To think that Sunday trading hours need to be abolished?

[HFJ]

I remember the hullabaloo about Sunday trading back in the late 80s

Whenever I talk to people about this, many usually give the following reasons why Sunday trading restrictions are a good thing:

1. Everyone can have Sunday lunch/family time together
2. Retail workers can have some weekend time off

However, I can’t be the only person who thinks the above is BALONEY

On the family time thing, I object for feminist reasons because it usually means a hard-working woman somewhere has to peel potatoes and rustle up a Sunday lunch for everyone else. Then, when she has done all that, can she treat herself to an emergency handbag, pair of shoes, just get away and meet a friend for coffee, or perhaps get the family shopping in on before the working week starts? Can she heck. Why? Because of some Bishops in the house of lords decree that the world should shut and therefore her indoors should remain indoors.

On the weekend time off thing, I really don’t see what the issue is. There are plenty of students who would like to and need to work. Also, there’s nothing to stop religious workers asking their employer to prioritise time off on Sunday for them (just as Muslims, Jews, people with caring responsibilites can make requests).

Am I the only one who feels this way?

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/639084 there’s a petition here it but it has hardly any signatures

Working with the public can be a thankless grind

I will be looking for another job in the new year. I worked in retail as it was convenient after being a SAHM for many years, but it is an awful job. You work very unsociable hours including New Years Day,. Boxing Day, all bank holidays, SUNDAYS!!! and you get no extra pay, and on these days you have to leave earlier as the transport is limited. You get loads of abuse from the pubic.

I've had very well paid, management jobs pre DC and this is the hardest I have ever worked, for the least pay, and the most abuse.

Because of some Bishops in the house of lords decree that the world should shut and therefore her indoors should remain indoors.
You do realise that the shops close to both men and women.

Give it a couple of weeks and everyone will be moaning about the shops being open on Boxing Day and how awful it is for the workers and their families.

Bloody Bishops!

Sorry I think this is rubbish. How can a society be so addicted to shopping that they can't find something else to do.

I'm happy for shops to be shut on Sundays.

I agree. I work 8-6 mon-friday, so once I've the kids sorted with clubs, homework, dinner and making pack lunches etc, I've no more time for groceries/shopping during the week. Saturdays are always taken up by my kids sporting clubs, classmates birthday parties, hairdressers appointments as thats the only day I make them. That only leaves Sunday, which I'd rather use for family days out etc but you're stuck hanging around for the shops to open in the middle of the day which limits what else you can do! Also, back when my kids were little, my exh would have worked during the week, and me at the weekend and 2 evenings a week for extra money wgile saving childcare- being able to work 2 full days at the weekend would have been a massive help condensing the hours into 2 shifts rather than the awkward tight turnaround of 2 evenings waiting for him to get home on time with traffic etc. Same for when I was a student - I had to work 3 evening shifts which put a strain on my studying/sleep as often my prep work was issued on a Monday and due on a Friday so I didn't have the weekend to catch up. A full day Sunday shift would have massively helped spread the shifts better.

I understand those situations are very specific to me, and don't apply across the board. But everyone is different, if you don't want to shop on a Sunday, don't. If you don't want to work a Sunday, work somewhere thay doesn't require Sunday working. But to rule it out and remove the the option for people who it genuinely helps and suits, both in terms of the only time they can shop and the only time they can earn money is ridiculous!

You're not the first person in the thread to have airily suggested this. People are often very attracted to the idea that despite our unemployment rate being the lowest it has for decades, there's a conveniently sized, easily tapped pool of underused labour ready and waiting to be shunted into whatever industry has a shortage of workers. None of them ever tell us how it's actually going to happen, though. They just think removal of benefits magically makes reliable workers with the skills needed, and they'll never need anything like public transport or childcare that might be unavailable early or late on a Sunday.

Nor do they deal with the possibility that such workers, if attempts were made to force them back to work, might well go for other roles instead. Thus still leaving us the problem of how to staff these services people are adamant should exist.

In your case you've not even defined benefits, so we don't know whether you're talking about people on carers allowance, new style JSA, part time workers reliant on top up benefits, pension credit, people on long term sickness benefits or all of the above.

I work in retail. I work Sundays.

I find the 'day off' argument, at best, flawed. They don't force me to work 7 days a week just because one of them is a Sunday. Instead I get to have a day off where I have options to do things like go to the bank or deal with a council office if I need to - but equally I can stay at home and rest or cook myself a roast dinner if I want to. These things don't have to happen on a Sunday.

Also - I get paid more to work on a Sunday.

And as far as people 'missing a day without shopping' - it's not compulsory just because they are open, to actually shop...

But then you could just not go to the shops and have the exactly same experience in your house as if they were closed. Why does it have to be forced on the rest of us?

Right!

Where does that argument end?

I don't want to go to a club after 1am, therefore they should all be shut.

I don't want to use a butcher so they should close.

I don't want to wear high heels so people should stop selling them.

I don't want to go to church on a Sunday so let's close them.

It's nonsense!

@Lopella other than my view about Boxing Day and New Years Day, almost all the comments against changing the law have been about keeping the six hours and not extending it.

@ithinkthatmaybeimdreaming what I meant is evenings and Sundays is when a large amount of people have the time to go to the shops - not Tuesday morning at 10.
People don't "use the High Street" because shops are open when they can't get to them, and closed when they can.
It's all upside down now.
Retail needs to change it's mindset. It wouldn't necessarily be people working extra hours - just working different hours. I remember when I worked in one shop we opened at 8.30 and barely saw any customers for the first few hours. The few that we did were just popping in for a newspaper and didn't buy anything else. But in the after school and after work hours we would be very busy. It was just daft - as soon as our customer base was there ready to shop with money in their hands we would literally be turning them away and locking the doors on people wanting to shop. "Sorry it's 5pm we are closing".
I have no desire to go back to working in retail thanks very much. I did my 20 years that.

I know loads of people whose life is made easier by working Sundays - students, mums when dads are looking after the kids so they avoid childcare etc ... if you want peace and quiet, just don't go shopping. Simples.

@LlynTegid not sure why you quoted me - I was replying to someone who was calling for shops to close completely on Sundays

This exactly. This was me both when I was a student, and when my kids were little.

I'm in Jersey and while some of the big supermarkets now open limited hours on a Sunday, the high street by and large doesn't. A few big UK brands buck the trend (Sports Direct seems perpetually open) but as the footfall is so low in town then the majority simply don't bother.

We all manage fine, and did even before Waitrose was open 10-4.

Same applies across a lot of Europe. There's little in Barcelona or Rome open on a Sunday, although they tend to have much more generous weekday opening hours, to 8pm and beyond often.

@Casperroonie I can find plenty of other things to do than shopping. I actually find it a bore.
But I need to purchase things. You know basic things like food to eat, clothes so we aren't cold and naked, cleaning products......
I am certainly not addicted to shopping. It's a chore.

I live in a country with a blanket ban on sunday trading. Shops can get special exemptions based on location and what they sell and who they target, for example bakeries are allowed to open for a few hours, and souveniet shops can sometime trade in toursit areas. But on the whole it is nice and peaceful. In the run up tp Christmas there are usually two Sundays when shops can open so people can get themselves sorted, and I feel this works well.
I don't see this as a feminist issue at all. Other than that is a bonus for working mothers. Women who work in retail and have kids at least have one less day to worry about child care.

I used to love the chilled atmosphere on a Sunday when there were hardly any shops open. I lived close to the centre of a big town, and the drop in traffic noise on a Sunday was massive. And the pubs had restricted opening hours too - 10 till 2 (2.30 in the next borough, for some reason) and 7-10.30.

Most Sundays, we'd put a roast in the oven and go to the pub, then come back, do the veg and eat a huge dinner with wine and have a snooze. Sometimes we'd drive out to somewhere rural, have a long walk and then have a roast in the evening. They started opening galleries and museums in London on Sundays, then we'd occasionally go to an exhibition.

It was like enforced relaxation, all there was to do was loll about at home, go for walks in the country or parks, although iirc cinemas were open, too. I'd happily go back to that.

Where I live now, apart from the supermarkets, most of the shops are independents and don't open on Sundays. Unless you want to shop in Sea Salt, White Stuff, Waterstones or Next, there's no point in going into town unless you're going to a pub (although on the few occasions I've been in Waterstones on a Sunday, it's always been heaving). Boots and Superdrug are open too, but the one time I needed something from Boots on a Sunday, I couldn't buy it because they don't have a pharmacist on duty.

@Unabletomitigate genuine question....what makes it "peaceful".
Unless you live literally next door to where the shops are why would it make any difference?
I mean it's quarter past 9 now on a Saturday morning. The supermarkets, shopping malls and High Streets are open and probably busy. But it's "peaceful" where I am - because I am at home.

@LakieLady so you enjoyed less traffic noise - but as part of your "chilled" Sunday you would "go for a drive" 🤔

6 hours is fine, smaller shops are open beyond that for those who want to pop in for some milk (as always crops up on these threads). Small businesses tend to shut here on a Sunday because it gives staff some time with their families (employing someone to just work weekends/Sundays isn't always straightforward and there's a lot of HR stuff that often makes it not worthwhile), it also saves a day's worth of electricity etc. The issue is more than there isn't much else affordable to do in some areas than traipse around the shops.

Even in my small town, Tesco is open from 6am to midnight, except for Sundays. That's more than 2/3 of the hours in a week. Would the extra 10 hours of shopping time if Sunday hours matched weekday hours really make a big difference?

Sorry, I have absolutely no idea how that GIF got there. It could be due to the awkwardness of typing while there is a whippet lying half on my lap ...

Not just for a drive, @Needmorelego , but drive out to the North Downs or Ashdown Forest to go for a long country walk.

We’re in Scotland and as pp has pointed out, we don’t have Sunday trading here, not the same as in England at least. It makes it much easier to fit in shopping around other weekend activities before the start of the working week.

Eg nearest large supermarket is open 6am-10pm today and 8am-10pm tomorrow. Dobbies garden centre open from 9am-6pm every day.

Shops here tend to close at 10 here vs 11 in England because of not being able to sell alcohol past 10pm.

I understand the need for retail workers to have rest but just because a shop is open 7 days doesn’t mean the staff will work 7 days? Some might prefer the option of Sunday working. I work a bog standard Mon-Fri in an office and would love to be able to work the odd weekend in exchange for time off in the week. YANBU.