Group work issues at uni - AIBU to not be happy with the lecturer's response?

[groupworkblues]

We have to give a group presentation next week as a group of 6. Two of the members have not been turning up to meetings and ignoring WhatsApp messages and emails sent to their university email address. They will turn up to the occasional meeting, but miss most of them. Most of the time they won't message or give any reason for missing the meeting, or they will let us know during the meeting that they can't attend due to work, a society meeting (where they were doing craft activities, so nothing compulsory) or an appointment they would have know about in advance. They make no attempt to reschedule the meeting or flag to us in advance to ask us to change the date/time.

Their contributions to the presentation has been pretty rubbish. Both aren't really relevant to what was asked of them and they both have misunderstood what was needed (and we've not been able to clarify as they're not in the meetings).

We spoke to the lecturer as our attempts of speaking to them on WhatsApp, email and in person haven't helped. They responded that they were frustrated for us, but if we want a good grade we'll have to just get on with it and do their sections ourselves.

Whereas not contributing and expecting others to carry you is perfectly acceptable? No I think that’s a great idea to let them fail publicly but at least give them the heads up that that what you’ll do so they are given the opportunity to mend their ways in time.

I'm a lecturer. Yes, I would do exactly what you've been advised. I would do the work amongst those of you who are engaged (sorry, it's a hassle that you have to do extra), so that you have a solid presentation. I would continue to let them know when/where you are meeting and keep a record of that (your messages). I would prepare as if you were to present the whole thing between those of you who actually did the presentation. Send them the final set of slides, but not your notes. They can choose to show up or not on the day and they can choose to present or not on the day. You do your bits to the best of your ability, and keep the lecturer updated ahead of the presentation about whether they have participated or not.

It's rubbish, but unfortunately, it's great preparation for the 'real world' because in work, people dick around with showing up to meetings and preparing presentations. It won't be the last time you have to save a presentation on behalf of a group. But unlike in the world of work, you will be assessed individually, so you do your absolute best and let them sink or swim on the day.

Stop flagging things to your manager/lecture and learn how to solve problems for yourself.

Can you kick them out of the group so they have to be their own group? Ask lecturer if that would be allowed.

When this happened to me at Uni, we each presented our own part so we could be assessed on what we presented. It was obvious who the dud was.

If this is a written assessment, use the table of contents to show who authored what so that the shit part is obvious and who didn't contribute.

Don't cover for them, make them stand out.

I think everyone should be made to submit (to the lecturer) the dates of the meetings they attended (or not) and their contributions.

The marks should be awarded accordingly.

It's extremely unfair to award everyone the same mark when certain members have contributed fuck all!

Same in our Uni. We've just submitted a 'proposal' for a study that will be carried out next semester.

Whilst we all carried out the research, design etc as a group, each individual writes up their own. You get elements of lazy-fuckeritus but those who put in the spade work have a more indepth understanding and are marked accordingly.

@Screamingabdabz it's a terrible idea and will reflect very poorly on those members of the group. Fine if you don't believe me but it will.

Totally normal for group work.

i work entirely on a project basis in my career. This does not happen at all. Not the tiniest bit.

People produce quality work or if they are struggling it gets flagged. Employees get actively trained and if they still fail they get managed out.

My department uses the same approach as @Hobbi's.

I’m a lecturer and we do reduce marks for students who haven’t contributed as much to the presentation. This happens every single year without fail, at least one but usually more than one group will have a member who doesn’t turn up to meetings and has a weaker part than the others. Last year I marked one group 76% but had to mark one member 40% because they didn’t get involved with the group at all and turned up on the day, muttered about 5 sentences then walked out.

You should get a feedback form at the end so explain what happened in that and if those two group members haven’t performed as well on the day, they will receive a lower grade.

I despised group projects for this very reason, always at least 1 lazy fucker who couldn't be bothered to do even the bare minimum and expected to be carried through. I don't have a solution if its graded as one as sadly you'll (unfairly) suffer too if you just don't do it

I have a degree and masters. If there was group work you quickly learn to do all of it yourself without complaining to just get through it. If anyone else feels like helping then consider that a bonus. Seriously OP you have to just let it go and do it yourself.

Why would you give a non contributor such a high mark of 40%??

Absolutely par for the course, in my experience, and it is just part of it that you'll need to cover their areas.

One of the groups my husband was in had three people who did fuck all; and when they reported that to a lecturer, was told their marks might be reduced for "failing to manage the situation" 🥴

You might need to 'pass' at 40 just, as repeating the assignment isn't an option. It also depends on the weighting of the coursework. I'm disinclined to give makes of under 30 to people for assessments that are worth 20-30% of a module because it can mean they have no hope of regaining a pass for the full module even if they do really well in a second different assessment.

I'm with the lecturer.

I don't think I have ever seen a CV without a claim that they work well in a team. Well I've discovered today that many people lack this most basic of workplace skills.

Very common, happened in my university too. Many arguments, bitching and conflict. The tutors mainly stayed out of it as "how would you act in real world."

Nothing to add other than its infuriating.

But I can top the whole group work thing with a voluntary 2 week work placement that would look great in your assessment portfolio & on the cv. (Creative industries)
On day one 10 students arrive, 8 ot them are busy staging shots of doing the work. Especially the more fancy bits- some where actually quite rude!
Day two only 6 arrive, 4 busy staging shots, getting better pictures as not as crowded, but less work done!
Day 3 only 2 remain for the duration of the project and are actually doing the set work tasks...

These group tasks are often given to see how you negotiate issues within the group, so that's likely why your tutor did not intervene. You can either complete to project with the members you have available, or have further discussions with other group members and try to involve them more in the project. I assume you will each have to do an individual write-up and reflections statements for the project as part of your assessment and that's where everything will come out in a wash.

Surely that should be on them if they have contributed fuck all to the group?

The problem at many institutions is that people know they won't be failed on group projects. They're essentially guaranteed a free ride so there is little incentive for them to contribute.

I think it's pretty lazy practice on behalf of the academics tbh. If you're going to assign group projects, you should design them to be fair and you should have the balls to mark people down if they don't contribute.

Seeing how you manage shitty group members is part of the assessment. I assume you'll have to write some kind of reflection on the process? Remember forming, storming and norming? This is your storming process. Focus on the task at hand and get it done. Tear them to pieces in your reflection 😁

But surely failing are the consequences of not doing the work? And if they don't learn it at uni, where will they? Is it fair that we then have to manage the very same issues in the workplace where a graduate shows up expecting to "get a pass" for not actually doing very much at all?

I've been through this too and so has pretty much everyone I met at uni! Unfortunately the only thing we could do was to split up the presentation and then all do our own slides/speaking so that it was obvious who hadn't done anything but the rest of us would still pass. I know that's not always possible though, was lucky to have lecturers who marked us separately

I did a groupwork assignment where the lecturer said that he would mark out of 60, and that would be divided amongst us equally unless we let him know that we'd like it divided differently. I was ill for the first two weeks, and considered ducking out altogether and letting the others have the marks.

Working in and managed group work is part of your education. It’s not good when group members don’t contribute but how the rest of the group rise to the challenge of dealing with this is important and develops transferable skills.
good luck!