National insurance contributions/pension entitlement when living abroad for work

[Happinessislikeabutterfly]

Sorry putting here for traffic not really AIBU just a question.

Hoping some mumsnettters can shed some light onto my hypothetical question please.

Person A - UK Citizen lived and worked in UK until age 30. Now lives in Europe. Paid approx. £907 per year to UK National Insurance contributions since leaving.

Currently works full time in Europe and contributing to their social security system (state pension element).

If person A continues to pay National Insurance contributions and reaches 35 years of paying in, will they receive both a full state pension from the UK and potentially another full state pension from the country they are currently living in and contributing to now? Thanks

No idea on your specific question, but when you apply for your UK state pension, one of the (surprisingly few) questions is " Have you ever lived abroad?

They would need to check the rules of the country they have moved to. Which country is it? If they meet the rules for that country they will be entitled to one.

Thanks. It’s Switzerland.

That works out really well then if you can receive 2 state pensions - potentially full amount for UK if they continue to pay to reach the 35 years total contribution.

So, if you can continue paying £907 per year to the UK it’s certainly not a bad return when you think about it.
Invest £907 for 25 years (the remainder that’s left as already has 10 years contributions from when working in UK) total £22,675 (£907 x 25), gives you a return of £10,000 odd at current pension rate.

I suppose that’s another great benefit of moving abroad and continuing NI contribution. No other pension will give you that return.

Yes, you can but you need to fully understand the required for a Swiss pension ( minimum years required to contribute, etc).

Both countries are seen as separate entities as long as you have the minimum amount of years paid in ( this differs for each country). So, for example if you worked in Sweden for two years you wouldn’t qualify for a Swedish pension as the minimum number of years to qualify for a pension is 3 years in Sweden. This requirement changes for each country - Belgium, for example has zero years requirement, I think.

EU and UK are now separate so that’s why you can pay into 2 systems at once. You couldn’t say, work and pay in in France and then pay voluntary contributions in Germany as they are both EU.

If you don’t have enough years, your contributions will be combined with the country you do have the minimum requirements for.

I would check with the DWP

https://ec.europa.eu/social/main.jsp?catId=860&langId=en

@OccupantofInterplanetaryCraft
Thanks for the detail, that makes it a lot clearer. Will look into the Swiss pension in more detail. Thanks

No worries. It’s not straightforward 🙂

Watching with interest from Canada

You can do a simulation on line to determine how many years you have contributed, and how many years that you need to keep contributing for

Yes and I think you can contribute UK contributions from Canada too as they are separate systems @coxesorangepippin

Yes, it is certainly possible. Husband and I worked in Switzerland for nearly 20 years and paid Swiss contributions. We both receive Swiss state pension and have also paid our UK NI contributions. He gets full UK pension and I shall when I hit the UK state pension age. State pension age is lower in Switzerland.

Definitely worth paying NI contributions for UK pension while abroad. We were able to pay the cheaper rate as we were working abroad.

Thanks for replying.

Gosh I can’t believe that by paying in so little to UK National insurance contributions over the years, whilst living and in working in Switzerland, that you will receive a full state pension from the UK and additionally you can receive a pension from Switzerland should you have paid in enough there too.

That is a sound investment that’s for sure😊

@Cyclistmumgrandma

So, if you worked for Ann eu employer in an eu country, you can pay indefinite amounts into your uk pension as voluntary contributions?

This is what I am unsure of - I know you can pay reduced contributions but is that only if you are going to be away for less than 2 years and are employed by a UK employer or could you be employed by a UK employer, but pay into the EU system and still qualify to pay reduced contributions back to UK for say, 15 years?🤔

i was told many years ago when working in the US for 3 years, that if I had not made sufficient years contributions to the UK scheme, they would then look at the US contributions. "Luckily" for me I have now made enough contributions so I am expecting when I retire that the US contributions will simply be ignored.

Now what to do about the ridiculously small US pension lump sum that I can only bring back here if I provide the limb of my 1st born and other such nonsense. Seriously thinking about forgetting about that one too!

I think they call them class 3 or voluntary contributions paid into GB system while abroad