Why won’t they assess my poor little boy?

[Candycanesallround]

My 4 year olds EHCP assessment request has just been turned down for the second time. First time was because his preschool hadn’t submitted enough cycles of evidence, second time because they felt more time was needed to see if their ideas helped him make any improvements. He’s been at the preschool 10 months. His ASD/ADHD has been confirmed by various professionals who have all assessed him and written reports confirming this. They have all recommended he needs the support of an EHCP. He has no learning disability and is very bright. But he is hugely impulsive, no danger awareness, very very hyperactive although when he is very interested in something he can hold his attention and focus well - but only when it is something he’s really into, like a puzzle. He has good language skills - not such great back and forth conversation skills. Physically very able which is good but his speed and strength combined with his impulsivity and lack of danger awareness terrify me. I am going to have to go through an appeal tribunal. No idea if I will be successful.
I have zero and I do mean zero support. I have a 7 year old daughter who is lovely but I constantly feel
guilty she plays second fiddle to her brother and his additional needs. I never have enough eyes or hands or time to do it all. I work part time. His dad lives with us but is basically a hologram in that he looks like he’s here but he isn’t really. He goes to work and watches tv the rest of the time; he hasn’t even read any of our sons reports and when I tearfully told him the EHCP assessment request I’ve been fighting for has been turned down again, his response was “I thought that was all sorted?” 🙄 No family. Lots of lovely friends but they all have their own kids and issues etc.
I cannot overstate how through the roof my stress levels are.
why won’t they assess him? Will they ever assess him? What happens if they don’t? Will he literally just be left to struggle in school without help?
I honestly cannot breathe sometimes with the worry.
any knowledge or advice appreciated. Thankyou

You can dispute my use of the word ‘majority’ all you want but it is the majority of areas. You only have to read MN to see that. I support parents of disabled DC countrywide and it is what is happening on the ground.

Some of us have got kids in private schools and while I suppose in theory it would be possible for them to get the LA to provide Ed psych advice, in practice it wouldn't be.

It is clear from the little communication I've had from our LA (which appears to be an absolutely bog standard one - I haven't seen it in any 'name and shame' type articles, anyway) that it will be a cold day in Hell before anyone who's used the private sector at any point in their health or educational journey will be helped by them.

Ironically local use of private education is relatively high because they kept running out of school places...

When I was researching this a couple of years ago, I was actually advised NOT to get an EP assessment before the EHCNA, but to save my money for now. You can get one later if the LA one is not suitable, and then it will be more current if you need it for appeal (which could well be a year or more off).

We followed the advice to hold off and the LA EP's report ultimately secured us a place for DC in a specialist unit. I'm not claiming it's the only way or the best way but it did work for us.

The single best tip I was given by SENDIASS was if the EP report is a bit wooly, go back and ask the EP to make it a bit more specific. I think we saved a lot of to and fro that way.

Anyway this must all feel quite overwhelming for you, and for OP. You just have to trust that others have found their way through and you will too. And most of them have done it without the plethora of advice and expertise you can get from Mumsnet. One step at a time, one foot in front of the other. You will get conflicting advice - you CAN'T follow all of it, so give yourself permission not to.

I can only assume your parents are a self-selecting sample who are in areas where they are experiencing the most frustration with the system. What you talk about does indeed happen, but there is a whole range of practice out there and most services which have shrunk to statutory only are desperately looking for ways out as it is not a good way to work.

Look, I don't really understand the conflict. We surely both agree that IF you can manage it, an EP involvement as early as possible is a good thing? The best possible way of having your child's needs met?

You might find this an interesting read.

Educational psychology services: workforce insights and school ... - GOV.UK https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/649c4a4406179b00113f7498/Educational_Psychology_services_-_Workforce_insights_and_school_perspectives_on_impact.pdf

This thread really brings home how adversarial the system has become when what the CYP need is for the team around them to collaborate.

Austerity has played a major part in this, with LAs having less funds available. Parents who find themselves 'fighting' LAs for additional funding for their child/children often cast those working in the LA as evil villains who don't care about children. However, this is usually far from the truth. Those working on children's services usually care a lot and have to make difficult decisions about how and where to allocate scarce resources. This week, Birmingham have announced they are having to reduce their Children's Services expenditure by over £52 million. It is hard to see how they'll have capacity to uphold SEN legislation.

There are further problems being faced for those with EHCPs who are not accessing specified provision on their EHCPs as there is a recruitment crisis and not enough OTs and SLTs. Again, parents are understandably furious, but schools and LAs are pretty helpless.

I don't think there is anything wrong with parents only focussing on advocating for their children. I don't think they should have to 'see it from the LAs point of view'. I am also pleased that there is a relatively accessible tribunal system available so parents can advocate in this way.

What I think is sad is that so many parents are inducted into the process by being primed for battle and being told that they will have to fight for EHCPs. I can understand why this is and this comes from well intentioned parents who have been wounded by their own experiences.

However, many children (with and without a wide range of diagnoses) struggle to settle in to school, or experience a crisis whilst at school, and overtime, with the right support, end up settled and making progress. An EHCP or additional resources aren't always needed. In fact, sometimes, the adjustments needed are nothing to do with funding but more to do with the values, flexibility and mindset of the staff/school. Where this is the case, parents can experience avoidable additional stress of believing they need to fight the school and LA. Sometimes, the 'fight' with the school is to do with allowing the child fidget toys and being able to eat their lunch somewhere other than the hall.

The ‘conflict’ as you put it (to me it is just a differing opinion on a forum) is you minimising what is actually happening in the majority of areas. An EP assessment outside of statutory work is not possible for the majority. No, the families I support aren’t only from the worst LAs. As I said, the families are countrywide.

EP involvement as early as possible is, of course, beneficial, but alongside an EHCNA request, not at the expense of delaying an EHCNA request because a watertight EHCP is the best possible way of ensuring DC’s needs are met.

I agree with this. My Foster Son got a lot from the EP report. Eventually gaining a place in a special school. He'd never have got that without her detailed report of why specialist provision was needed.

I just disagree that it is a majority of areas, certainly in the part of the country I work in. I know EPs personally working in about 15-20 LAs hereabouts. Only 1 was completely reduced to statutory only. Lots more have way too much of the statutory assessment side in comparison to a wider range of work, mine included. But it's not at the point where writing statutory assessments is "all" we do, or where we do no other work in schools or with families aside writing advice for kids where EHCNA has been agreed. The one LA which was statutory only lost nearly all its EPs and has now formed a partnership with a sister LA which has enabled a wider variety of practice.

All I am asking is that people are aware that if they can get an EP early on, it's better all round. If they enquire and find out it isn't possible in their area or their school, fair enough - but do enquire.

And all I was pointing out to others is your experience is not the norm and people shouldn’t delay requesting an EHCNA.

The Lea are such bastards. Get your mp on it.

I'm sorry you have no help in your home, but how would an ehcp make a difference to that? Is there something he doesn't have at school that you think he needs and an ehcp would give him access to? Lots of send children don't have ehcps

The problem with this approach is that children with SEN can progress very well, and then suddenly everything goes wrong!

I teach in secondary school and it is so so common to have children who were "just about managing" in primary come up to us without an ECHP, and then it all goes wrong and often we reach the point of school refusal and all sorts of other issues before an ECHP can be put in place.

OP's son is facing a transition to reception soon, which will have lower ratios than nursery - could be 1:30 eg when a TA is absent. I think it's important to try and assess now!

That's not quite true. If there is no reason to think that extra provision is needed (if the nursery are managing fine and he's making progress) there is no need to assess

@Postapocalypticcowgirl but if you assess when a child is doing fine all the assessment will say is this child is doing fine?

No, they really aren't and this is pretty dangerous misinformation...

But if half the class have SEN, then it's far better they have an ECHP in place than they don't. Not having an ECHP doesn't mean the SEN goes away?

With an ECHP, those children will get targeted, funded support, whether that's in class from a TA or external interventions etc.

Without an ECHP it's all far more likely to fall on the teacher and maybe one TA in ks1, who inevitably can't meet all the needs and that's often where things go really wrong.

But very rarely are things actually totally going fine and there is nothing you can recommend to help. An echp can also be a passport to things like supported transition and means they are already on a SENCo's radar. It also means you can name a suitable school.

There is a pretty broad spectrum between absolutely fine, and violent school refusal...

Edit: when we talk to prior schools it's very clear things were often not fine or parents had reported concerns etc, but were discouraged from going down the ECHP route.

For example in some primary schools there are still class TAs at least half the day even in Y6, and you have students who were getting TA support every morning, maybe doing intervention instead of assembly, maybe having additional breaks in their day etc - and they come up to secondary school and we can't really offer any of that so easily especially without an ECHP, and maybe the parents would have rather picked the school of 500 in the next town rather than our school of ~1400 with a large sixth form...

I know it's difficult and I guess in a way it's a flaw in the system but if you wait until there are major problems imo it's too late.

@DrRuthGalloway are you perhaps in an area of the country where schools aren't heavily academy-ised?

Because round here a large academy chain dominates the state sector and has got a poor reputation with SEN. I seriously doubt the LA ed psychs go into those schools much. The borough has also essentially exported much of its SEN to neighbouring boroughs due to not building suitable schools and I would guess relying on the (relatively affluent) local population to pay for stuff themselves. And there's a large private sector which as I've said can't access LA support services but don't have their own.

I have actually read the SEN Code 2014 (I recommend every teacher and everyone with a SEN child does this) and the system it describes is very far from what's actually happening on the ground.

There's a graphic on page 154 - a kind of flowchart of the EHCP process - I've annotated it with what has actually happened to us (and it's hardly the worst case).

It's unbelievably bad.

For what it's worth, the actual professionals we've seen have nearly all been, well, professional, nice, competent, but the LA SEN unit are just woeful. It's the most pathetic excuse for a "public service" I've ever come across.

And this is not considered one of the bad areas!

@Postapocalypticcowgirl I am also a secondary teacher.

We also see this particularly in year 7 and year 12 (plus students who limp through to year 10 or 11 then burn out).

The SEN Code recognises that "phase transfers" are flashpoints. But once you introduce long delays to support, it means transitions often go wrong.

@Postapocalypticcowgirl he is a young child. Early years area SENcos support transition to reception or should do. Supporting a stressed mum who has little support and making sure the right strategies are in place at pre school will help to properly identify his needs for the future.

This is exactly what happened to us. Dd starting to struggle at primary and crashed out completely in secondary. No support in place, certainly no ehcp as dc was ‘fine in school’ and we were left at absolute crisis point not knowing where to turn.
I know so many families with SEN children. I don’t know of any who have had EP involvement prior to a needs assessment. Pre covid, (I imagine it’s worse now) I know one family who were told the school could afford 3 EP assessments a year, there were approx 200 dc in each year group across a secondary school. 3! Obviously the school would have to allocate the funding to the most needy child, but what about the rest? (And i never spoke to anyone who knew any of the three dc who got EP involvement, so no idea if they even had these).

OP, you’ve had some really good advice already. I would say to get your mediation certificate and appeal. I know it sounds scary when talk of court and judges is mentioned, but honestly, it’s not as bad as it sounds, especially for a needs assesment. Statistics this week said 98% of appeals went in favour of the family. IPSEA has some really good advice on this or ask around and see if anyone can recommend an advocate who can give you some advice if you are completely overwhelmed and need some personalised support (my SEND to advocate was absolutely amazing and supported us through the whole process).
the LAs should hang their heads in shame for what they are putting families through. I don’t even think it’s about saving money, how much does it cost to bring a case to tribunal, they could save a vast amount of money just supporting the child to start with!

And as for those saying 4 is too young to need an ehcp! The only way to be sure your child has the support they need is to get an ehcp. Being on the school SEN register doesn’t guarantee you anything! (From experience, other dc is on this and I don’t think his ‘SEN pupil passport’ has been read by anyone other than the ta who wrote it).

@SpringboksSocks
Ed Psychs can diagnose ASD (if they've had ADOS/DISCO training).

In my area I would estimate 70 percent of children, maybe a little more, have EP involvement prior to EHCNA.

Yes we have high levels of academy trusts.

In our area schools can buy additional EP time and the only ceilings on this is the availability of EPs. Some of our academy trusts have bought their own EP. Most commission from us or similar services.

If a MAT can afford to pay the CEO several hundred thousand a year, they could afford a full time EP for 50k and certainly more than 3 assessments a year. Most of our secondary schools commission around 10-15 days a term. It's worth it because we make a difference.

Yes LAs can be problematic. Yes in some areas the EP service has been so ground down that they can only offer one off assessment after EHCNA is agreed. But make no mistake in many cases this is also because schools are not spending their budgets on buying additional EP time, which in many areas, they can.

Here's an example of a typical model. LA commissions basic services; schools can buy in additionality.

https://www.devon.gov.uk/support-schools-settings/send/educational-psychology/educational-psychology-service/

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/the_names_of_all_of_the_988_mats