To be so sad about my slide in living standards?

[ColdNow]

I grew up in a not so nice area, but my parents had a big house with a huge garden that they bought on two fairly modest salaries when they were younger than I am now. My mum took years out of work when I was born and although things like holidays and eating out weren't a regular occurrence, my parents admit they were never really stressed about money despite having several children and easily paid off their mortgage.

Fast forward to now, where I did my very best to do the 'right' things. I got a good degree, decent and stable job, married and bought a property before TTC. I'm now pregnant and feeling so sad about our financial situation. We purposely went for a modest property with a tiny garden to give ourselves a buffer, but now with the huge increase in our mortgage repayments and other expenses we're struggling to keep afloat. I would love to work part time when I go back but it's now looking very unlikely that we'll be able to make it work without being extremely stretched. I'm always worried about money and already buy all my clothes second hand, shop at budget supermarkets etc. The main cost is housing though, because we live in an expensive city, but this is the city I grew up in and where all my family and friends are, and moving away would be a very difficult choice to make and remove us from all our support networks.

I just feel so sad that within a generation the things my parents were able to offer me (space, time) I'm not able to offer my child, despite me earning far more comparatively than they did. I'm also the youngest in my family and the older siblings are much better off than me, again just because of time - they got onto the property market much earlier before prices sky-rocketed and now although I don't earn a lot less than them, I'm only just scraping by. I notice this at work too, I have colleagues at the same level of seniority and pay to me but a decade or more older, and the houses and lifestyle they sustain far exceed mine.

I don't know what the purpose of this thread is except to just say that it makes me sad that this is the situation I'm in, and people younger than me (I'm in my early 30s) are even worse off.

Because I’m not your secretary.

Yes of course inequality exists, it always has, but the divide between rich and poor is getting much greater and that is often due to large inheritances that millennials and future generations will inherit due to the vast increase in house prices.

"It's actually strange - when we think about it - for anyone to assume that we'll have a better standard of living than our parents."

In many ways the standard is way higher, access to communication, cheap travel, easier to go to Uni etc. the big problem, the Elephant in The Room that no one wanted to talk about, that is now shitting on the carpet, is debt loads for basic shelter, especially when economic reality demands that the cost of this debt load is going to have to rise! The core of our problems as a society is the price of basic shelter being driven up by nearly free debt, and large swathes of the public going along with it like clapping seals at feeding time!

I don`t need it done, you are the one looking for "evidence".

Also I think the funding model will change eg care in the home may include value of house etc and the NHS won’t exist much longer in its current form.

Theresa May tried that with her dementia tax in 2017 and had to remove it from her manifesto, the outcry still lost her her majority. The NHS is a sacred cow, healthcare will always be free at the point of delivery, no political party would dare attempt to change it, it would be political suicide.

For your assertions. I don’t care if you don’t want to provide it, I’ll just assume you’re making it up. 🤷‍♀️

OAP I really feel your pain.

I watched helplessly, unable to afford to buy a house, only for them to go further and further out of reach.

Eventually we scraped together enough to buy a flat. I then had to bring up my kids in an urban flat, feeling like the biggest failure in the world.

I was a senior management accountant working my bollocks off and my husband was a senior teacher, yet we had a cast off pushchair and all second hand stuff when the kids were small.

I used to wonder where we'd gone wrong but in the end you have to chalk it down to experience just for your own sanity. I got really bad PND with my second baby, which was wholly focused around bringing my kids up in a too small flat and no foreseeable way out of it. I'd have loved to go part time to spend more time with my children, yet I knew there was no way we'd climb out of poverty if I did.

It's not entitled, it was just baffling how we'd worked so much harder and been so much more successful career wise than our parents, but ended up so much poorer.

However, ten years later (and yes I know the paper value of our house is higher and I'm sorry for that) it has got better. That's all I can offer you. We continued to work full time in "full on" jobs and bit by bit we saved money. Once we'd got a financial cushion, we were finally able to upgrade to a (modest) house.

Childcare costs go, mortgage costs do eventually feel manageable. We got promoted. Things aren't as stretched as they were.

YABU - it feels grossly unfair.

"due to large inheritances that millennials and future generations will inherit due to the vast increase in house prices."

Can`t see that lasting into the future if rates stay "higher for longer" or spike even higher, people will see their "inheritance" evaporate before their eyes.

If you want to believe RM and other VI`s figures that is your business.

Yes of course inequality exists, it always has, but the divide between rich and poor is getting much greater and that is often due to large inheritances that millennials and future generations will inherit due to the vast increase in house prices.

Which is what I said…

Spot on! The enormous, very cheap, debt for basic shelter was/is absolutely insane. And that chicken is coming home to roost now. Some will benefit, by accident of birth, of the grossly inflated costs. But long term, society is fkd because of it.

Theresa May tried that with her dementia tax in 2017 and had to remove it from her manifesto, the outcry still lost her her majority. The NHS is a sacred cow, healthcare will always be free at the point of delivery, no political party would dare attempt to change it, it would be political suicide.

Things are much bleaker now so I think it will be revisited. Plus the model will happen by default anyway eg you need that op well the waiting list is 2 yrs etc I think people will be far more willing to reform a system that is no longer working for them.

But long term, society is fkd because of it.

Basing so much of the economy on ever increasing house prices has screwed everything & one reason why productivity is so poor. It’s reductive to have so much income tied up in housing.

Feelings are reasonable. Nobody can tell you that your feelings are wrong. But the reality is every generation has had to figure things out and every generation has had their challenges. The baby boomers may have lucked out on property etc but today a lot of people are spoiled rotten and expect all kinds of conveniences that the last few generations considered luxuries. There's an some interesting podcasts and neflix programmes about saving money etc. One good place to start is refuse to spend money on things you don't really care about. And don't list to the BS that you can't buy a latte. You live once. And pregnancy hormones will mess you up and make you feel bleak at times. People buy thinking buying a house is a magic path to happiness. It's not. It's a choice. I don't own a home. I don't begrudge it. I've lived around the world and in my situation I wouldn't have been able to do that.

Sounds like you might need to do some soul searching about what makes you happy and what drains you. And are you feeling bad because you wanted to live the status quo to get happiness or are you feeling unfulfilled because it's not the life you want? exactly...

It’s already happening by default. So many people are now opting for private healthcare - particularly age related surgery like hip and knee replacement and cataract surgery - that waiting lists are forming in that sector too.

If you seriously think any kind of dementia tax will be resurrected after the reaction last time you’re going to be very disappointed. I’d bet my house that idea never rears its head again.

1 or 2% doesn't make houses affordable, in fact this recent small decline just means people don't buy or sell, its called a slump, buyers aren't there as they are waiting for further drops and sellers can't afford to drop into negative equity.

Bottom line is the market stagnates.

Data? YOPA (fwiw) report small rises in prices, certainly its whats happening down here but of course RM Yopa etc are keen to bid up the market.

Nationwide also reported a small rise, as demand out strips supply.

@nomadmummy

” but today a lot of people are spoiled rotten and expect all kinds of conveniences that the last few generations considered luxuries.”

Do you have any evidence there are more spoiled younger people than in the previous generation?

“For example, the authors found that millennials born in the late 1980s earned, on average, 8% less at the age of 30 than their counterparts from Generation X did at the same age (Generation X is defined as people born between 1966 and 1980 and, therefore, now aged between 43 and 57). The audit also found that the typical weekly pay of graduates aged 30-34 fell by 16% in real terms between 2007 and 2023 (though equivalent non-graduate pay fell by only 6%). Overall, it found that the long-term effects of the financial crisis have left British millennials struggling to catch up with the living standards of older generations. “

The market is made at the margins, people who dont sell are not part of the market, the people who DO sell (for whatever reason) set the new price for the street/estate if they are similar houses. The value of your house can still fall even if you dont sell it!

This is interesting. I think Gen X are also earning less in real terms than they were in that era. All our standard of living has gone down 20%. Financial crash, austerity, then Brexit and COVID have crippled this country, with very poor leadership from buffoons like Boris and David Cameron.

I think we need to look at how we ended up with two Bullingdon club PMs who were historically bad.

Nor were the 1980s and 1990s in some respects.
Realistically all decades had some negatives in them.
However, property is a bigger issue these days, massive demand but very little supply and until that is resolved, nothing will improve.

It’s already happening by default. So many people are now opting for private healthcare - particularly age related surgery like hip and knee replacement and cataract surgery - that waiting lists are forming in that sector too.

I know it & it will keep happening. Why do you think it won’t get worse or the NHS model won’t change?

If you seriously think any kind of dementia tax will be resurrected after the reaction last time you’re going to be very disappointed. I’d bet my house that idea never rears its head again.

You’ve lost me now? Why would I be disappointed? I gave an opinion about something I think will be revisited, I’ve not made any judgement on whether it’s a good thing or not!

Why do you think it won’t get worse or the NHS model won’t change?

I told you why in my first response to you.

" massive demand but very little supply"

Just not true, demand is dropping all the time, supply stays the same.

"Supply and Demand" was just a meme to encourage people into mortgage debt.

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/newslondon/four-hackney-schools-to-close-due-to-significant-decline-in-number-of-school-aged-children/ar-AA1lokHJ

https://www.plumplot.co.uk/London-property-transactions.html

lol, well i am disappointed now!

This. In bucket loads. We have massively underbuilt for years. In the 1960s and 70s in some years was over 400k a year when immigration was also running much lower. We're lucky to get over 200k now with unprecedented immigration. Interest rate hikes should have reduced the prices so in end balances out. The massive difference now is supply compared to demand. Also a lot of under occupied homes - the average wealth of over 60s has never been higher. Unfortunately their children are paying the price for all that asset appreciation.