it very unhealthy for bitches to have lots of litters?

My SIL has a Collie rescued from a puppy farm, this Collie was the resident ‘mum’ and I can’t remember how many litters she had in about years but it was obscene. One litter was by her son and the puppies were all deformed and died after the birth, because clearly the sick owners didn’t bother to keep an eye on the poor thing. She was a terrified little thing and extremely nervous. Evil fuckers.

Yep. Pregnancy, birth and lactation are all tremendously demanding physiological stages/events, and she has to have adequate recovery time in between each one. Same for cats, too, not that people selling kittens on FB care.

I think I've read before that the Kennel Club has a rule that dogs can only be registered as pedigrees if they come from a bitch's first four litters during her life time. That's a rule to discourage people from repeatedly breeding from the same mother.

@StaunchMomma Not my opinion love, it’s a vet’s. I cut and paste it from sky news. You’ve given me your baseless opinion though. Clearly you know better- 🤔

KC rules also say that the dam must be over 1 year old before first mating, and under 8 years old at last whelping, plus if a bitch has had 2 Csecs then no puppies from subsequent litters can be registered.

It should stop excessive breeding per bitch, but with the rising demand and good prices for doodle-poos it probably hasn't (nothing to stop the bitch having registered pedigree litters, then un-regulated unregistered cross-breed litters)

If you cut and paste it, what are your own thoughts on it?

Can you see how saying "most dogs who bit people during (insert time period here) aren't XL bullies" doesn't negate the statement that "most dogs who killed during (insert time period here) are XL bullies"?

It isn't the biting that has brought about the ban. It's the deaths.

Any dog can bite. A chihuahua can bite. A spaniel can bite. But would you rather be in a room with an angry chihuahua, spaniel or XL bully?

When I was in A&E not long again a young teenage boy came in with his dad, his arm ripped to shreds by their dog. When asked if it was the dog’s first attack - “no he’s attacked him before but he’s usually such a loving caring dog”! Couldn’t believe the idiocy!
TikTok has had lots of XL bully lives recently too, trying to rehome litters of pups quickly. I block each one.

To be fair to Dr Tulloch - having searched out the Sky News article - he wasn’t really saying what the pp suggested. His point of view is more complex. I don’t agree with him, but it’s not as straightforwardly misguided as it looks. Broadly, he thinks other things should be done as well.

@whatsitcalledwhen Have you read the whole thread? I’ve stayed what I think many, many times.

I’ve walked them, I’ve walked them with my 7 year old. I’ve volunteered at a rescue and I’ve donated money and time to helping the staff pay for neutering/spaying, paying for three behaviourists to temperament test and transferring their last few bullies to Scotland before the ban. I am not a vet and I’m not a professional, I can only give an opinion.

I’d rather be in a room with any of the dogs you mention than some of the posters on this thread. How’s that for an answer.

I’d rather be in a room with any of the dogs you mention than some of the posters on this thread. How’s that for an answer.

It’s a great answer, very helpful. It says a lot about you.

"I’d rather be in a room with any of the dogs you mention than some of the posters on this thread. How’s that for an answer."

Same tbh. Although I think I'd draw the line at an angry Spaniel having seen Cocker rage in action.

I think a lot of people on this thread have no experience of dogs let alone an xl bully, but think they know best.

XL Bullies make up around 1% of the dog population in the UK and despite this are responsible for 46% of dog attacks on people and 70% of dog-on-dog attacks.

They are genetically predisposed to aggression, violence and unpredictability. The high level of inbreeding is a contributing factor with more than half of XL Bullies currently in the UK descended from the same dog, a dog which was itself the result of a breeding using sibling dogs and was known for it's aggression. An XL bully involved in one of the fatal attacks in the UK was related to that dog both maternally and paternally.

"I’d rather be in a room with any of the dogs you mention than some of the posters on this thread. How’s that for an answer."

How many posters on this thread would rip a child apart with their bare teeth, for kicks? Genuine question.

That’s not correct.
Many have dogs themselves and have seen how dog aggressive XL’s are, and how poor the level of control is.
XL owners often cannot stop an attack or are physically pulled over.

Even the local Dog wardens ( and our vet practice) aren’t fans of XL’s for the many reasons specified.

These are definitely experienced dog people.

I'm genuinely curious about the Facebook groups that are arranging for people to take them in. I thought it was now illegal to re home them, or doesn't that rule kick in until later this year? Surely the people taking them in will have to certificate them, unless in Scotland?
I wonder if the police are monitoring those groups? A few prosecutions may clarify the situation as to whether the groups are actually breaking the law?

My vet (been there too many times unfortunately, in the past with a breed that many on here would also want to see banned) has always maintained that the ones that make him most nervous are the ones I'd never expect - labs, retrievers etc. He said Jack Russell's too, but that's not a surprise 😬 there's an XL in there nearly every time we've been in (they seem to outnumber people round here!).

Found that out when my staffie air-snapped at him as he went to give her a jab, I nearly died on the spot and pointed to the muzzle behind him and said it was fine if he wanted to use that, he said hes never had to use one on a bull breed yet. Then he staffie-whispered to her and she never snapped at him again, even when he once actually had to put his fingers right in her mouth to check her snaggle teeth 😳

I don't see you wrong there. There are very few people on here (and similar threads) talking any sense but I really do appreciate those people!

Whatever a vet's personal opinion of labs (and I've also encountered a couple with odd temperaments), the fact is that labs have killed zero people in the UK to date.
The numbers tell the story. That's why I find people arguing in favour of XL Bullies so odd. They're clearly objectively not a safe animal to keep domestically.

Thank you for that. Those figures (I take them as well-sourced) say it all.

Anyone who defends keeping XL Bullies is, in the face of that, a fool or a knave.

OK, so it was a vet playing with the stats then!

If you can't see there's clear bias in that argument that's your problem, not mine.