Racist family members

[literaryloveaffair]

I am at a family reunion in a European country where there are family members in attendance from Israel, Germany, America. I have been treated to quite a few statements like:

1. Having a population that is 5% Muslim is one Muslim too many
2. UK is in danger of becoming a sharia law state due to the Muslims
3. It is fundamentally difficult for Muslims to integrate because most of them are religious fundamentalists who do much more than keeping ramadan and eating halal food
4. Immigrant children are causing lots of havoc in schools, the arab students throw chairs around
5. Low income immigrants are a burden on the state (including nurses) and importing nurses mean increasing the burden on the state cos they are low income.

Maybe i am sheltered but I am an immigrant and i have lived for 10 years in the UK and I have never heard so many statements said in any group of people. This is just the tip of the iceberg in just two days and frankly quite a small selection. I don't meet these family members very often so therefore don't hear that much. But it is shocking to me, is uk a much less racist society?

The bulk of the statements were said by my sisters' in laws' partners. It is unfortunate but my SILs made aliyah to israel (so they moved there after university without having ever worked in the UK and then tried to survive there). They then fell in love before they became 'established' in the new country and I suppose in the absence of jobs and the structure that provides, they fell in love with other 'unsettled people' who also came from similarly rich countries like america and netherlands. I suppose the chance of a potential partner being the kind of disaffected people who struggle to find job opportunities (and then pin the blame on immigrants/muslims/bogeyman of the time) is high. Its not that all people who move to Israel are like that (that is far from the truth), but I expect most people who move to a new country (esp one as expensive as Israel) would have some sort of plan (and probably hang out with other people who also had a plan). On the other hand, if you can't find a job, its quite easy to say you are a Zionist and move to Israel cos then a period of unemployment is easy to explain away (cos you are learning hebrew obviously and there is now a war on).

So I am wondering if perhaps such racism would be common in UK amongst people who are long term unemployed /or disaffected; but as I have always had a job, i don't really meet people in such circles. Or is UK really far less racist across all groups of people.

Well the person criticising them is also jobless and said he wanted to milk Israel out of every shekel possible. The irony.

As for Bangladeshis, second generation bangladeshis are shown to perform better on national tests than 'local children'

Imagining @JaneyGee being like nah got one of you already 😂😂

Such a weird 'look how culturally diverse my friendship group is' statement.

@kitsuneghost
''UK is very racist
It is covered up well by some
Excused as not about racism by some
It is blatant in some.

But yes UK is a racist country.
82% are Caucasian
All countries will naturally bias toward the majority''

I think that is nonsense.

The UK is not 'very racist'...Having lived in France, Italy and the USA I can tell you that racism is a thousand times worse in these place. London for example is one of the best examples of integration I have ever seen.

What the UK has though is totally toxic right wing press and Tory party who for decades have blamed immigrants and the EU for everything.

Unfortunately as we also have a poor mainstream education system in many parts of the country there are a lot of people who will just take whatever propaganda the Daily Mail, the Sun and so on feed them as being the truth.

It is easier for governments to spin that tale because that narrative means corporate companies and wealthy individuals can continue to avoid paying a fair share of tax and ministers can avoid facing the reality that we have crap housing, health and transport because of lack of investment, privatisation and corporate greed.

Much easier to blame it all on the 'foreigners' and Brexit showed us that a lot of people are easily duped.

Also the reality is that racism is not just a white against everyone else problems. There is racism in non-white communities against other communities too...

It's truly scary how much anti Muslim propaganda there is out there. Russian Bot factories are literally preying on the fears of right-wingers in the west and stoking hatred with lies posted to SM.

The Britain/Sharia law thing is openly spouted on Fox News as fact. I saw a clip where they were saying there are areas of London/Birmingham/Manchester etc that a white person cannot walk through. Just utter bollox!

These are things racists like to believe because it fits neatly into their nasty little narratives.

The World does seem like it's taking so many steps backwards at the moment. It's really sad.

What the UK has though is totally toxic right wing press and Tory party who for decades have blamed immigrants and the EU for everything.

Couldn't agree more.

It's truly scary how much power the press have.

This is why Farage makes my skin crawl. Privileged, well-educated and still chooses to stan Hitler Youth and Enoch Powell as a teenager. Literal piece of shit, that one.

Not that I have time for working-class racists but there is, as you say, often contributing societal factors that encourage 'blaming' and 'othering'.

These 'fears' by the way are almost always nothing more than racist lies (as often spouted by my own family). And they are not being ignored, they're completely in the driving seat of government in this country, willing to inflict massive economic pain to appease a bunch of racists.

@Kendodd I also think things would be a lot better if as a nation we faced the facts I.e. we need immigrants for our society and economy to function

the vast majority of immigrants are coming with visas - usually work permit or student visas. and we desperately need them here. brexit has caused European immigrants to leave - causing issues in many sectors. there is an increase in non EU migration to fill these roles

@roarrfeckingroar you are right about the majority of Bangladeshi communities in the uk. but these are communities who came in the 1950s - often transported directly from their villages to the UK. many had not even been to their local city and could not read or write in their own language! they were brought as cheap labour for factories. they became ghettoised and unfortunately remain in deep poverty to this day. there are many complex social factors at play here, too long to explain without hijacking OP's thread. but the current younger generation of bengalis are trying to break free from the cycle of intergenerational poverty. similar issues also face other immigrant communities. however there are also Bangladeshi and other immigrants who are educated professionals coming here for phDs or highly skilled roles - and they are a whole other kettle of fish.

I have a mixed experiences as an Asian Muslim. I have lovely white colleagues at work (including Jews), so I get lulled into a false sense of security that this is the norm.

And then every couple of months, I’ll get exposed to someone really awful (usually white), which makes me want to take a step back from all white people and just hide away from them.

But then I remind myself that the people I work with every day don’t behave this way.

It’s a real mind fuck. I’m always on egg shells when interacting with white people in shops etc, as I never know when the next incident can happen.

OP before I got to your second paragraph I was wondering are these family members from Aish as your points are exactly what I read on their website a few days ago (minus the nurses) 🤣. They seem to be utterly obsessed with blaming Muslims for all of the ills of the world.

Of course there is racism in the UK, but it's less acceptable to be blatantly racist within the middle classes, doesn't mean it isn't there though. Muslims are the most discriminated against group in the UK across all sectors. There was a survey not so long ago that revealed that Islamophobia is rife within the NHS, and similar results from a Social Workers union. IIRC it was most prevelant within the middle class. On the Conflict in the Middle East board you have posters who claim to be academics, teachers etc in multicultural areas make an argument about Hamas but very quickly it becomes about all Muslims being terrorists.

Call it out every time OP. "Really, you think all Muslims don't integrate? Where are you getting your stats from please?" <Mumsnet head tilt and tinkly laugh>