Disruptive kids in class

[Strangerfings1]

My DC year 4 hates school and it's because of the behaviour or a few kids in their class. At the end of year 2 the classes in the year were mixed. I think because all the "naughty" kids were in the same form. Now we have a bunch of disruptive kids, including 1 with SN who sometimes gets violent when he's wound up (which another kid Seems to enjoy doing) a couple who are sort of easily distracted and get "sucked in" to playing up and 1 particular child who's behaviour is frankly a nightmare. Now I assume this child has difficulties of some sort so this isn't a blame thing but is there anything I can ask the school to do? Some examples of the behaviour of this child include hitting / attacking other children (even in the classroom!) Getting up, shouting and running around, throwing things and he even ripped all the pages out of the books in the library corner. The whole class regularly miss break time as a punishment, often miss PE due to the threat of fighting in say, football, and end up not really doing any schoolwork because the teacher is having to deal with urgent behaviour issues.
Lots of the other children are either frightened, bored or just resentful for being punished for the behaviour of a few. And I really worry that they're falling behind because they can't get work done.
Is there anything I can ask the school to do, or is it just put up or try and move schools?
Thank you.

Well, when it comes to PE, I don't blame the teacher for not wanting to take very unruly children out for a PE lesson. I once had a child throw a hockey stick halfway across the playground because he lost at a game.
It's a safety concern isn't it?

Management need to be stepping in or putting in an extra member of staff so PE can happen.

This.

Primary teacher here; I've called in sick today as I'm full of the cold. In previous years I'd have dosed up on ibuprofen and gotten on with things. Can't do it anymore due to having a huge class with excessive behavioural and learning needs, and very little support. I fo feel so, so sorry for the children who are all being let down.

@Macaroni46 I don't blame you for leaving in that situation.
I've got a class like that coming up next year and I've already started planning my escape!

It's a pretty shit school if it's policy to stop kids being able to blow off steam, that's the opposite of what they should be doing. If they're doing this they are probably not erm "up to date" on other methods too, ive never heard of 8 yos being kept in at break. Teacher must be mad!

If they are highly disruptive in class then they may also be disruptive in PE - this may involve more dangerous disruption (eg throwing PE equipment) and be even harder to manage over a larger (potentially outside) area.

@JanewaysBun or desperate.

Keep.everything about your child ,they won't be able to.discuss another child's behaviour with you but you can discuss how the behaviour of some children impact impact , your child.

It depends how you define 'blow off steam' and if the disruptive kids do this in an even more disruptive manner (eg throwing PE equipment or running about uncontrollably in a larger area).

Ok to clarify things a bit, they don't miss their whole break. They miss 10 mins so still get 5. My DH is really angry about this because it isn't fair on the kids who were behaving well. PE is a safety thing. They only miss it when they were due to play team sports, and there has been aggressive behaviour earlier in the day.

@bobotothegogo I hope you feel better soon. The whole set up in most schools just sounds so draining, even when you don't feel ill, so I don't blame you for taking time off when you are under the weather!

It's the lack of education that worries me the most. It's like everyone has to focus on keeping everyone safe and there isn't time for learning

Sadly this is an issue in most schools as there are not enough places in SEN schools and the government / LA are actually trying to make it harder for people to access these places so I cannot see it changing anytime soon.

Even if you bring up behaviour of others to the teacher I cannot see it doing much, if they are understaffed and overwhelmed then they probably cannot change that. All class punishments are unfair though, intact I'm quite disgusted by it, most SEN or 'disruptive' kids need a movement break to regulate so it will likely make behaviour worse. It also causes resentment towards that child which could lead to bullying and then, again, bad behaviour.

I'm sorry I don't have any real advice, changing schools would probably be the only way to guarantee a change.

This is a really tough situation and one I find myself in regularly as a primary teacher.

Please speak to the head teacher and raise your concerns. The class teacher will pass on everything you’ve said but sometimes it gets dismissed if it’s mentioned to the class teacher. As you’ve said, she is probably overwhelmed and doing everything she can already.
The head teacher most likely won’t move anyone now but anytime anything happens I’d complain so they know. The head teacher will only discuss what they will do for your child and probably wont discuss any punishments with you.
Taking breaks away doesn’t work, the children are entitled to a break so will just sit inside and play. Can’t stop them doing pe either as it’s still a vital part of the curriculum.

This is a management issue but there’s sadly not enough money to provide a ta to every class. They will be limited with their budget and will be told the children who need one.
Moving school is an option but I know lots of schools in the same situation and lots of teachers going sick because of it.

i would arrange for a meeting with the head but I’d also be looking for other schools with spaces. What a miserable school life for your child.

Moving schools will not solve issues- this is run of the mill for most primaries at the moment.

It seems to get somewhat better at a good, large secondary where they can separate out the children more.

You could be doing the teacher a massive favour by going to the HT. They clearly need support and are probably being told there’s no money. Nothing will change whilst parents accept it.

If you could get a few more parents in board and go en masse with a list/spokesperson that will strengthen your case.

If no joy with the Head, go to Governors. Things can and should be improved ~ times are hard but at the least, the disruptive kids can sit outside the head’s office during PE or break. If you do nothing, nothing will change.

Moving schools is complicated as well as I have twins in the class. Didn't mention that but BC I worry about being identified (although I think it's unlikely from what I've said here!) So I'd need a school with 2 spaces.

My son had most of his primary time disrupted by these issues, but at secondary it was much better (still a few issues with different people, but not constant). Now he's higher up the school most of them are not in his class/have left, so it's not really a concern. I don't know what some of them are up to, but I do know a couple of them have apprenticeships/college and are actually doing ok/well, which reinforces my belief that it wasn't inability to learn but more the wrong learning environment/support for them.

Just complain. It is unreasonable to have class punishment. The disruptive child can have the punishment and perhaps enough of this conduct and it will help them to get better help. SEN may be a factor, or simply the child had crappy parenting or indeed both. It's your child's education and class punishment is totally unreasonable. I would still look at other schools

I can't band up.with other parents. That feels awful, like bullying the kid with issues or their family :(

Your child gets one crack at this. One go. Think carefully if you don't do this. Who suffers in the end? It's your child and other children.

Is this a school in the UK? They can't miss PE as a punishment. It's part of the curriculum!

I don't think getting other parents on board with this is bullying of the child. You need to go at it from the "what can be done for OUR children who are missing out on their education " perspective rather than "what is being done about this child". As another poster said, you going to the HT may be just what the teacher hopes someone does. Having a disruptive class with no TA is hell on Earth. How is a teacher supposed to cope in those circumstances?

What do you think is going to happen though? The school cannot magically fund more support staff. Something would be happening to improve things if it was possible.

By complaining you might help the child in need get help which will benefit everyone.