German debt headache

[CaptainJ]

Afternoon all,
I've been happily paying off a Postbank loan (German bank) for over 2 years. I took it out whilst I lived in Germany. I had to recently close my SPARKASSE (German bank account) that was paying the loan off as I no longer live in Germany (living back in Scotland). Post bank are kinda on special measures (BaFin - regulators are overseeing them right now because of really high complaints).

At the start of the month, I reached out via 20+ emails to all email addresses possible (including the contacts in my agreement), I've written letters and called (they have no customer support for non German speakers - in fact even if you are German speaking you will likely not get far based on the reviews).

All I wanted to do is set up a new standing order to continue paying the final months (I owe a total of 2900 euros and pay 380 back each month). I've sent faxes as requested, only to be told that actually they no longer have fax service. The only way to communicate with the bank is via letter, but after my recent letters not being responded to (change of address notification), I am not convinced I am going to receive the information I need to make my next monthly payment (first of each month).

I am logging a complaint with BaFin because of the amount of incorrect information I have received and poor customer care which has meant I feel unable to continue my obligations as set out in the agreement.

x5 fax attempts (£10.00)
Buying a German pal lunch so they could call (£10.00) (only to be told to fax)
x20 emails to different emails (some of them are now unresponsive)
x2 letters already unresponded to

The only way I am getting a response is via Trust Pilot (JAY reviews https://de.trustpilot.com/review/www.postbank.de)

AIBU to just throw this debt to the wind and if they come chasing for it in court to evidence the extent that I went to to uphold my side of the agreement? I'm keeping all of my evidence of effort and I've never in the 2 years been late on a payment.

I don't actually know if German debt is enforceable in Scotland but I believe I have good grounds. I also have never been in this situations so glad for any input / thoughts before I make a decision.

With many thanks in advance!

OP

I would continue complaining to BaFin, or is there an Ombudsman type thing as well?
(Maybe BaFin is both, I'm only aware of them being a prudential regulator.)

Otherwise these things have a way of following you around...

You may have tried this as you mentioned 20 emails, but if not, I'd look up on LinkedIn whoever is working for Postbank and email them all together (in one email).

linkedin, look for the ceo and email them. It’s not much money to pay back and would be rubbish if this held you back in applying for credit at a later date or for a visa etc.

Id put the money each month into a separate savings account to show that you ‘made the payments’ and kept the cash for them.

Postbank is owned by Deutsche Bank so perhaps you should contact Deutsche Bank instead?
I'd give that a go-speak to someone at Deutsche Bank based in the UK, as that'd at least help with any language barrier

Thank you for your replies everyone

@SeulementUneFois following me around is what I am concerned about - it's maybe worth just heading over to Germany and dealing with them in person.

@MrMucker helpful suggestion - thank you. I might try this alongside a gorilla email approach via Linkedin as suggested by @fruitbrewhaha and @SeulementUneFois didn't think about setting the repayments aside - that's a good idea to show that I am not 'winning' from not not fulfilling my responsibility.

Thanks again all.

Is the loan account IBAN not showing on an old Sparkasse statement?
You might have more luck contacting them for information.

Could you not just do a direct transfer into the account? A bit more of a faff than setting up a standing order, but not much.

I would be glad to do that but my issue is I do not know what the reference number should be. I've asked for clarity on this - I really dont want the risk of paying and it not be referenced to me as the borrower. I will go back to the postbank review site though and ask for them to email me the reference if they can. Doing everything by international post is impractical.
Thank you for your suggestion.

I'd just fuck them off. What are they going to do about it anyway? They can't take you to court in the UK. Chasing you would be throwing good money after bad.

Not sure Mumsnet can answer this. Do you know the forum Toytown Germany? Maybe they can help?

But I would be careful, I live in Switzerland and I know if you apply for certain jobs, they are able to search for your debts in other jurisdictions. My impression is that countries like Germany, Switzerland, Austria take "debt registers" a lot more seriously than the UK.

This is a really annoying situation. You clearly want them to take your money and are trying to do the right thing! Just to say, German debt is absolutely enforceable in the UK. They can apply to a British court for enforcement. Whether they'd bother over such a comparatively small sum is another point but I definitely wouldn't just assume that you're safe because you're out of the country. Otherwise everyone would simply take on debts abroad and hide out in the UK.
I think keeping record of all the emails and letters you've sent will already be helpful to show that you tried. And that you contacted BaFin might be very helpful. They do have an official complaints procedure with a postal address listed on this website. I know you said you don't speak/write German - maybe just throw something together using Deepl and get it checked by someone else online? The website I linked also suggests you can contact the "Ombudsmann der privaten Banken" (ombudsman of private banks) via email. Maybe write them asking if they'd accept a complaint in English?

Either way, I completely understand how frustrating this must be. I once tried to contact Thames Water for almost 2 years to please let me set up an account so I could pay my bills. It felt ridiculous - they wanted my money after all. But unfortunately just ignoring it and hoping it'll go away tends to come back to bite us, even when we're kind of in the right.

How did you live in Germany, and also manage to take a loan out with a German bank if you didn't speak any German??

Surely you must know some?

YABU to expect a German bank based in Germany to have customer support for non German speakers. Why would they?

I ended up owing some money in Germany (long boring story), which I didn't agree that I owed so I just didn't pay. That was about six years ago now and nothing happened. I believe a pp is right in that technically they can apply to a British Court to get the money but I doubt they would. If you've kept all your evidence then I don't see what you really have to worry about.

@BaronessBomburst thank you for your post - I know the recipient details etc. It's just my mandate / reference number that I do not know. But I've taken my last action today...

@penjil Working for a university - Academia mostly English first. During covid time it's not so easy picking up a new language in a lockdown. PLUS - Postbank don't have the best customer care for natives - but I think, if you are to offer services to internationals (i.e. students etc) you really should have non German speaking provision.

@EmpressSoleil thank you for your reply. I'm taking a leaf out of the earlier comment and will set the money into the account that I've asked to be debited and leave it for a period of time. For anyone else interested in different currency accounts WISE is +++

@hibiscuswool Thank you for your reply and links. It is frustrating - time and cost of fax and postal... but given what could happen (i.e. court) I'm going to take the option of documenting and saving my receipts and continuing with the BaFin complaint. I need to look into the Ob' - thank you for your suggestion on this. Thames Water after 2 years - That's Annoying! Companies should be more accountable for the emotional labour of inept customer care....

I've gone ahead and written again to them and sent documents using the Parcel Force £30.00 3 day delivery service + signature.
🚩 Photos, emails and receipts saved.
🚩Complaint to BaFin
🚩 Ombudsman
🚩Deposit as per in different account

Thank you all for your thoughts and sharing your own experiences.