Reading in school year 4

[Itsmyshadow]

Wondering if IABU to be annoyed at this but I have no knowledge of what happens in other state schools so it might be the norm.

DD is in year 4. She is doing well and meeting expectations in all areas. There are a number of children in her class who are behind or very behind with their reading (and I’m guessing in other areas).

Teacher is on her own with no TA. Year 4 is the only year in her school without a TA. I’m guessing they must be the cohort of least need in a climate of budget cuts.

DD seems to spend a ridiculous amount of time in the school day sitting reading to herself. She says they have 4 sessions of independent reading each day totalling 1.5 hours (the 1.5 hour bit might be wrong, but she won’t be mistaken about the 4 sessions). DD says in this time the teacher is preparing for the next lesson. When I probed a bit more she said she is also listening to children who are struggling with reading read in this time. DD has not read to her teacher yet this year.

DD is reading one Harry Potter book per week. Either she is spending a ridiculous amount of time reading in class or she’s skim reading it and not taking it in (I suspect both). I think there is peer pressure amongst the better readers to compete with each other to finish first.

I feel because DD is meeting expectations (not exceeding, she was in EY and Year 1 but has since dropped back, perhaps because she is seen as doing fine and so not given any focus) that she’s getting a raw deal. Why is the teacher spending time reading 121 with a few children leaving the rest to sit and just read to themselves? DD could do that at home. In fact when she does read at home it highlights the fact there are lots of words in the book she is misreading, and she’s not going to learn these words spending hours reading independently at school.

Is this the norm for year 4?

Probably because those few children are behind with their reading and clearly your daughter isnt?

As a primary school teacher, I can assure you that independent reading isn't unusual. Are you certain it's 4 times a day though as this does seem excessive (unless of course it's shorts bursts). It's important that you encourage your child to stop competing with her reading; at this stage the emphasis really should be on reading comprehension so I'd be surprised if the teacher hasn't planned opportunities to deepen this skill through follow up activities/questions. And of course the teacher will prioritise reading with the children who are behind ARE. There really isn't enough time in the day to read 1:1 with all children in KS2, especially since they don't have a TA.

At our secondary school they have one hour a week timetabled for accelerated reader plus each lesson starts with 5 mins independent reading. So I don’t think it is that unusual?

I think the concerning thing here is that the teacher is prepping in class when the kids are there - not the amount of reading!! ( I wouldn’t go to a meeting and make everyone wait for me to start as I prepped for example - this isn’t about teaching)

Thank you. Yes I’m sure it’s 4 times per day (first thing, after morning break, after lunch, end of the day). DD hasn’t said she’s competing however she has a very competitive nature and tends to like rushing and finishing first (something we have been working on trying to stop for a while).

My worry this is wasted time is exactly to your point that I don’t think she is understanding what she is reading. She’s just reading the words and not discussing what she has read with anyone. Shouldn’t the better readers be using this time to read a set text in a group and discussing it between themselves?

I completely get that my DD should not be taking up a teacher’s time 121 reading, however I don’t feel anyone else should at the expense of everyone else in the class. It doesn’t feel like the small benefit to each individual child is worth the 29 others being left to read (or not) on their own. Shouldn’t the school be getting in some parent helpers or borrowing the TA from another class for 30 minutes per day to do this 121 reading?

I think the concerning thing here is that the teacher is prepping in class when the kids are there - not the amount of reading!! ( I wouldn’t go to a meeting and make everyone wait for me to start as I prepped for example - this isn’t about teaching)

Yes exactly, she should have done this the evening before or during break time or lunch time (and before anyone says it, most people in most professions work through lunch in my experience).

I don't think an hour an a half's reading is a waste of time at all (although I'd be surprised if it's actually that long). Supply your dd with a wide variety of reading material and talk to her about what she's read.

I think it's quite common that every child doesn't read to the teacher. My DD is in year 4 and independently reads at school every day but also they have volunteers that go in so she reads to an adult once a week.
She's a very good reader though so I am not concerned. It makes more sense for the teachers time to be spent with those struggling to read.
Reading is so important and unfortunately there are a lot of children who are not given the support at home. I remember DD's year 2 teacher saying to me that as a teacher he can tell almost innediately which children have been read to and exposed to reading at home versus those children that haven't. It is so sad.

@Itsmyshadow, if it's used as a transitional tool, which it sounds like it is, I'd be very suprused if each burst of reading lasts more than 5-10 minutes. There should absolutely be planned reading sessions, with a shared text, where children are expected to demonstrate an understanding of what they've read through planned tasks (verbal discussions or questions etc.) but reading for pleasure is also important, too.

Reading with children who are behind ARE is not at the expense of anyone else. The teacher is going to be unable to close the gap between learners if they don't focus their attention on them individually (or in small focus groups). You need to adjust your thinking here; rather than believing your child somehow missing out, frame it to see that the other children are being afforded time to catch up.

In regards to the preparation thing, it's highly unlikely that the teacher is planning or resourcing the next lesson in this time and will be using their own time to do this. It's more probable that they are setting up the lesson presentation, writing the learning intention on the board or organising the resources and books to be given out for the lesson.

Do you have a parents' evening coming up? If not, I suggest you organise a meeting with the teacher to express your concerns.

In regards to the preparation thing, it's highly unlikely that the teacher is planning or resourcing the next lesson in this time and will be using their own time to do this. It's more probable that they are setting up the lesson presentation, writing the learning intention on the board or organising the resources and books to be given out for the lesson.

Thank you for the clarity. I’m sure this is exactly what she is doing. And I do appreciate the need to try to bring everyone up to target but the benefit of the individual and everyone. I just feel the reading with them individually could be done in a better way e.g. could everyone else be organised into reading and discussion groups or could someone else read 121 and not the teacher.

As it currently is it’s putting DD off reading. So no longer wants to read anything at home as she’s reading “for hours” at school.

Do they have parent volunteer readers in your school? To work with those who need extra help with reading?

If not, I'd work with the PA and the school to see if this can be set up ASAP.

I'd also want to know why your class doesn't have a TA as this is going to be a challenge all year. Are they currently hiring:? Is someone on long term sick?

Hmm.

I wonder if this is a new school policy - that students do 5 mins (or other amt of time) of jndependent reading at particular points in the day.

It doesn't sound like it's a reading/English lesson, more like it's about getting students reading independently and seeing that they are.

Might be worth asking school?

If so, the teacher may be under instructions not to do anything other than reading.

When my school did similar I was told to keep an eye on the students but also read my own book to be a good role model.

Offer your services to hear children read.
Go in once every week, join the volunteer group and complete a Working with Children ticket.
The kids will benefit so much if their teacher can ask every child to read to a parent while she stays teaching.

One and a half hours of free reading seems excessive.
Could you suggest a group book - with each child and the teacher taking a turn to read aloud as a variation to the quiet reading for one of the days?

It's always amazing to me how many non teaching parents are so sure they could organize a class better than the teachers.

By year 4, most children will be capable readers, and if the OP'' child was one of the children who were behind, she would be complaining if the teacher listened to the good readers at the expense of her child.

I just feel the reading with them individually could be done in a better way e.g. could everyone else be organised into reading and discussion groups

It's a classroom, not a local book club. Children of that age won't 'read and discuss' books on their own.

The very good suggestion has been made that you volunteer to hear readers. But if you do, don't be surprised if you are asked to listen to the younger children and not those in your daughter's class.

Teacher is on her own with no TA. Year 4 is the only year in her school without a TA. I’m guessing they must be the cohort of least need in a climate of budget cuts.

As a rule I'm hearing that yr4 is one of the world effected cohorts still in primary due to covid (though this varies slightly from school to school).

I feel because DD is meeting expectations (not exceeding, she was in EY and Year 1 but has since dropped back, perhaps because she is seen as doing fine and so not given any focus) that she’s getting a raw deal. Why is the teacher spending time reading 121 with a few children leaving the rest to sit and just read to themselves? DD could do that at home. In fact when she does read at home it highlights the fact there are lots of words in the book she is misreading, and she’s not going to learn these words spending hours reading independently at school.

Is this the norm for year 4?

In terms of reading, if she is reading Harry Potter, there isn't really any benefit to your daughter doing 121 reading time with the teacher. She is at a level that is expected for the end of primary even if she is termed 'meeting expectations'. There is also a certain amount of you failing to take on the responsibility (which you should). If the teacher is doing this much 121 on reading, and isn't doing it for the whole class, it will be because it is necessary.

You need to remember here that, if kids reading is below expectations they will be struggling to do EVERY subject because its so crucial to everything else. If the other kids in the class can't do that, that has an indirect impact on your daughter too.

HOWEVER this isn't normal and its a poor use of the teachers time. As others say, this is where parent volunteers helping with reading would be a godsend to all concerned - our school has this and I don't think its unusual.

The issue is the lack of TA full stop and your daughters class is the one thats drawn the short straw this year - and that will almost certainly be due to need. That means other classes in the school are going to be a lot more fucked, which you may want to reflect on as part of your concerns.

In the school I volunteered in they did Accelerated Reader which meant when a child finishes a book they go onto a computer and it asks them questions about the book. Lots of children can read but they need to be able to comprehend what they have read. In that school they had 30 minutes per day for AR and both a teacher, TA and me when the TA didn't work a particular day a week, so always 2 adults. It meant each child was listened to by either a teacher or TA/me every week and then the next week they were listed to by the other one. However, children who qualify for Pupil Premium are listened to twice a week, not once.

After registration children would work on any corrections from yesterday's work if they didn't have any or finished them then they would read. Sometimes if a task finishes early they read too. Covid had a massive impact on so many children's education. Schools are scrambling to keep up.

Reading has so many benefits, it improves their language skills, their ideas as they can "magpie" steal words, story lines or character descriptions. Reading aloud is a skill that shows their ability to understand what cadence they should use, note punctuation, look at how sentences start like fronted adverbials and use it to make their own writing more interesting. Also better choices of words rather than small, big, loud etc.

Re Harry Potter you can ask her questions. There are lots of things that go over their heads when they read books and don't discuss them. This is where you as a parent can help her. Questions we would ask, what is this book about? Can you tell me what has happened so far? How do you think Harry/Ron/George feels about X, why do you think that? What do you think might happen next? Identify words and ask her what they mean.

I would also question how there is so much time available to be able to read in school, lessons are pretty full content wise.